Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Saturday July 4, 2015
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Motorsports

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-19-2012, 03:41 AM   #26
Counterfit
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 124254
Join Date: Aug 2006
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Rhode Island
Vehicle:
2006 06 SGM Slowbaru
"The Scoobinator"

Default

Man that Porsche driver is a tool. That's a great spot for a car in a faster class to get by.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Counterfit is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 03-04-2013, 12:24 PM   #27
torquemada
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 128484
Join Date: Oct 2006
Chapter/Region: International
Location: Germany
Vehicle:
2006 EDM WRX STI
WRB

Default

torquemada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 12:31 PM   #28
delongedoug
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 124113
Join Date: Aug 2006
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: To infinity
Vehicle:
and beyond!

Default

Meh, better in black.
delongedoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 12:55 PM   #29
torquemada
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 128484
Join Date: Oct 2006
Chapter/Region: International
Location: Germany
Vehicle:
2006 EDM WRX STI
WRB

Default

Quote:
Following Tuesday’s SPEED.com exclusive, revealing Don Panoz’s plans to expand the DeltaWing program to new chassis and engine options, Nissan has confirmed that it will not continue its partnership with the revolutionary program, with immediate effect.

The Japanese manufacturer proved to be an instrumental player in the debut of the Ben Bowlby-designed car, which ran unclassified, but aligned to the P2 class, at the 24 Hours of Le Mans and Petit Le Mans last year.

Drivers Gunnar Jeannette and Nissan GT Academy graduate Lucas Ordonez drove the Nissan DeltaWing to a fifth place overall finish in the 1,000-mile, 10-hour Road Atlanta enduro, utilizing Nissan’s 1.6-liter DIG-T engine, developed by its partner, RML.

“The Nissan DeltaWing was an exciting project that challenged all conventional thinking and that is why Nissan put its support behind it,” said Darren Cox, director of global motorsports for Nissan. “We are committed to developing innovative and exciting cars both on the track and on the road.

“Nissan wishes Dr. Don Panoz and all the other partners involved in the DeltaWing all the best for the future and we look forward to supporting their progress from the sidelines at future races.”

Panoz confirmed to SPEED.com’s Marshall Pruett that work is underway to install a new 1.9-liter twin-turbo engine, derived from Mazda’s MZR powerplant, in the DeltaWing for next month’s Twelve Hours of Sebring.

A closed-top model of the car is set to debut in the ALMS round at Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca in May.

Three new DeltaWings are in production, as part of a program that will also not involve the car's designer Bowlby or Dan Gurney's AAR, which constructed the original chassis.
http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...eltawing-exit/
torquemada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 01:06 PM   #30
TubeDriver
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14987
Join Date: Feb 2002
Chapter/Region: International
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by falcongsr View Post
he got his left wheels out beyond the track limits and lost control.

or it is another rich retired doctor that shouldn't be out there.

or both.
Ding, ding ding. Pretty close guess: another rich, old CEO with 2 years of racing experience.
TubeDriver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 01:42 PM   #31
FjStix
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 289425
Join Date: Jul 2011
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: MD
Default

Poop Car........... I have disliked this thing from the beginning. Won't last the season
FjStix is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 01:45 PM   #32
Jay911
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 50002
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: N50°59' W114°30'
Vehicle:
2013 red Raptor

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by delongedoug View Post
Meh, better in black.
Maybe they think with a bright reflective body less cars will ram it off the track.
Jay911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 02:55 PM   #33
kfoote
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 39180
Join Date: Jul 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Trying to get :unamused: on TV
Vehicle:
2004 WRB STi
Slash Ten - FBHIC

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TubeDriver View Post
Ding, ding ding. Pretty close guess: another rich, old CEO with 2 years of racing experience.
...who has been asked to not return to ALMS this year.

The Delta Wing does fit right in with the new P2-DP proposed class for the merged Grand-Am ALMS series next year, and with Panoz behind it, it does have a future.
kfoote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 03:54 PM   #34
FjStix
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 289425
Join Date: Jul 2011
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: MD
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kfoote View Post
...who has been asked to not return to ALMS this year.

The Delta Wing does fit right in with the new P2-DP proposed class for the merged Grand-Am ALMS series next year, and with Panoz behind it, it does have a future.

I disagree with it having a future.


Dan
FjStix is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 06:35 PM   #35
07LegacyGT
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 155111
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Westchester, NY
Vehicle:
2011 WRX
Silver

Default

i think this car is used as a car to showcase new technology and that is what prototype racing is all about. So it does have a place i think.
07LegacyGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 09:30 PM   #36
SoapBox
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 204578
Join Date: Mar 2009
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Philadelphia
Vehicle:
S54 E46, N54 E82,
N55 E84, AKA REX8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FjStix View Post
Poop Car........... I have disliked this thing from the beginning. Won't last the season
Please, don't spare us any of the rational basis for your dislike...stick to words like "Poop".

Completely altering the perception of what will work and what won't? How poopy.
SoapBox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 10:11 PM   #37
rjrutzky
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 30367
Join Date: Nov 2002
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: nashville, tn
Vehicle:
2005 Legacy GT
NASA SE PTB Champ

Default

I saw it run at Road Atlanta. It was an amazing engineering feat imo. The front tires were ridiculous small
rjrutzky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2013, 10:59 AM   #38
torquemada
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 128484
Join Date: Oct 2006
Chapter/Region: International
Location: Germany
Vehicle:
2006 EDM WRX STI
WRB

Default

10 minutes into a 12 hour race, and itīs broken
torquemada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2013, 12:13 AM   #39
Draken
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 16
Join Date: Jun 1999
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: Chico, CA
Vehicle:
1968 Saab
Sonett II V4

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rjrutzky View Post
I saw it run at Road Atlanta. It was an amazing engineering feat imo. The front tires were ridiculous small
Same size as we run on a Formula Vee.
Draken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2013, 09:18 AM   #40
FjStix
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 289425
Join Date: Jul 2011
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: MD
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoapBox View Post
Please, don't spare us any of the rational basis for your dislike...stick to words like "Poop".

Completely altering the perception of what will work and what won't? How poopy.
"10 minutes into a 12 hour race, and itīs broken"

We could start here soapbox if you want. Unless you want to give me your expert analysis first.
FjStix is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2013, 08:02 PM   #41
dburgoon
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 310366
Join Date: Feb 2012
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Ft Myers, FL
Vehicle:
03 vf37'd WRB
Bugeye

Default

It was running some respectable times this weekend at the 12 hour, until it caught on fire. It definitely a different car, and hope it can make it, but definitely not in the P1 class.
dburgoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2013, 09:26 PM   #42
falcongsr
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 305831
Join Date: Jan 2012
Default

The whole secret to this sham is that they're letting the car run waaay lighter than everything else on track. That's where all the 'efficiency' gains are coming from. Having the front wheels so close together does what exactly to the frontal area/drag coefficient when the rear is just as wide as any other car? Having the front tires so close together is a suspension designer's nightmare (rear end has to run stiff anti-roll bars to combat all the body roll since the front is too narrow to do anything). The Delta Wing configuration looks comic-book futuristic and is a stroke of marketing genius. It draws in 12 year olds and fans of the Batmobile, but I don't see any new and interesting tech in this thing. Why did the guys with the original idea for this thing walk away from it?

That being said, I'm looking forward to seeing it @ ALMS Laguna Seca in May.

Last edited by falcongsr; 03-18-2013 at 09:32 PM.
falcongsr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 08:35 AM   #43
SoapBox
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 204578
Join Date: Mar 2009
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Philadelphia
Vehicle:
S54 E46, N54 E82,
N55 E84, AKA REX8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FjStix View Post
"10 minutes into a 12 hour race, and itīs broken"

We could start here soapbox if you want. Unless you want to give me your expert analysis first.


Like no other cars have ever had failures early in an endurance race. The failure wasn't something inherent to its design. And even if it was, god forbid a completely new take on something may have teething problems.

Once again, failure to post anything meaningful...

Great contribution!
SoapBox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 08:42 AM   #44
SoapBox
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 204578
Join Date: Mar 2009
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Philadelphia
Vehicle:
S54 E46, N54 E82,
N55 E84, AKA REX8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by falcongsr View Post
The whole secret to this sham is that they're letting the car run waaay lighter than everything else on track. That's where all the 'efficiency' gains are coming from. Having the front wheels so close together does what exactly to the frontal area/drag coefficient when the rear is just as wide as any other car? Having the front tires so close together is a suspension designer's nightmare (rear end has to run stiff anti-roll bars to combat all the body roll since the front is too narrow to do anything). The Delta Wing configuration looks comic-book futuristic and is a stroke of marketing genius. It draws in 12 year olds and fans of the Batmobile, but I don't see any new and interesting tech in this thing. Why did the guys with the original idea for this thing walk away from it?
Yup...I will say, it's rather funny when they bring up that it runs half the power, uses half the fuel, etc. It's also half the weight.

That being said, IIRC, it's drag is quite low, and it does well in traffic/unclean air. Might be a decent solution to the passing problems in high-downforce cars?

Regardless, it makes a big difference in drag having the smaller front, and more gradually channeling air as it makes its way to the rear (see: airplanes)

The other thing: Could a 'conventional' chassis configuration even achieve the Delta's weight, period? If not, well, there it is. It's a much lighter chassis, with capable performance. Why would you object to lighter, more efficient racing cars?

Regarding it being nothing new: What else has road-raced with F/R tracks like that? Let alone raced at this level.

I also fail to see how needing a bunch of anti-roll in the rear makes it inherently bad. That's a product of its layout, not a bandaid. That's like saying a kart is inherently bad for running a ton of scrub radius to achieve it's weight jacking during cornering. It's not bad, it's what makes that layout work.

C/N: I'm not saying it's the greatest thing since sliced bread, but I can easily see how the concept has its advantages that may lead to better/more efficient racing in the future. Can't see a reason that conventional over-square tracks need to remain on cars, just because. Yes, it's odd to look at...but that doesn't make it an incorrect approach.



Talking point:

If F1 had an open rule book, you don't think there's a chance that designers may look to that configuration?

Last edited by SoapBox; 03-19-2013 at 08:57 AM.
SoapBox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 10:36 AM   #45
kfoote
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 39180
Join Date: Jul 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Trying to get :unamused: on TV
Vehicle:
2004 WRB STi
Slash Ten - FBHIC

Default

Has everyone somehow missed that the part that failed in the car was brand new, completely different than what ran in the car last year, had extremely limited development time, and was obviously not as good as what was in the car last year comparing it to P2 times?

This car is a totally different concept than anything else, which I am all for in sports car racing. It is misclassed this year in P1, but should fit right in to the combined prototype class next year.

If F1 had an open rule book, they wouldn't use the Delta Wing because they'd be AWD and they'd need to be wide enough to accomodate the front differential and halfshafts and have them out of the airflow.
kfoote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 10:41 AM   #46
ptclaus98
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 87888
Join Date: May 2005
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Vehicle:
1998 Jetta VR6
Wheres my vape, bruh?

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kfoote View Post
Has everyone somehow missed that the part that failed in the car was brand new, completely different than what ran in the car last year, had extremely limited development time, and was obviously not as good as what was in the car last year comparing it to P2 times?

This car is a totally different concept than anything else, which I am all for in sports car racing. It is misclassed this year in P1, but should fit right in to the combined prototype class next year.

If F1 had an open rule book, they wouldn't use the Delta Wing because they'd be AWD and they'd need to be wide enough to accomodate the front differential and halfshafts and have them out of the airflow.
Would they have mechanical drive in the front? Seems like Electric would serve the purpose better.
ptclaus98 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 11:22 AM   #47
SoapBox
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 204578
Join Date: Mar 2009
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Philadelphia
Vehicle:
S54 E46, N54 E82,
N55 E84, AKA REX8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by falcongsr View Post
Why did the guys with the original idea for this thing walk away from it?
That's not a fair description. You honestly think Ben Bowlby doesn't believe in the car simply because Panoz decided to go racing in another class with it? He still owns and operates Delta Wing Racing cars, doesn't he?

Last edited by SoapBox; 03-19-2013 at 11:30 AM.
SoapBox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 12:15 PM   #48
falcongsr
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 305831
Join Date: Jan 2012
Default

eh...nm.
falcongsr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2013, 12:17 PM   #49
kfoote
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 39180
Join Date: Jul 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Trying to get :unamused: on TV
Vehicle:
2004 WRB STi
Slash Ten - FBHIC

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ptclaus98 View Post
Would they have mechanical drive in the front? Seems like Electric would serve the purpose better.
Good point, that is a possibility, though I would expect that to come down to a question of weight vs packaging benefits. The current KERS weighs about 35 kg from what I have seen, and I think you could make a mechanical AWD for less weight than that with current technology, though I'm not sure on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by falcongsr View Post
Why did the guys with the original idea for this thing walk away from it?
Nissan pulled pretty much all their motorsports funding in North America and a good chunk of Europe so they can run the V8 Supercar series this year. That's also why there wasn't a Nissan engine in the Delta Wing at Sebring.
kfoote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2013, 07:33 AM   #50
mekilljoydammit
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 258151
Join Date: Sep 2010
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Wisconsin
Default

I'm going to be interested in seeing lap times of this thing at Road America; it would be pretty funny if qualifying times for the Deltawing were similar to testing times for Scott Tucker's DSR car, which were in the 1:54.6 range... and they should be going by Sebring qualifying times. I mean hey, why not compare it to a 4 wheel, thousand-pound-ish car with 2-300hp? Nevermind the incredibly vast difference in technology or money poured in. And granted the DSR car's 600cc turbo motor at the testing power levels was probably only good for maybe 10 laps, while the Deltawing... oh wait.

Seriously, it proved a modern prototype car built without weight or aerodynamic rules can go almost as fast on the same power, and that if you don't have any rules on underbody aero, you can make good downforce without wings. Neither of these things were a surprise to anyone who was paying attention. The narrow front thing... in theory, the DW people are saying you could then lighten the tub because it wouldn't have to resist torsional forces, except then they use an Aston Martin AMR-1 tub they got at a garage sale rendering that a moot point! It's a styling exercise, which, fine, but technically it's not this sudden bold new way forwards everyone is gushing about.

As for AWD in F1, it's been tried before and got ditched as a concept because it wasn't worth the weight and packaging. They basically found that for handling balance they kept wanting to shift the torque split rearwards, followed essentially by saying "wait, why are we doing this again?" Nowadays with downforce and the like, it would be even less beneficial aside from the couple low speed corners Tilke throws in, and it would hurt front end aerodynamics a lot.
mekilljoydammit is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rare Nissan Skyline R34 Rear Wing fits Impreza or other models JayGold Interior & Exterior Modification 0 03-16-2011 04:02 AM
WTT: GOLD Kouki Nissan S14 240sx KA-T w/ APR GTC-300 wing & CUSCO suspension billy boi Private Vehicle 'For Sale' Classifieds 5 10-03-2009 03:16 AM
FS NJ : 1995 GOLD Nissan 240sx KA-T w/ APR GTC-300 wing & CUSCO suspension billy boi Private Vehicle 'For Sale' Classifieds 1 08-22-2009 12:33 AM
05 wrx...utec delta..$400...stock silver wrx wing..$120 rrpracr Engine/Power/Exhaust 0 11-04-2008 04:22 PM
00-05 Nissan Sentra OEM Style Wing STI 2 NV Private 'For Sale' Classifieds 3 06-21-2005 11:49 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:35 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2015 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2015, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.