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Old 04-20-2012, 01:45 PM   #1
SubaruOutback.org
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Default Subaru Boxer Diesel to get CVT

Source: http://canberratimes.drive.com.au/mo...227-1txa5.html

Quote:
Subaru diesels to get automatic transmission

Bruce Newton

February 27, 2012


Outback first-up, but still 12 months away.

Subaru will start to fill a significant hole in its model lineup when it launches an automatic version of the turbo-diesel Outback soft-roader in 12 months.

And further down the track the company expects to add auto-diesel Forester and XV models to its SUV range. However, they won’t arrive before 2014.

Passenger car models with diesel would be further out than SUVs.

The auto in the Outback will be a high-torque version of the Lineartronic CVT which is gradually spreading through the Subaru range, replacing traditional torque converter autos.

“Next year at this time we’ll have an Outback CVT diesel on sale,” Subaru Australia managing director Nick Senior confirmed at last week’s Impreza launch.

“We sell about 70 Outback diesels per month and once we add the auto we will double that quite convincingly,” he said.

He said auto was more crucial to boosting sales of the Outback, rather than the Forester, both of which offer the same 350Nm 2.0-litre turbo-diesel boxer/six-speed manual alongside petrol manual/auto options in the range.

“We take Outback to a lot of field days and motor shows and the message from people is ‘once it has an auto we are interested’,” Senior said.

“The Forester diesel is a little different. We sell around 180-200 per month with the manual and we don’t get the same feedback with the Forester in terms of an auto as we do with the Outback.”

The new generation Forester is due next January, and Senior indicated it probably wouldn’t have a diesel at launch, and when it does arrive it won’t initially be with an auto.

He said that was simply due to engineering projects taking their place in a bulging Subaru development schedule.

Intriguingly, Senior said the arrival of a high-torque Lineartronic in Outback indicated its potential suitability for high-performance models such as the next generation WRX and STi due in 2014.

“If you’re able to put that sort of torque through a CVT it then opens up the possibilities of it being in our more performance variants. I think that’s the future direction for us.”
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Old 04-20-2012, 02:05 PM   #2
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This is huge news and hopefully will pave the way for Subie diesels in North America sooner rather than later...
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Old 04-20-2012, 05:17 PM   #3
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If it isn't a reliability problem, the way some other brands have reliability/longevity issues with CVTs...

A slow-revving, lower-redline diesel, in an economy or workhorse role, is an efficient use of a CVT's benefits.

I firmly disagree with the application of a diesel or a CVT, let alone together, in a performance car, like WRX.

But in an economy car, or a smaller workhorse... it could be cool.

But give the work-horse version real VTD, robust, mechanical AWD, not just FWD bias, with RWD assist with software torque handling.

Put that in a Forester SUT and SUV... and watch them sell like crazy. Probably including me as my practical vehicle, allowing me to have a separate sports car.
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Old 04-20-2012, 09:06 PM   #4
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I think little hope for the diesel to get to North America.
Maybe only if the CX-5 Diesel will do well here, even then Subaru will probably need to tweak it for CA emissions.
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Old 04-20-2012, 09:42 PM   #5
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Only a matter of time I guess...

I've read rumors about that for a bit..

But as always, we'd be lucky to have it here in NA.
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Old 04-20-2012, 11:26 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALafya View Post
I think little hope for the diesel to get to North America.
Maybe only if the CX-5 Diesel will do well here, even then Subaru will probably need to tweak it for CA emissions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlowOFFBen View Post
Only a matter of time I guess...

I've read rumors about that for a bit..

But as always, we'd be lucky to have it here in NA.
I agree. I saw 2 test diesels here. They ARE studying it obviously. It would have a better chance with an auto, but I think no sooner than 3 to 4 years after they are introduced. A "better/cleaner" Subaru diesel surely has to be under development.
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Old 04-21-2012, 12:06 AM   #7
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I can't wait to see the MPG rating of the diesel and CVT paired together. 50MPG hwy, maybe? Besides needing automatics for the US market, an even higher MPG rating would help a diesel model make more financial sense than the iffy prospect it would be now for US consumers.
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Old 04-21-2012, 01:49 AM   #8
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Subaru, please redesign the Tribeca to be a larger vehicle that can fit 7 or 8 adults and give it this turbo-diesel CVT and you could have a real winner.
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Old 04-21-2012, 08:40 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HB_Dad
Subaru, please redesign the Tribeca to be a larger vehicle that can fit 7 or 8 adults and give it this turbo-diesel CVT and you could have a real winner.
It would take 15 seconds to get to 60.
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Old 04-21-2012, 08:57 AM   #10
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It would take 15 seconds to get to 60.
So did my Pinto...What's your point
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Old 04-21-2012, 03:41 PM   #11
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Subaru, please redesign the Tribeca to be a larger vehicle that can fit 7 or 8 adults and give it this turbo-diesel CVT and you could have a real winner.

Turbo + Diesel + CVT sounds really expensive.
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Old 04-22-2012, 04:56 PM   #12
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Diesel + CVT + current Tribeca = perfect for me !!!!!

Hopefully city mileage 25mpg and highway 30 mpg.
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Old 04-22-2012, 05:09 PM   #13
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So did my Pinto...What's your point
Good point. If it is as good as a Pinto, it is clearly good enough.

I notice you don't have that Pinto anymore. Shame to have to downgrade to an 09 & 11 WRX.
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Old 04-22-2012, 05:20 PM   #14
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I don't know.. diesel and boxer doesn't seem to fit..

Reliability? they already had bad apples with the 2.5 NA
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Old 04-22-2012, 05:31 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by fr0st View Post
I don't know.. diesel and boxer doesn't seem to fit..

Reliability? they already had bad apples with the 2.5 NA
Thats history! No more problems since many many years.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:11 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fr0st View Post
I don't know.. diesel and boxer doesn't seem to fit..

Reliability? they already had bad apples with the 2.5 NA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juege View Post
Thats history! No more problems since many many years.

No kidding. Not to sound mean, but what rock did you crawl out from under? The Boxer Diesel seems to fit just fine over in Europe. Just need more(many more) people interested in it here in the U.S.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:31 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustyWRC View Post
Just need more(many more) people interested in it here in the U.S.
Subaru of NA has been waiting for an automatic so they start selling diesels. Unlike Europeans, North Americans don't care for manuals in non-performance cars.
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:01 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Almost a Ghost View Post
Subaru of NA has been waiting for an automatic so they start selling diesels. Unlike Europeans, North Americans don't care for manuals in non-performance cars.

They're waiting for more than just an automatic. Demand for diesels in the states hovers around 10% vs 50% in Europe.
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Old 04-23-2012, 11:37 PM   #19
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diesels are not offered nearly as widely, and supply can define demand. Ability and willingness to purchase go into demand.

Ability is cancelled if the product is not offered widely, and difficult to keep in stock.
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Old 04-24-2012, 12:07 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HipToBeSquare View Post
diesels are not offered nearly as widely, and supply can define demand. Ability and willingness to purchase go into demand.

Ability is cancelled if the product is not offered widely, and difficult to keep in stock.
Agreed. I would have bought a Diesel-powered Forester if it had been available back in December 2010 and CVT would have been icing on the cake. Although, I'd be perfectly fine with the 6 M/T (it would have taken just a little bit more persuasion as my wife is the primary driver of our Forester).
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:19 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HipToBeSquare View Post
diesels are not offered nearly as widely, and supply can define demand. Ability and willingness to purchase go into demand.

Ability is cancelled if the product is not offered widely, and difficult to keep in stock.

Cost is also a big driver. Doesn't the Diesel over there cost like $3K more than the standard engine? I can tell you now, it wouldn't sell well here as a manual only.

Now, if it is $3K more AND has a 6spd, what about adding $1000 for the auto? Unless they could price it lower, I don't think trying to force supply to create demand would work.
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Old 04-25-2012, 02:03 PM   #22
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I have very little interest in a diesel.
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Old 04-25-2012, 02:27 PM   #23
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I would have gladly paid for a 6 speed diesel on my 2012 impreza. Probably about 40 - 45 mpg? Not to mention a diesel has a better rumble and somewhere like 100 less moving parts so they are more reliable if you take that as there are less things to break
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Old 04-25-2012, 04:42 PM   #24
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In many European countries, diesel is a lot cheaper than regular unleaded, so you get both a MPG (er, Kilometers per Gallon) boost as well as cheaper fuel. In Germany, for example, diesel can be over $1 per gallon (adjusted for gallons and currency conversion) cheaper. It doesn't take too long to get ROI on the initial additional cost of a diesel engine. Right now the average price of unleaded is over USD $8.30/gallon in Germany and diesel is $7.39 . Ouch.

In the USA diesel is MORE expensive (usually) than unleaded, so all you get is the MPG boost.
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Old 04-25-2012, 05:45 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SubyDoWhreRU View Post
I would have gladly paid for a 6 speed diesel on my 2012 impreza. Probably about 40 - 45 mpg? Not to mention a diesel has a better rumble
Did you mean clatter?


Quote:
Originally Posted by SubyDoWhreRU View Post
and somewhere like 100 less moving parts so they are more reliable if you take that as there are less things to break
Which "like 100" parts are you referring to? Subaru's boxer diesel is not a 2-stroke Detroit engine.. it's a full-on DOHC aluminum block modern diesel that's very expensive to produce and in no way simpler than the N/A Subaru gasoline engines it's meant to be an upgrade over... particularly not once you add in all the requisite emissions controls for the US market.
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