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Old 07-07-2012, 08:43 PM   #251
juanmedina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amalgrover View Post
its possible...i am a fan of giving the car what it wants and not what you think it should have (obviously within reason)...i mean, look at the ej207's timing...25* at peak and 38* at redline on the stock v8 maps.

on the opposite end of the spectrum, i know someone who is only able to run 9* at peak and 18* at redline with a 2.5L 18g setup running 20psi. with boost at 17psi and timing a couple degrees higher, the power was actually slightly lower, and the car would knock with even the slightest bit of heatsoak so...sometimes cars just don't like timing and sometimes they do. thats the beauty of e85. it allows the tuner to actually hit MBT. its pretty blatant when the car hits it because you go from making like 10ftlbs from every degree to only making like 2ftlbs with every degree.
Its suppose to be 81* F next week for a few days, so I am going to play with a little more timing and see what results I get. I need to break 500whp VD dynojet consistently to be happy with my setup.
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Old 07-07-2012, 10:24 PM   #252
Zee Biker
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I am a fan of the tuning theory that just got thrown around in here, but I need to weigh in on this.

Dyno numbers are arbitrary and obviously weather dependent. Everyone's measuring stick is different, but for goodness sake, shoot for a trap speed or ET in something, be it a 0-60 (I rather have to fight traction issues there, but that is me), this 50-100 time, or get into the 60-130 game.
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Old 07-07-2012, 10:31 PM   #253
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trust me...juan and i are both VERY on board with the 50-100 time and the trap speed measurements. juan and i have compared numbers enough and talked tuning enough to be able to compare our graphs and things. you are right though, anybody who is looking at dyno numbers should take them with a grain of salt and use them as more of a ballpark figure than an exact number.
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Old 07-08-2012, 01:36 AM   #254
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Well, if anybody's interested, I looked at my video and my 60-90 was 3 seconds flat. It seems a lot of the videos have an uninterrupted 60-90 section without shifts, if I recall correctly.
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:40 PM   #255
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mine looks really close...mine looks to be about 2.5-3 sec for me to go approx 60-100mph...really hard to tell on this computer, and my shift to 3rd only dropped me to about 61-63mph so...not exactly starting at 60mph...but close.

i can check on an actual video editing software once i get on my personal computer later tomorrow.
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:46 PM   #256
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I think the smaller the window you look at, the less useful the metric becomes. It ends up being even more gearing and powerband dependent, it makes it impossible to compare against other cars, etc. I think 60-130 is probably the best benchmark, but 50-100 is decent and easier to obtain in a slow car.
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:46 PM   #257
Dave D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amalgrover View Post
mine looks really close...mine looks to be about 2.5-3 sec for me to go approx 60-100mph...really hard to tell on this computer, and my shift to 3rd only dropped me to about 61-63mph so...not exactly starting at 60mph...but close.

i can check on an actual video editing software once i get on my personal computer later tomorrow.
Now we see the 340 vs 500whp difference!
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:52 PM   #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xluben View Post
I think the smaller the window you look at, the less useful the metric becomes. It ends up being even more gearing and powerband dependent, it makes it impossible to compare against other cars, etc. I think 60-130 is probably the best benchmark, but 50-100 is decent and easier to obtain in a slow car.
i agree completely. take dave's and my 60-100mph times for example. in 3 seconds, my vehicle covered 10-15mph more (i shift to 4th at about 103-105mph and the shift happens right after the 3sec mark), but what you have to consider is not only am i accelerating that 10-15mph more in the same amount of time, my power is having to overcome alot more gearing than his car is so...with the same gearing, the acceleration gap between our two cars would have been even more highlighted.
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Old 07-08-2012, 03:21 PM   #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amalgrover View Post
i agree completely. take dave's and my 60-100mph times for example. in 3 seconds, my vehicle covered 10-15mph more (i shift to 4th at about 103-105mph and the shift happens right after the 3sec mark), but what you have to consider is not only am i accelerating that 10-15mph more in the same amount of time, my power is having to overcome alot more gearing than his car is so...with the same gearing, the acceleration gap between our two cars would have been even more highlighted.
And a confirmation of that: checked my 60-100 same video, about 4.3 seconds. So again, the hp ratios match in this situation.
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Old 07-09-2012, 09:39 PM   #260
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Here's a link to my car, horrible video quality. It's hard to film and drive at the same time I'll try to get a better video this weekend.
Vehicle: 06 STI
Motor: Built 2.5L
Turbo: HTA86
Boost: 24PSI-93 octane
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Redline: 7800
Upgrades:
...ID2ks, walbro 400lph aermotive FPR
...Turbotuff rods, wiseco pistons, GSC stage 2's
...Perrin rotated kit with a HTA3586
...Perrin EL header

Weight: ~3400lbs with a passenger and heavy rotas
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Old 07-10-2012, 03:45 PM   #261
Dave D.
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Wow. Looks like about 4.3 seconds. My build is similar, just a much smaller turbo. Can't wait to put on a bigger one -- just have to finish saving for a better tranny. Nice shifting, too.
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Old 07-10-2012, 03:49 PM   #262
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Why is it so hard to tape a cell phone to the speedo console or steering wheel?

So you when from a VF39 to a HTA86? nice!
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Old 07-10-2012, 04:03 PM   #263
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i agree...i love making big jumps like that. on my bugeye i went from stage 2 stock 2.0L and transmission to a FPRed E85 built 2.5L with ppg's i was literally scared to go WOT in 1st for a little while
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Old 07-10-2012, 04:23 PM   #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Why is it so hard to tape a cell phone to the speedo console or steering wheel?
Fuji just wedges his phone behind the steering wheel and then does 9 a second run! His videos are some of the best quality ones that have been posted.
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:17 PM   #265
AirManCam
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Why is it so hard to tape a cell phone to the speedo console or steering wheel?

So you when from a VF39 to a HTA86? nice!
No sir, I went from making big power on the vf39 (for 3 weeks LOL) to a HTA green to this. So it was a pretty steady jump the whole time
I actually just went to make a video again on the way home from the gym that was super steady..but I was a noob and missed 4th
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:34 PM   #266
Dave D.
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Methinks I need to switch the last two digits on my turbo.
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Old 07-10-2012, 06:09 PM   #267
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Unless you're using a more precise log with correctly calibrated speed, this list seems a bit silly.

A small error in measurement makes a big difference when you're talking about only 4 or 5 seconds.

A 50-100mph run in 5 seconds could very easily have been be a 52.5-105mph run if you're speed is 5% off. So an actual 50-100 would have been around 4.75 seconds.

Combine that error with a small error measuring the time and you're 5 second time could be a lot closer to 4.5 seconds......or 5.5 seconds if you error in the other direction.
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Old 07-10-2012, 06:20 PM   #268
Dave D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vica153 View Post
Unless you're using a more precise log with correctly calibrated speed, this list seems a bit silly.

A small error in measurement makes a big difference when you're talking about only 4 or 5 seconds.

A 50-100mph run in 5 seconds could very easily have been be a 52.5-105mph run if you're speed is 5% off. So an actual 50-100 would have been around 4.75 seconds.

Combine that error with a small error measuring the time and you're 5 second time could be a lot closer to 4.5 seconds......or 5.5 seconds if you error in the other direction.
Hey, I'm the math teacher here. But you get an "A" for the day.

(But a good case in point. The error would be even greater 60-130mph. That's why I'm still a fan of a single-gear pull in a smaller range, say 60-90).
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Old 07-10-2012, 06:42 PM   #269
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No, a longer pull would be better. The measurement error should be fixed (ie. +/-0.1seconds). The longer the pull takes, the less significant (percentage wise) the error becomes.

I think we all know this isn't perfect. It's still interesting, IMO. It is easier to get than a1/4 mile time. It is more useful (for comparing speed) than a road dyno (or even a real dyno).
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Old 07-10-2012, 06:49 PM   #270
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i think that if you try and make this comparison too scientific, you will not only make it completely unable to be performed by the average person, but you will also completely remove most of the fun involved. i am all for making things accurate, but i think we are all fairly aware of inaccuracies in speedometers, human errors in calculating times, etc. i mean, i don't think any of us are arguing our position on the list or going at this with a competitive mindset.

if someone feels that the possibility of inaccuracies pollute the results, they are more than welcome to move on and not participate. for those willing to overlook or accept the possibility for inaccuracies, we will gladly welcome your entry to the list.
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Old 07-10-2012, 06:52 PM   #271
Dave D.
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Originally Posted by xluben View Post
No, a longer pull would be better. The measurement error should be fixed (ie. +/-0.1seconds). The longer the pull takes, the less significant (percentage wise) the error becomes.

I think we all know this isn't perfect. It's still interesting, IMO. It is easier to get than a1/4 mile time. It is more useful (for comparing speed) than a road dyno (or even a real dyno).
You're right, the relative error would be less between cars, especially as the times to reach 130 would have very significant differences, much more so than the possible error. I thought about that after I posted, and wondered if anybody would catch it before I could fix it.

Nobody escapes from their mistakes on NASIOC!
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Old 07-10-2012, 11:23 PM   #272
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Here's a video I made for fun with my new gears. Thought it might be interesting for some.


In this video I'm only shifting at 6.5k instead of 7k in my other video. In-gear acceleration is just as fast (as expected, nearly identical ratio's), but the extra shift to get to 100mph ends up slowing the time down by about 1/3 of a second.
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Old 07-11-2012, 03:04 PM   #273
Dave D.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xluben View Post
Here's a video I made for fun with my new gears. Thought it might be interesting for some.

2011 Subaru WRX - PAR Gears - YouTube

In this video I'm only shifting at 6.5k instead of 7k in my other video. In-gear acceleration is just as fast (as expected, nearly identical ratio's), but the extra shift to get to 100mph ends up slowing the time down by about 1/3 of a second.
Yes, but now it's 1/4 mile time!
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Old 07-12-2012, 12:46 PM   #274
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Quote:
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ill play. still tuning and the weather definitely plays a part! i very 30hp from 40* to 80*.

Vehicle: 2011 WRX
Motor: Stock
Turbo: Stock
Boost: 22-23psi, taper to 14.5-15.5psi
Transmission: Stock
Redline: 6900 but only go to 6300-6500
Fuel: 93




Upgrades:
  • EXHAUST
    EL header
    EWG
    Catless DP
    CBE
  • INTAKE
    3" CAI
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  • FUELING
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Weight: 3147 at the time
50-100MPH: 6.6 for the time being.

[code]synolimit 2011 Subaru WRX NA 3147 2.5 F4 VF52 23psi 93 310 374 NA NA NA NA 6.6[code]
wow what a difference!!

Vehicle: 2012 GS
Motor: Stock
Turbo: Stock
Boost: 20psi can be had
Transmission: Stock 6 speed
Redline: 6700
Fuel: 93

Mods: K&N drop in

synolimit 2012 Buick Regal GS 36k 3800? 2.0 I4 T04? 20psi? 93 270chp 295ctq NA NA NA NA 13.1 im last on the list!!

http://youtu.be/i2dw2pT0qvE

EDIT: started in 2nd and its a cooler day today. 10.3

http://youtu.be/aQdEq_vvW_k

Last edited by synolimit; 07-14-2012 at 02:27 PM.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:14 PM   #275
juanmedina
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It is a little cooler here today and I did a couple of runs. I think I beat my best time in both runs . In my second run I started on second but It knocked after shifting (no flat food shifting) it pulled a little bit of timing on third (1.5*). I was also running 11.2-11.4 AFR uptop, it is around 75* F with 60% humidity. On the first run VD says I am making 470whp Dynojet and Airboy says 440whp..

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