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Old 06-17-2014, 10:26 AM   #2201
lemming
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That doesn't make sense. The current V6 has later torque and HP peaks than I'd expect of a turbo 4.
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Old 06-17-2014, 10:37 AM   #2202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemming View Post
That doesn't make sense. The current V6 has later torque and HP peaks than I'd expect of a turbo 4.
Huh? The V6 makes over 80hp/l naturally aspirated. Of course it's going to have a late HP peak. We're not talking about a 220 hp 5.0l V8 here like the old days.

Turbo 4cyls can have early or late torque peaks, it's all about turbo sizing and tuning. My 1994 S4 made peak torque at 2,000 RPM. Modern direct-injected turbo cars have tremendously broad, flat torque curves which handily beat larger displacement N/A engines.
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Old 06-17-2014, 10:55 AM   #2203
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^ Also, bore stroke figures show that the 3.7 V6 is oversquare while the 2.3 EB is undersquare.
In fact, stroke of the V6 is nearly bore of the EB and nearly bore of V6 is stroke of the EB. This clearly shows that these 2 engines are polar opposites; the EB is going to produce a lot of power in the low to midrange. The V6 won't be able to keep up until much later in the revs (if at all).
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:10 AM   #2204
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Originally Posted by gpshumway View Post
Huh? The V6 makes over 80hp/l naturally aspirated. Of course it's going to have a late HP peak. We're not talking about a 220 hp 5.0l V8 here like the old days.
That was my point. Kostamojen suggested going with a V6 in response to KC's "don't care about top-end" comment. Which doesn't make sense because the V6 is more about top-end, and all signs seem to indicate that the EB isn't.

Quote:
Turbo 4cyls can have early or late torque peaks, it's all about turbo sizing and tuning.
I'm well aware of that. OE emphasis tends to be on early torque, though.
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:23 AM   #2205
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Not a complete "official" release, but pretty close.

http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/show...2015-2090.html
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:31 AM   #2206
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Originally Posted by neg_matnik View Post
^ Also, bore stroke figures show that the 3.7 V6 is oversquare while the 2.3 EB is undersquare.
In fact, stroke of the V6 is nearly bore of the EB and nearly bore of V6 is stroke of the EB. This clearly shows that these 2 engines are polar opposites; the EB is going to produce a lot of power in the low to midrange. The V6 won't be able to keep up until much later in the revs (if at all).

Larger bore with shorter stroke also usually means a better tolerance for higher RPM. The 4 cyl could be interesting, but god damn the weight is just killing that configuration's potential for me. The evo is pretty much the extent of weight for a 4 cyl turbo that I'm willing to accept. It's already near impossible to get the car going without starting at 3k rpm when it's hot and I have the AC on. The car wants to bog SO BADLY.
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Old 06-17-2014, 01:26 PM   #2207
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The 4 cyl could be interesting, but god damn the weight is just killing that configuration's potential for me. The evo is pretty much the extent of weight for a 4 cyl turbo that I'm willing to accept.
The weight of the EB Mustang MT (3517 lbs) just undercuts the weight of the EVO X GSR (3527 lbs), so the more powerful EB should move it just fine.
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Old 06-17-2014, 01:48 PM   #2208
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I am eager to see what it's power is. The mustang doesn't have the benefit of awd to help move the fat body around like the evo, but tire can easily make up for that.
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Old 06-17-2014, 02:06 PM   #2209
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I am eager to see what it's power is. The mustang doesn't have the benefit of awd to help move the fat body around like the evo, but tire can easily make up for that.
instead it has the benefit of much less drivetrain loss

oh, and 'merican muscle!
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Old 06-17-2014, 02:49 PM   #2210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WRXHillClimb View Post
Larger bore with shorter stroke also usually means a better tolerance for higher RPM. The 4 cyl could be interesting, but god damn the weight is just killing that configuration's potential for me. The evo is pretty much the extent of weight for a 4 cyl turbo that I'm willing to accept. It's already near impossible to get the car going without starting at 3k rpm when it's hot and I have the AC on. The car wants to bog SO BADLY.
Square or slightly under square is more ideal for turbocharged engines as it's less prone to detonation hence the over square EJ's propensity to crack ring lands.
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Old 06-17-2014, 02:55 PM   #2211
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Originally Posted by lemming View Post
That was my point. Kostamojen suggested going with a V6 in response to KC's "don't care about top-end" comment. Which doesn't make sense because the V6 is more about top-end, and all signs seem to indicate that the EB isn't.
Exactly my thoughts as well. Will have to wait and see what the published numbers become.

--kC
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:51 PM   #2212
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Square or slightly under square is more ideal for turbocharged engines as it's less prone to detonation hence the over square EJ's propensity to crack ring lands.
It's more ideal to me for every engine application!

Need some 10k rpm redline OEM engines out there with 100k mile warranties
That would be the bomb.
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Old 06-17-2014, 04:00 PM   #2213
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It's more ideal to me for every engine application!

Need some 10k rpm redline OEM engines out there with 100k mile warranties
That would be the bomb.
You want a motorcycle engine then.
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Old 06-17-2014, 04:03 PM   #2214
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That smartcar with a hayabusa engine comes to mind
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Old 06-18-2014, 01:30 PM   #2215
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You want a motorcycle engine then.
And that's kinda low for a moto too.
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Old 06-18-2014, 02:39 PM   #2216
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And that's kinda low for a moto too.
Agreed. Although, most single and twins spin to around 10K (the kind of engines I like in my bikes ).
Honda is even trying to start a trend with a long stroke parallel twin in their NC700 line of motorcycles; flat torque output, much lower emissions, higher tolerance for low octane gas but short 6.5K redline...
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Old 06-18-2014, 05:20 PM   #2217
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Yeah but I'm talking triples and L4 engines.

That NC700 looked interesting. Unfortunately traffic here sucks, roads here suck, and I don't trust myself not to die on a bike.
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Old 06-19-2014, 12:48 AM   #2218
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The mustangs are back out here road/track testing for the summer.

I saw a yellow one yesterday. That is the best looking mustang yet!
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Old 06-19-2014, 12:57 AM   #2219
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The mustangs are back out here road/track testing for the summer.

I saw a yellow one yesterday. That is the best looking mustang yet!
Is it the same triple-coat yellow from the Focus ST? I like it.
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Old 06-19-2014, 12:59 AM   #2220
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Its very close to the nasioc yellow. Haven't seen the ST yellow. They had all of them out here 5 months ago doing commercial shoots on the skid pad. I didn't see the yellow one back then.
All the engineers are taking them home each night now. Without armor on them.
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Old 06-19-2014, 07:38 AM   #2221
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Need some 10k rpm redline OEM engines out there with 100k mile warranties
That would be the bomb.
Litterally!

--kC
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Old 06-19-2014, 08:17 PM   #2222
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Its very close to the nasioc yellow. Haven't seen the ST yellow. They had all of them out here 5 months ago doing commercial shoots on the skid pad. I didn't see the yellow one back then.
All the engineers are taking them home each night now. Without armor on them.
If I were one of these guys, I definitely wouldn't drive straight back home. Lots of "testing" would take place along the way .
I'm hoping Ford will include the EB Mustang in their EcoBoost Challenge driving events. That'd be fun.
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Old 06-19-2014, 08:59 PM   #2223
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The mustangs are back out here road/track testing for the summer.

I saw a yellow one yesterday. That is the best looking mustang yet!
You're in the Phoenix area, right?
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Old 06-19-2014, 10:07 PM   #2224
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Any news on what might happen to the next gen Shelby?
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Old 06-19-2014, 10:34 PM   #2225
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You're in the Phoenix area, right?
Yup
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