Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Monday July 14, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Subaru Models > BRZ Forum

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-03-2012, 03:10 AM   #1
manticus
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 162857
Join Date: Oct 2007
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, AB
Default BRZ vs. Mustang V6 review

* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
manticus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 03:57 AM   #2
OrbitalEllipses
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 178811
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: MoCo
Vehicle:
2013 WRB BRZ
:banana:

Default

Mustang still beat it. [/troll] Good to see Pobst do a head to head. For reference he drove an M3 on the same track (Streets of Willow) in 1.27.67 and a Mustang GT 5.0 in 1.27.76.

What's in the Track Pack anyway? Shorter rear axle ratio, Pzero tires? I do wonder how much of that 1.5 is tires. PZero vs. Primacy is no contest. I imagine if all Mustangs were IRS equipped that the Mustang might have lapped a bit quicker, but that's conjecture.

Last edited by OrbitalEllipses; 05-03-2012 at 04:03 AM.
OrbitalEllipses is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 11:43 AM   #3
Harv
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 50850
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
90 Miata,
12 Regal GS, 02 Outback

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses View Post
Mustang still beat it. [/troll] Good to see Pobst do a head to head. For reference he drove an M3 on the same track (Streets of Willow) in 1.27.67 and a Mustang GT 5.0 in 1.27.76.

What's in the Track Pack anyway? Shorter rear axle ratio, Pzero tires? I do wonder how much of that 1.5 is tires. PZero vs. Primacy is no contest. I imagine if all Mustangs were IRS equipped that the Mustang might have lapped a bit quicker, but that's conjecture.
Performance pack for the V6 is shorter axle ratio, summer tires, bigger wheels, different suspension (front springs, front and rear sways, strut tower bar), different brake calipers with performance pads.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 02:46 PM   #4
Tristar Racing
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 54606
Join Date: Feb 2004
Vehicle:
2005 EVO
2004 IS300

Default

I am a BRZ fan, admittedly 1.5 seconds on a track is a decent amount of time; I wonder what the BRZ would lap at on Pzero tires or something similar. I bet all the balance, body control, and good brake feel will lend itself to getting the most out of stickier rubber.

(Not saying the BRZ needs those tires or has to beat the Mustang at the track, I realize its not the purpose of the car, just discussing)
Tristar Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 02:53 PM   #5
grzydj
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 84984
Join Date: Apr 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Sioux Falls, South Dakota
Vehicle:
2006 Impreza 2.5i 5D
'04 Toyota Tacoma TRD

Default

The V6 Track Pack Mustang is faster on some road course sections than the V8 'Stang due to lighter weight. Still, this was a pretty fun mashup to watch. Either car would be a lot of fun to drive, but the BRZ is a good example of what you can do when you add lightness.
grzydj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 05:01 PM   #6
Keshav
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 1654
Join Date: Jun 2000
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
Vehicle:
1998 GC8 Unicorn
MV Agusta Brutale S

Default

50% more bhp and only 1.5 seconds faster per lap on grip tires. Yeah, um. You sure that boat lost its anchor?
Keshav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 05:46 PM   #7
bpang1
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 67225
Join Date: Jul 2004
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Spokane, WA
Vehicle:
2004 WRX Wagon
JBP

Default

Put just a WRX's HP/TQ level in the BRZ and some summer tires and I guarantee the BRZ would smoke that mustang.

God help me I love the Mustang so much but it is still a big hulk of metal with 1960's suspension technology.
bpang1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 07:22 PM   #8
Harv
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 50850
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
90 Miata,
12 Regal GS, 02 Outback

Default

Eh, even Pobst says that the BRZ is a better driver's car.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 08:59 PM   #9
drummerboy827
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 124720
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: MD
Vehicle:
2009 WRX Hatch
Black

Default

Does the mustang still have the top speed limited to like 95 MPH?
drummerboy827 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 09:53 PM   #10
heavyD
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 194216
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
2013 STI Sport-tech

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keshav View Post
50% more bhp and only 1.5 seconds faster per lap on grip tires. Yeah, um. You sure that boat lost its anchor?
1.5 seconds is huge on the track. The different between an M3 and Mustang V6 isn't much more than that.
heavyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2012, 10:04 PM   #11
Harv
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 50850
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
90 Miata,
12 Regal GS, 02 Outback

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by drummerboy827 View Post
Does the mustang still have the top speed limited to like 95 MPH?
115..
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 08:23 AM   #12
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: in a minefield of caddishness.
Vehicle:
1984 "Skeletor from
"He-Man"

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bpang1 View Post
Put just a WRX's HP/TQ level in the BRZ and some summer tires and I guarantee the BRZ would smoke that mustang.

God help me I love the Mustang so much but it is still a big hulk of metal with 1960's suspension technology.
It already has a WRX's HP/TQ level.. at least as far as the shifts from redline (around a track) are concerned.

They (your WRX when stock and the BRZ) both put 170hp to the wheels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deslock View Post
The dynos I found for the stock 2.0L WRX are pretty weak... I based this on the strongest one in this thread, and it still looks slower than it should. If you find a better stock dyno, post a link and I'll redo the plot.

Edit: here's Deslock's more conservative estimate:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deslock View Post
[...]


This is more like what I've been expecting all along, at least in the mid and high RPM range. This as probably the worst case scenario, and I won't be surprised if it's in-between this and the other plots.

Again, all of this is speculative.
[...]
So, again, shifting from redline, the BRZ is likely moving at some very decent speed. Don't forget how fast the V6 mustang is.. just because it's fast doesn't mean the BRZ is slow.

Last edited by Calamity Jesus; 05-04-2012 at 08:30 AM.
Calamity Jesus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 11:33 AM   #13
Davemeister
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 86577
Join Date: May 2005
Location: D1cKSh0Tz [ON] OFF
Vehicle:
2015 Supercoolmobile
Awesome Pearl Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harv View Post
115..
And it weighs 3500 pounds and has a solid rear axle.

IMO the BRZ would be a great car with better tires, and an awesome car with better tires and 70 hp.

But who am I to argue that ****ty tires don't make a less powerful car "fun" to drive because you can slide it around corners at 20 MPH.
Davemeister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 11:55 AM   #14
industrial
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 7250
Join Date: Jun 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Home
Vehicle:
2013 BRZ
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davemeister View Post
And it weighs 3500 pounds and has a solid rear axle.

IMO the BRZ would be a great car with better tires, and an awesome car with better tires and 70 hp.

But who am I to argue that ****ty tires don't make a less powerful car "fun" to drive because you can slide it around corners at 20 MPH.
Yeah, let's throw out all the engineering that went into the chassis, suspension, transmission, steering and engine. Throw Primacy tires on a Yaris...BOOM SPORTS CAR! I love your logic.
industrial is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 12:05 PM   #15
Davemeister
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 86577
Join Date: May 2005
Location: D1cKSh0Tz [ON] OFF
Vehicle:
2015 Supercoolmobile
Awesome Pearl Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by industrial View Post
Yeah, let's throw out all the engineering that went into the chassis, suspension, transmission, steering and engine. Throw Primacy tires on a Yaris...BOOM SPORTS CAR! I love your logic.


I'm pretty sure you have no idea what I was trying to say, or you're trolling, or you're stupid. If you want to sort it out, maybe construct a carefully-worded reply that doesn't involve a lot of sarcasm and we'll see where it goes.
Davemeister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 12:51 PM   #16
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: in a minefield of caddishness.
Vehicle:
1984 "Skeletor from
"He-Man"

Default

The Prius tire thing is starting to wear on people, Dave. 240 treadwear Primacy HP tires are not "****ty tires". They're plenty grippy, they just aren't UHP tires. The BRZ still out does a STI on the skidpad. (0.92 G vs 0.90 G).
Calamity Jesus is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 12:58 PM   #17
Harv
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 50850
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
90 Miata,
12 Regal GS, 02 Outback

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davemeister View Post
And it weighs 3500 pounds and has a solid rear axle.

IMO the BRZ would be a great car with better tires, and an awesome car with better tires and 70 hp.

But who am I to argue that ****ty tires don't make a less powerful car "fun" to drive because you can slide it around corners at 20 MPH.
What are you looking at me for? I just posted the top speed of the thing.

Quit being so uppity about the damned Mustang vs the BRZ. Who gives a crap anyway?
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 01:05 PM   #18
industrial
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 7250
Join Date: Jun 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Home
Vehicle:
2013 BRZ
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davemeister View Post


I'm pretty sure you have no idea what I was trying to say, or you're trolling, or you're stupid. If you want to sort it out, maybe construct a carefully-worded reply that doesn't involve a lot of sarcasm and we'll see where it goes.
Ok, no sarcasm. You are another person completely missing the point of the BRZ. That point being, it's an inexpensive drivers car meant to be fun on the track, a weekend trip or even your commute. You begin to add 70hp and big tires and you end up with something that might only be fun on the track. You would probably also make the car heavier and more expensive. You would be drifting (no pun) further away from the original goal of having a fun little everyman/everyday sports car.
industrial is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 01:17 PM   #19
Davemeister
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 86577
Join Date: May 2005
Location: D1cKSh0Tz [ON] OFF
Vehicle:
2015 Supercoolmobile
Awesome Pearl Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harv View Post
What are you looking at me for? I just posted the top speed of the thing.

Quit being so uppity about the damned Mustang vs the BRZ. Who gives a crap anyway?


I was just posting the other disadvantages of the Mustang. I think it's completely retarded to even compare the two cars, myself, hence why I made the "Smart Car vs. Mack truck" comment in the other thread.
Davemeister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 01:26 PM   #20
Harv
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 50850
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
90 Miata,
12 Regal GS, 02 Outback

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davemeister View Post


I was just posting the other disadvantages of the Mustang. I think it's completely retarded to even compare the two cars, myself, hence why I made the "Smart Car vs. Mack truck" comment in the other thread.
Eh, it's a what can you get for X dollars comparison. They usually work out to be a bit strange.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 01:34 PM   #21
Davemeister
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 86577
Join Date: May 2005
Location: D1cKSh0Tz [ON] OFF
Vehicle:
2015 Supercoolmobile
Awesome Pearl Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by industrial View Post
Ok, no sarcasm. You are another person completely missing the point of the BRZ. That point being, it's an inexpensive drivers car meant to be fun on the track, a weekend trip or even your commute. You begin to add 70hp and big tires and you end up with something that might only be fun on the track. You would probably also make the car heavier and more expensive. You would be drifting (no pun) further away from the original goal of having a fun little everyman/everyday sports car.
Well, OK. I understand your point, but I can't see how I was expected to get that from your post.

Anyway, I don't miss the point of the BRZ, I understand it completely. But I also understand the point of high-heeled shoes, and I don't want to wear those. (That's not a "girl car" dig or anything, don't read too much into that analogy.)

Further, I respect the ideal it has in mind of being fairly inexpensive and fun to drive, most cars that come out like these end up stupidly priced, I can't believe the Miata is well over $30K these days unless you get a stripper.

But, I don't think more tire and 70 more HP would make the car any less of a sports car or only fun on a track to me, and I wouldn't mind if it were a little more expensive.

Essentially I'm saying, bring on the STI version. That might be a BRZ that suits my tastes.
Davemeister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 09:03 PM   #22
scotto
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 3635
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Aliso Viejo,CA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX Swagon
Platinum Silver

Default

One of the key phrases from the canyon roads guy was the BRZ is like a good dance partner. The big key is how rewarding the BRZ is to drive. Randy Pobst had some very complimentary things to say about the BRZ. Light, nimble, precise, composed in transition, great brakes, the car is so well balanced under power it's all about steering. He wasn't having to deal with how upset the Mustang became over bumps, or how much it moved around under braking. I'm guessing stickier tires would even out the times quite a bit despite the power differences - which is pretty impressive. Randy finished the Subaru drive with a big smile on his face and the word fun being expressed.

Is the Mustang a very good value, yes. Which car do I want, the "Drivers" car according to both reviewers, the BRZ!
scotto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 09:17 PM   #23
greg donovan
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 60743
Join Date: Apr 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Fargo, ND
Vehicle:
'95 Impreza L
dirty and on jack stands

Default

I am loving all the great press this car is getting. I can't wait to get a used one in a few years.
greg donovan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 02:05 AM   #24
jermismo
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 293674
Join Date: Sep 2011
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Bellevue, WA
Vehicle:
2011 WRX
Dark Gray Metallic

Default

A friend has a V6 Mustang with that track pack. I was skeptical, but the car is more fun than I thought it would be. Still wouldn't trade my WRX for one - but trading it for a BRZ is tempting.
jermismo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 11:29 AM   #25
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: in a minefield of caddishness.
Vehicle:
1984 "Skeletor from
"He-Man"

Default

The new Mustang (in any iteration) is more fun than it should be. Ford just did a damn good job with it.
Calamity Jesus is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
BRZ vs FRS vs Miata video FLAT4WGN BRZ Forum 7 05-02-2012 06:11 PM
autocar: BRZ vs Nissan 370Z vs Mazda MX-5 torquemada BRZ Forum 2 04-12-2012 05:31 PM
2011 Mustang v6 vs stage 2 Wrx??? nattywrx General Community 57 10-13-2011 07:13 PM
Mustang V6 track pack vs Subaru STi FlightService General Community 300 10-30-2010 07:21 PM
wrx VS 2007 V6 mustang 5 speed CashMuny375 Off-Topic 234 01-11-2009 08:07 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.