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Old 05-09-2013, 08:32 PM   #376
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The chrome surround and the lower fascia completely lifted from the Fusion.
YOu sure about that bud...

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Old 05-13-2013, 02:20 PM   #377
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I believe all pictures posted have just been arist rendering, no official designs or pictures have been released yet.
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Old 05-15-2013, 02:01 PM   #378
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Ford Insider: 2015 Mustang EcoBoost to pack 300hp, GT gets 475hp

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It is no secret that the next generation Ford Mustang will arrive for the 2015 model year and while it has long been believed that the upcoming Mustang will pack an EcoBoost 4-cylinder engine – an unnamed Ford employee working on the Mustang project recently told a Mustang forum member that the EcoBoost is indeed on the way. The Mustang EcoBoost engine will measure 2.5 liters and offer around 300 horsepower. This same source explained that the 3.7L V6 that currently serves as the base model Mustang engine could climb into the range of 400 horsepower while the 5.0L Mustang GT could offer as much as 475 horsepower. This information comes to us via the Mustang experts at American Muscle via their company blog.

Now, as I write this piece I am sure that there will be skeptics who point out a lack of validity with these leaked 2015 Ford Mustang details. This information comes from a forum member who spoke with an unnamed member of the 2015 Mustang project team and that paper trail is a bit on the sketchy side but this leaked information is concrete as any other leaked information from an official source who insists on remaining unnamed and unofficial. However, these details seem to be right in line with what we have heard over the past year or so and this new information on the EcoBoost 4-cylinder mill is well within the range of realistic possibilities for 2015. It has been speculated that the Mustang EcoBoost package would offer around 300 horsepower so even an official statement from Ford that the 4-cylinder EcoBoost would pack that power wouldn’t come as a big surprise.

Perhaps the hardest piece of 2015 Ford Mustang information to swallow is the suggestion that the next generation Mustang GT will pack 475 (or more) horsepower. The current Mustang GT makes 420 horsepower and with the Chevrolet Camaro SS offering 426 horsepower, we all expected that the 5.0L V8 in the GT models would get a bump to somewhere in the area of 450 horsepower. However, 475 horsepower in the next generation GT models would give the Mustang and overpowering advantage in the battle with the Camaro. Luckily, with the high end Mustang Shelby GT500 packing 662 horsepower, there is plenty of room for Ford to increase the output of the Mustang GT without creating any real in-house competition with the GT500 super-Stang.

Should this information prove to be true when the 2015 Ford Mustang debuts, it will be interesting to see what Ford does with the 3.7L V6. This engine currently serves as the base engine and the most efficient engine in the Mustang lineup but it is widely expected that the EcoBoost Mustang will offer better fuel economy than the V6 models. The question is whether Ford will indeed give the V6 a boost in power to distance itself from the EcoBoost 4-cylinder or if Ford will have the EcoBoost 4 and the V6 offering the same power with the EcoBoost coming with much better MPGs and a bigger price tag. Ford could make the EcoBoost Mustang the base model with the best fuel economy and 300 horsepower with the V6 getting somewhere closer to 400 horsepower or both could have around 300 horsepower with the more efficient EcoBoost option serving as an upgrade to the standard V6. With this second scenario, the V6 would continue being the base engine for the 2015 Mustang with 305 (or so) horsepower while the EcoBoost 4-cylinder mill would come with an upcharge for similar power but much better fuel economy.

Again, this information could be taken with a grain of salt since it comes from a guy who met a guy but with so little information and so much speculation around the 2015 Ford Mustang – this is one more healthy dose of information to fuel the rumormill. The 2015 Ford Mustang is expected to arrive on April 17th 2015 – exactly 50 years to the day that the very first Mustang was introduced at the New York World’s Fair. Needless to say, any new information that becomes available will most certainly be covered here on TorqueNews.com!
I highly doubt the N/A V6 will get anywhere near that much power, or any additional power for that matter. But I wouldn't hate if it did.
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:33 PM   #379
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I highly doubt the N/A V6 will get anywhere near that much power, or any additional power for that matter. But I wouldn't hate if it did.
Yeah, first thing that popped out at me reading the article. Not happening without boost. Porsche can do 6-cyls with that kind of power, but no workhorse V6 I've seen is anywhere near getting that high. The closest is probably the 350hp NISMO/IPL VQ and Hyundai's Lambda, but those are reportedly very... err, optimistically... rated. I don't see any company hitting near 400hp in an extremely mass produced V6 in the next couple of years.
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Old 05-15-2013, 11:41 PM   #380
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What does the number of cylinders have to do with hp? If they wanted to make an N/A V6 with 400 hp, they could. Cylinder count does not dictate hp.

Last edited by AllAWD; 05-15-2013 at 11:47 PM.
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Old 05-16-2013, 12:23 AM   #381
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What does the number of cylinders have to do with hp? If they wanted to make an N/A V6 with 400 hp, they could. Cylinder count does not dictate hp.
Yeah just make it a 5.0 v6!
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Old 05-16-2013, 12:29 AM   #382
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GMC trucks from the 60's had 5L V6's.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:47 AM   #383
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Truck engines aren't quite the same as performance car engines
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Old 05-16-2013, 05:37 AM   #384
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What does the number of cylinders have to do with hp? If they wanted to make an N/A V6 with 400 hp, they could. Cylinder count does not dictate hp.
If Ford wanted to make the 3.7L V6 make 400hp like the article says, they probably could. Would it still be an affordable, easily mass-produced engine for a base model car with the fuel economy/reliability/emissions expected from that segment? Nope. Which is exactly what I said; Porsche can do that (in a $100K car), your mass market car companies simply can't. It's not happening in the next two years. I don't really see what is so hard to understand about that. right back at ya.
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Old 05-16-2013, 05:48 AM   #385
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Truck engines aren't quite the same as performance car engines
ask any Viper driver
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:53 AM   #386
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Touché.
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:55 AM   #387
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What does the number of cylinders have to do with hp? If they wanted to make an N/A V6 with 400 hp, they could. Cylinder count does not dictate hp.
Point is, it's harder to do with a V6 than a V8 since V8s are almost always larger than V6s in terms of displacement (in modern mass produced cars) so it's almost like displacement and number of cylinders go hand-in-hand (except for exotics obviously). Can it be done? Yes, but it will cost too much and that's why it won't be happening in the Mustang. They should somehow bump it up to 350bhp to make it seem superior to the Ecoboost, even though the Ecoboost will make power earlier and be more efficient. It would be an engine option for people who can't afford a GT, but don't want a 4-cylinder Mustang. The Camaro's V6 is already at 323bhp so 350bhp isn't unattainable.

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If Ford wanted to make the 3.7L V6 make 400hp like the article says, they probably could. Would it still be an affordable, easily mass-produced engine for a base model car with the fuel economy/reliability/emissions expected from that segment? Nope. Which is exactly what I said; Porsche can do that (in a $100K car), your mass market car companies simply can't. It's not happening in the next two years. I don't really see what is so hard to understand about that. right back at ya.
Exactly.
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:32 AM   #388
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Genesis Coupe puts direct injected atmospheric V6 horsepower near 350.

Direct injection and VVEL on Nissan's VQ is in the same neighborhood.

The question is... will Ford put direct fuel injection on the 3.7 atmospheric engine (it has valve timing variability, but not DFI, only EcoBoost V6 has DFI, with the turbos)

If that is the case, and the rumor that the Ecoboost 2.3 I4 would be above the base V6, and below the GT V8... might get tougher, if the 3.7 V6 gets DFI, and ~330-350hp.

An EcoBoost I4 at ~270-ish horsepower, a V6 at 330-350hp, and the V8 (possibly DFI also?), above 420hp... might be a good mix.

And Genesis Coupe would probably match it engine for engine, if they put the Tau 5.0L V8 from the Genesis sedan into the coupe.
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Old 05-16-2013, 02:21 PM   #389
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If Ford wanted to make the 3.7L V6 make 400hp like the article says, they probably could. Would it still be an affordable, easily mass-produced engine for a base model car with the fuel economy/reliability/emissions expected from that segment? Nope. Which is exactly what I said; Porsche can do that (in a $100K car), your mass market car companies simply can't. It's not happening in the next two years. I don't really see what is so hard to understand about that. right back at ya.
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Originally Posted by SWP n Gold View Post
Point is, it's harder to do with a V6 than a V8 since V8s are almost always larger than V6s in terms of displacement (in modern mass produced cars) so it's almost like displacement and number of cylinders go hand-in-hand (except for exotics obviously). Can it be done? Yes, but it will cost too much and that's why it won't be happening in the Mustang. They should somehow bump it up to 350bhp to make it seem superior to the Ecoboost, even though the Ecoboost will make power earlier and be more efficient. It would be an engine option for people who can't afford a GT, but don't want a 4-cylinder Mustang. The Camaro's V6 is already at 323bhp so 350bhp isn't unattainable.



Exactly.
Exactly, Mustang
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:59 PM   #390
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I wouldn't worry too awful much about Hyundai. While their new 5.0 seems to be good, they haven't been much competition in the long run. The Genesis Coupe is a pretty small platform for a V8, and while it would probably sell like hotcakes assuming they could get the price range correct (it would have to clock in less than a Mustang GT, and that's not easy when a Genesis Coupe V6 already comes close to GT territory in price) there's not much of a market case for it to happen. They would have to make it some kind of limited "performance model". Even then, it would face stiff competition from what's on the market. About the only advantage they would have is wooing of 370Z cross-shoppers looking for more oomph.

Then the insurmountable issue becomes the fact that it's a Hyundai
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Old 05-16-2013, 06:18 PM   #391
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ask any Viper driver
Or LS/Vortec
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Old 05-16-2013, 07:18 PM   #392
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I wouldn't worry too awful much about Hyundai. While their new 5.0 seems to be good, they haven't been much competition in the long run. The Genesis Coupe is a pretty small platform for a V8, and while it would probably sell like hotcakes assuming they could get the price range correct (it would have to clock in less than a Mustang GT, and that's not easy when a Genesis Coupe V6 already comes close to GT territory in price) there's not much of a market case for it to happen. They would have to make it some kind of limited "performance model". Even then, it would face stiff competition from what's on the market. About the only advantage they would have is wooing of 370Z cross-shoppers looking for more oomph.

Then the insurmountable issue becomes the fact that it's a Hyundai
Hyundai is hungry, and targeting Mustang with the Genesis Coupe. And are likely to continue to. They aren't going to topple the Mustang, but competition is competition.

Hyundai also has the Genesis sedan, Equus, and likely the successor to the Borrego and Hyundai twin full-size SUV. Kia is also rumored to get RWD genesis-based sedans or possibly a Coupe.

Ford only really uses the Coyote engine in Mustang and F150, Expedition still uses the 5.4 SOHC, by comparison.

When you say Genesis V6 coupe comes close to Mustang GT on price... you are comparing fully loaded Genesis V6 Track to base Mustang GT. Add options comparable, and the Mustang V6 performance pack is similar priced, and an optioned out GT quickly approaches or surpasses $40K.

But I don't know that Ford would be doing quite right to keep direct fuel injection off the V6, and driving the EcoBoost 2.3 I4 very hard for more than 310hp at a higher price than the V6 equivalent.

I used Genesis as the example, because it is more likely, understandable, and likely less prone to technical problems to do similarly to the Genesis, with the Turbo I4 under 300hp, and under the ~350hp atmospheric V6 direct injected engine model's price tag...

IF Genesis continues to target Mustang, the Tau 5.0 equipped R-spec top-line would likely meet a well-optioned Mustang GT above $40K.
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Old 05-16-2013, 08:04 PM   #393
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Hyundai could very easily make a V8 version of the genesis coupe to directly take on the mustang, barely make a profit or even lose money on it, chalk it up as marketing or a loss leader, and could very easily gain a ton of customers... They are probably making plenty of money on other cars that they could afford to "lose" a little profit margin on the Genesis coupe... That would be a major South Korean Power Move. Could have the Ford and Chevy die hards shakin in their boots...
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:02 PM   #394
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The starting MSRP of a V-8 Genesis Coupe would be well above what it is for a Mustang GT (even though most that leave the lots have a number of options on them that add a bit). Today's GC 2.0T STARTS at $24,250, and the 3.8 STARTS at $28,750, so unless Hyundai wants to take big losses, a V-8 would have it start well into the 30s. And that Coyote engine is really good.
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:03 PM   #395
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Hyundai could very easily make a V8 version of the genesis coupe to directly take on the mustang, barely make a profit or even lose money on it, chalk it up as marketing or a loss leader, and could very easily gain a ton of customers... They are probably making plenty of money on other cars that they could afford to "lose" a little profit margin on the Genesis coupe... That would be a major South Korean Power Move. Could have the Ford and Chevy die hards shakin in their boots...
Sure they could but why bother? Nobody will buy it because it will be considerably more than a Mustang or Camaro. Ford and GM each sell 80,000 of these cars anually and Genesis Coupe/Sedan sales combined in their best year of sales didn't make 25,000 in the US. It's simply not a battle they can win head to head and pouring money into cars that wont sell or make profit isn't what got Hyundai to the up and coming company it is today. They would be better off making a better Genesis Coupe as the current car is pretty average at everything and great at nothing.
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:40 PM   #396
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Exactly, Mustang
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:41 PM   #397
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Sure they could but why bother? Nobody will buy it because it will be considerably more than a Mustang or Camaro. Ford and GM each sell 80,000 of these cars anually and Genesis Coupe/Sedan sales combined in their best year of sales didn't make 25,000 in the US. It's simply not a battle they can win head to head and pouring money into cars that wont sell or make profit isn't what got Hyundai to the up and coming company it is today. They would be better off making a better Genesis Coupe as the current car is pretty average at everything and great at nothing.
Why bother?? Stay average? Tell me you're not trolling... It's a loss leader strategy.. Gets more people into dealers, gets more attention directed towards the brand... Actually a somewhat common practice in the auto industry, and they are definitely at the point where they could benefit from it....10 years ago, not a chance... But now that they've established themselves, I could definitely see it happening...

The GT right now starts at 30,900... The 2015 will probably start at 32... They could definitely cost engineer the next genesis coupe to come in at a similar price. Of course this is all speculation, no one even knows if Hyundai will put a v8 in the coupe, but they could, and should, lets all hope they do....

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Old 05-16-2013, 10:44 PM   #398
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Hyundai does need a Halo Car. A 400+ GT Coupe could be the ticket.
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Old 05-17-2013, 12:24 AM   #399
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I really hope they troll everyone and release something that looks just like an 80's fox body 5.0 and completely blows all of this 'no more retro' talk out of the water.
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Old 05-17-2013, 01:02 AM   #400
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The GT right now starts at 30,900... The 2015 will probably start at 32...
Why assume a 7% increase just because new model year? I doubt that will happen... they would shoot themselves in the foot.
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