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Old 01-24-2013, 07:12 PM   #2551
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I just joined the Subaru owners club so I could ask you guys some questions regarding Subaru's FB engines. I have never owned a Subaru vehicle but really like the looks and features of the upcoming 2014 Subaru Forester. But I have been on SubaruForester.org and found out some guys with the 2.5L FB engine are complaining of oil consumption with their vehicles. I have owned 8 vehicles and haven't had one that I had to oil between oil changes-3000 miles. Maybe I'm just lucky?
So did Subaru bring the 2.0L FB engine and 2.5L FB engine out at the same time? Are engines designed the same except for size? Just wondering if both engines are the same-is there a design problem causing the oil consumption issue?
Are just a few guys having problems or do you think it is a widespread problem? I can't believe that Subaru would be so stupid or arrogant to not admit they have a problem with the engine and oil consumption if there is a problem. People would never buy another vehicle from Subaru again. Do you think a person should wait 6 months or a year to see if there is a real problem with this engine(2.5L)? I really don't want to lay out $30,000.00 and have a brand new vehicle use oil. Also could you comment on reliability or problems with the CVT transmission. Thanks in advance for your help!
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Old 01-25-2013, 12:15 AM   #2552
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Its more than "just a few".
The onky difference between the fb20 and the fb25 is that the 2.0 has a smaller bore, essentially a sleeved-down fb25.
I was told "love is worth waiting for" in the ads. I pre-ordered my car. Was it worth it? Nope. Would I do it again? HELL NO, NO F'in Way.
If you really do want the new Forester, wait till some other poor souls have beta tested it.
Jusy my EXTREMELY BIASED OPINION.
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Old 01-25-2013, 12:18 AM   #2553
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I also dont think you're lucky to have owned 8 non-oil-burners. I have owned a plethora of cars and have never EVER experienced a phenomenon like the oil loss on my Impreza.
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Old 01-25-2013, 12:27 AM   #2554
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Originally Posted by sgoldste01 View Post
I guess I could live with that, as long as they provided a solution.
Yeah but for a corporation, their not identifying the problem isnt very reassuring. Its like when someone who drives a jalopy just starts replacing parts in the Autozone parking lot until its "fixed".

On another note- I saw a brand newish tdi blowing a TON of smoke today. Not normal diesel smoke, but baaaaad smoke. Not that the tdi was ever on my shopping list. Just giving creedence to your "tdi's suck worse" thesis.
The local VW dealer has a blue Golf R. Thats the car I would buy if I could afford it.
Too expensive for me though.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:00 AM   #2555
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No one really knows how many of Subaru's new engines are affected with an oil consumption problem, but I also believe that it is more than "just a few". Also, there's no concrete evidence that suggests what may be causing the problem and why some are affected and some are not. Subaru will probably never come out and admit there is an issue or reveal the percentage of cars that are experiencing excessive oil consumption, but I'm sure they have an idea and are working to quietly fix the situation. Subaru is replacing short blocks in cars that consume more than the rediculous max amount of 1 quart per 1200 miles, but there is no information about whether or not there is a revision in the replacement blocks. All I can say, is that if you really want a new Subaru, keep your fingers crossed that you get one with an engine that doesn't consume oil.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:24 AM   #2556
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When the '08 STI's were cracking ringlands left and right, SOA didn't really give a solid reason for the problem. Unless it is a blatant issue, I would expect most manufacturers to do what SOA is doing. Just fix them as they come. Its all about keeping the masses at bay and not causing paranoia. That said, if you have excessive consumption, they will fix it!

Some cars consume oil with any car, some don't. Having to add a quart of oil between changes is not that far from the ordinary. Just because you haven't in the past doesn't mean the car is defective if you have to now. I consume about half to 3/4 quart every 5k miles, I wouldn't expect SOA to give me a new shortblock.
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Old 01-25-2013, 04:28 AM   #2557
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Mode View Post
I just joined the Subaru owners club so I could ask you guys some questions regarding Subaru's FB engines. I have never owned a Subaru vehicle but really like the looks and features of the upcoming 2014 Subaru Forester. But I have been on SubaruForester.org and found out some guys with the 2.5L FB engine are complaining of oil consumption with their vehicles. I have owned 8 vehicles and haven't had one that I had to oil between oil changes-3000 miles. Maybe I'm just lucky?
So did Subaru bring the 2.0L FB engine and 2.5L FB engine out at the same time? Are engines designed the same except for size? Just wondering if both engines are the same-is there a design problem causing the oil consumption issue?
Are just a few guys having problems or do you think it is a widespread problem? I can't believe that Subaru would be so stupid or arrogant to not admit they have a problem with the engine and oil consumption if there is a problem. People would never buy another vehicle from Subaru again. Do you think a person should wait 6 months or a year to see if there is a real problem with this engine(2.5L)? I really don't want to lay out $30,000.00 and have a brand new vehicle use oil. Also could you comment on reliability or problems with the CVT transmission. Thanks in advance for your help!
I'd be hesitant to agree with some of the other people on this board about how many people are having issues. Out of the 81,799 Imprezas sold in the US last year only a handful of people are actively on the internet complaining about oil consumption. Keep in mind that most people don't write about a product that they are happy with so you may get the feeling that everyone is having issues with the car.

Personally I have been loving mine and I couldn't be happier. I have had it for about a year at this point and just hit 30,000 miles on my morning commute and I have yet to have to top off my oil. I run Castrol EDGE Titanium with a Bosch filter and change it every 6,000 miles. I wouldn't be too concerned with oil consumption as every manufacturer has the occasional lemon. My wife's Grand Prix has been using about a quart of oil every 1-2K since we bought it with ~30,000 miles on it. It's all about the luck of the draw.

The CVT has not been my favorite thing in the world but it has been reliable and it does what it needs to do. My main issues with it is the whine when it is cold and the way it shifts down so quickly when cresting a hill. I much preferred the driving characteristics of the Legacy CVT and of my 2010 Fusion Hybrid but it is by no means a bad transmission.

Hope this helps.
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Old 01-25-2013, 10:52 AM   #2558
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According to Rexy, there are definitely way more than "just a handful".
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Old 01-25-2013, 11:01 AM   #2559
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This is not the majority. I would go as far as to say it is a very small percentage. Just because we see people in the thread having consumption issues, doesn't mean most have them.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:15 PM   #2560
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I'll be diplomatic... and agree with that^
But I never said most of them do, but definitely a percentage. I'm not going to pretend to know what tht percentage is. But based on my talks with service departments and folks o. here, its definitely a problem. If you buy one of these cars just be aware that you need to watch the oil level.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:22 PM   #2561
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 79letour View Post
I'll be diplomatic... and agree with that^
But I never said most of them do, but definitely a percentage. I'm not going to pretend to know what tht percentage is. But based on my talks with service departments and folks o. here, its definitely a problem. If you buy one of these cars just be aware that you need to watch the oil level.
I agree! It does suck that some people are having issues, as I would be upset if I were consuming anywhere near the threshold.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:24 PM   #2562
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I may be able to get rid of this turd this year. Gotta go file my tax return.
There just arent any cars out there that I really feel like indebting myself further for.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:30 PM   #2563
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I like when this thread starts to get on a positive note.
Its been long and ugly at times, but I think if we were all drinking beers and discussing this in the real world the discussion would have been MUCH different.
Alzo my hat's off to the most non-nazi mods ever. In any other manufacturer-specific enthusiast forum this would have been shut down and I would have been banned wlong ago. Thanks for actually supporting free speech and allowing the discussion.
At least the mods have never been "out to get me"
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:05 PM   #2564
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I placed my order with the dealer April, 2012. While I was waiting for my order I saw this thread and thought the chances for my car with oil consumption problem is probably low, but thought there may still be some risk that i will get one with oil consumption. I took the risk and got my car in June 2012. Great car, i dont care about rattles or squeaky seat, it is very fun to drive. My engine is consuming oil, about 1/2 qt per 1000 miles at first. Have been filling it and watching oil level thinking it is break in related oil loss. Now oil light came on after1220 miles of oil change with 5.3 qts of Amsoil OE 0W20 fill. I am right at the threshold. If i drive it harder i just may get the light to come on earlier and get a short block replaced like others. But how do I know if this solves the problem? Going to wait and watch to see if Subaru will come out with a root cause as there isnt one as far as i know. I sold my 2003 accord for this car because it was consuming oil at 144K with a contaminated cat that needed to be replaced.

I took the risk with this car so i am living with it. In the mean time just going to continue document everything and fill it when it gets low, come summer time i should be burning enough oil to warrant a case for this to be addressed by subaru.
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:09 PM   #2565
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Pete, why wait until summer? Why not have the dealer start a consumption test now?
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Old 01-25-2013, 03:33 PM   #2566
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Since i am right at 1220 (a bit above 1200), i dont want them to deny warranty claim saying it is within the limit. Checked my dipstick last night when oil light came on the level is sitting above low dot by 1/4 inch, the dip stick looks like i am not low but oil light comes on tells me i am 1.1 qts low right?
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:10 AM   #2567
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Originally Posted by subypete View Post
I placed my order with the dealer April, 2012. While I was waiting for my order I saw this thread and thought the chances for my car with oil consumption problem is probably low, but thought there may still be some risk that i will get one with oil consumption. I took the risk and got my car in June 2012. Great car, i dont care about rattles or squeaky seat, it is very fun to drive. My engine is consuming oil, about 1/2 qt per 1000 miles at first. Have been filling it and watching oil level thinking it is break in related oil loss. Now oil light came on after1220 miles of oil change with 5.3 qts of Amsoil OE 0W20 fill. I am right at the threshold. If i drive it harder i just may get the light to come on earlier and get a short block replaced like others. But how do I know if this solves the problem? Going to wait and watch to see if Subaru will come out with a root cause as there isnt one as far as i know. I sold my 2003 accord for this car because it was consuming oil at 144K with a contaminated cat that needed to be replaced.

I took the risk with this car so i am living with it. In the mean time just going to continue document everything and fill it when it gets low, come summer time i should be burning enough oil to warrant a case for this to be addressed by subaru.

Wow...this makes me kinda sick. He knows about this thread...goes ahead and puts his trust in the "low percentage" and gets the oil problem....holy bleep...that sucks.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:32 AM   #2568
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Sorry bout your luck subypete.
I still think as time goes on more people will be facing this problem. I wish Subaru would be as concearned with fixing the bugs as they are about the lovey-dovey advertizing and sales figures.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:52 AM   #2569
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At least we're now hearing reports of people getting approved for short block replacements.

If Subaru is better than VW (and I'll bet you a beer that they are), then they will eventually figure out the root cause of this problem, and will then roll the solution into the assembly lines at the factory. This would be different from VW's approach, which is to keep building cars with a problem, even after they're figured out the root cause of the problem, and even after they've taken the time to engineer improved parts.

Don't ask me how I know this.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:28 AM   #2570
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What is interesting is I have yet to hear any 2013's that have consumption issues. They have been around long enough for it to surface.
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:37 PM   #2571
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ST Eye View Post
What is interesting is I have yet to hear any 2013's that have consumption issues. They have been around long enough for it to surface.
Just checked mine this morning, looks like it's down a half quart in about 2000 miles. Not 100% sure because the dipstick is kinda hard to read, on one side, it looks full, on the other, down a half quart.

Not terrible, but didn't expect a new, naturally aspirated Japanese car to use any amount of oil.
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Old 01-26-2013, 07:00 PM   #2572
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Quote:
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What is interesting is I have yet to hear any 2013's that have consumption issues. They have been around long enough for it to surface.
I'm grateful that mine hasn't displayed any such behaviour yet. *knockonwood*

My dipstick was displaying between 1/4" and 1/2" from the top mark, but was consistently at that level throughout the first 6800 km (about 4200 miles for you non-metric types).

I first started monitoring the dipstick the first week after taking delivery of the car (Oct 2012), so it was probably already that way before it got shoved onto the boat. I'm going to continue monitoring the oil for at least the next few oil changes (probably until about year 3), but I think perhaps whatever was causing oil consumption in the 2012s might (and I stress might) have been attended to in the 2013s. (Fingers crossed!)

The more worrisome concern for me is the coolant, because it was hovering at or marginally below low for about 4800 km (3000 miles) before my oil change. It's been suggested that whoever did the PDI didn't do it correctly (I'm inclined to agree). I'm currently also monitoring that and will continue to do so until I feel satisfied that it's not a consumption issue.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:15 AM   #2573
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Thanks for the replies regarding my concerns about buying a new Forester because of potential oil consumption issues. Just thought I would let you know that I was on a forum on the SubaruForester.org site and one member posted some interesting information. He stated that Toyota has dropped their specs for oil consumption to 1.1QT/600 miles. Audi's spec is also 1QT/600 miles. He also said that Subaru lowered the consumption rate for the BRZ to 1QT/600 miles. What he said was "welcome to the world of stringent fuel economy numbers. Is it an engine problem or an oil problem? Maybe oil consumption is something that every car owner is going to have to expect now. That is the price of CAFE standards I guess." After reading this post by him, I did some googling and there are lots of people with Toyotas with oil consumption problems as well. If the manufacturers are putting in 0W-20 oil just to increase fuel economy but it is causing oil consumption issues and ticked off customers, is it really worth it? If it really was just the oil causing the problem, wouldn't they quietly tell their Service departments to recommend customers switch to 5W-30 oil and tell them warranty and engine longevity wouldn't be affected? What do you guys think?
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:01 PM   #2574
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Mode View Post
Thanks for the replies regarding my concerns about buying a new Forester because of potential oil consumption issues. Just thought I would let you know that I was on a forum on the SubaruForester.org site and one member posted some interesting information. He stated that Toyota has dropped their specs for oil consumption to 1.1QT/600 miles. Audi's spec is also 1QT/600 miles. He also said that Subaru lowered the consumption rate for the BRZ to 1QT/600 miles. What he said was "welcome to the world of stringent fuel economy numbers. Is it an engine problem or an oil problem? Maybe oil consumption is something that every car owner is going to have to expect now. That is the price of CAFE standards I guess." After reading this post by him, I did some googling and there are lots of people with Toyotas with oil consumption problems as well. If the manufacturers are putting in 0W-20 oil just to increase fuel economy but it is causing oil consumption issues and ticked off customers, is it really worth it? If it really was just the oil causing the problem, wouldn't they quietly tell their Service departments to recommend customers switch to 5W-30 oil and tell them warranty and engine longevity wouldn't be affected? What do you guys think?
Unfortunately, 0W-20 oil isn't the only culprit. Some of us have tried various heavier weight oils with the same consumption results as with 0W20. Also, if 0W20 was the only reason why these engines are consuming oil, how come most are not? Just some food for though...

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Old 01-27-2013, 05:02 PM   #2575
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Quote:
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Unfortunately, 0W-20 oil isn't the only culprit. Some of us have tried various heavier weight oils with the same consumption results as with 0W20. Also, if 0W20 was the only reason why these engines are consuming oil, how come most are not? Just some food for though...
Mine burnt the 5w30 Syntec faster than the 0w20 Edge. More food for thought...
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