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Old 02-05-2013, 07:49 AM   #2751
sgoldste01
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Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
"Small" is a relative term, and only Subaru knows what that number is. It could be 1%, it could be 25%. I believe it is within that range.
Well, that's an incredibly wide range. I don't think anyone would classify 25% as "a small percentage".

I'm going to be presumptuous and define "a small percentage" as 3% or less. I follow the VW TDI forums very closely. The current models of VW TDIs are known to have High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) issues. People on those forums (who are mostly pro-VW, and think their cars are great even as they get stranded on the side of the road) claim that "a small percentage" of VW TDIs ever have HPFP issues, with people on those forums estimating that 3% of 2010 TDIs have the problem, 2% of 2011 TDIs have the problem, and 1% of 2012/2013 TDIs have the problem. This data is supported by Consumer Reports' reliability reports, which give black dots (very bad reliability, affecting at least 2% of owners) to the fuel systems of VW TDIs in the 2010/2011 model years.

[NOTE: I think these percentage are accurate today, but that they will rise over time. For example, I think that next year the percentage of affected 2010 TDIs will rise to 4%, 2011 TDI's will rise to 3%, and so on.]

Because I follow both the VW TDI forums and this Subaru Impreza forum very closely, I can tell you that there is WAY more activity on the VW TDI forums with regard to people experiencing HPFP problems than there is on this forum with people experiencing oil consumption. This is also supported by Consumer Reports' reliability data, which shows very high reliability for the 2012+ Impreza.

So my very unscientific theory is that less than 1% of 2012+ Impreza owners are experiencing oil consumption problems. I don't have the data to back up my claim. But I can tell you for a fact that many, many more people on the TDI forums are complaining of HPFP issues than are here complaining of oil consumption, and that the VW TDI fanboys are claiming that the HPFP problem only affects "a small percentage of TDIs".
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Old 02-05-2013, 08:28 AM   #2752
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Since oil consumption is more a long-term problem, its not probable to affect reliability ratings.
While I share your feelings about vw, these are two completely different cars with completely different types of problems.
With a pos fuel pump, you may end up stranded, but with poorly seated rings (?) or something similar, one is basically stuck with something that isnt of the same quality as the non-oil-burners. Shorter engine life and the cheeziness of having to carry oil around and monitor the oil constantly are the problems Impreza owners are facing.
While I do agree that the VW tdi situation sucks,I bought a Subaru. The tdi isnt even on my radar.
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Old 02-05-2013, 08:36 AM   #2753
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Even if its 1 or 2% thats still A LOT of unsatisfied owners. Are we including brz/frs and foresters? Based on speculation and conversations with Forester owners, I think its a higher percentage.
But I dont work for soa so I dont have the number of complaints and "unique individuals".
So really its anyones guess.

I wonder if CR watches the dipstick these days...
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:05 AM   #2754
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Originally Posted by 79letour View Post
Since oil consumption is more a long-term problem, its not probable to affect reliability ratings.
While I share your feelings about vw, these are two completely different cars with completely different types of problems.
With a pos fuel pump, you may end up stranded, but with poorly seated rings (?) or something similar, one is basically stuck with something that isnt of the same quality as the non-oil-burners. Shorter engine life and the cheeziness of having to carry oil around and monitor the oil constantly are the problems Impreza owners are facing.
While I do agree that the VW tdi situation sucks,I bought a Subaru. The tdi isnt even on my radar.
I disagree with your statement that "oil consumption is more a long-term problem, its not probable to affect reliability ratings". If Impreza owners are bringing their cars into the dealership for consumption tests and short block replacements, then that will show up in Consumer Reports' reliability data.

I'm not trying to sell you a TDI. I'm not trying to tell you to be happy with your Impreza's oil consumption. I'm simply trying to help quantify what "a small percentage" means, and I'm trying to say that if the TDI problems affect "a small percentage" of TDIs (1% to 3%), then the percentage of affected Imprezas is an even smaller percentage (less than 1%).
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:14 AM   #2755
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***********
Quote:
Originally Posted by sgoldste01 View Post
Well, that's an incredibly wide range. I don't think anyone would classify 25% as "a small percentage".

I'm going to be presumptuous and define "a small percentage" as 3% or less. I follow the VW TDI forums very closely. The current models of VW TDIs are known to have High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) issues. People on those forums (who are mostly pro-VW, and think their cars are great even as they get stranded on the side of the road) claim that "a small percentage" of VW TDIs ever have HPFP issues, with people on those forums estimating that 3% of 2010 TDIs have the problem, 2% of 2011 TDIs have the problem, and 1% of 2012/2013 TDIs have the problem. This data is supported by Consumer Reports' reliability reports, which give black dots (very bad reliability, affecting at least 2% of owners) to the fuel systems of VW TDIs in the 2010/2011 model years.

[NOTE: I think these percentage are accurate today, but that they will rise over time. For example, I think that next year the percentage of affected 2010 TDIs will rise to 4%, 2011 TDI's will rise to 3%, and so on.]

Because I follow both the VW TDI forums and this Subaru Impreza forum very closely, I can tell you that there is WAY more activity on the VW TDI forums with regard to people experiencing HPFP problems than there is on this forum with people experiencing oil consumption. This is also supported by Consumer Reports' reliability data, which shows very high reliability for the 2012+ Impreza.

So my very unscientific theory is that less than 1% of 2012+ Impreza owners are experiencing oil consumption problems. I don't have the data to back up my claim. But I can tell you for a fact that many, many more people on the TDI forums are complaining of HPFP issues than are here complaining of oil consumption, and that the VW TDI fanboys are claiming that the HPFP problem only affects "a small percentage of TDIs".
RexyGirl provided this number for Impreza's sold in the US, since this issue also affects Canada, and at least one person on this thread has posted about the problem in Canada, and two more months have passed, add 15,000+ sold to this number (and probably more, please tell us if you know the total sold in Canada since the new Impreza was introduced):

"The actual, year to date to date total of Imprezas sold up to November 30th, 2012 is 62,312."

Let's use 75,000 sold as the baseline:

1% of 75,000 = 750 cars
25% of 75,000=18,750 cars

Wow, if it is almost 19,000 cars affected this forum is not getting the attention it deserves, it isn't like this conversation is hard to find...

Let Me Google That For You

Now as far as unique individuals on this thread who have the issue, I've counted less than 20. If the actual number is 10 times that, 200, the percent using oil is a whopping 0.26%....

And no, even if Consumer Reports has one of those cars (they have not reported that they do, yet), it does not mean a higher percent are affected, it only means they got one of the few that are consuming oil.

Last edited by Zeeper; 02-05-2013 at 09:29 AM.
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Old 02-05-2013, 09:24 AM   #2756
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RexyGirl also said that virtually ALL the cars that they service that have fb engines require oil top-offs. And that "the Foresters hardly ever come in with more than 2 or 3 quarts left".
Thats part of the reason I dismiss the 1% figure.
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:10 AM   #2757
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Heres yet another familiar scenario-

http://carproblemzoo.com/subaru/impr...l-problems.php
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Old 02-05-2013, 01:15 PM   #2758
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http://www.autotap.com/techlibrary/c...o2_sensors.asp

thats the long term reliability effects of oil consumption.
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Old 02-05-2013, 01:29 PM   #2759
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Originally Posted by 79letour View Post
http://www.autotap.com/techlibrary/c...o2_sensors.asp

thats the long term reliability effects of oil consumption.
You're right.

I think you should sell your Impreza before it depreciates any more. Sometimes when a product is a complete disappointment, you just have to cut your losses and move on.

You already know that I speak from experience.
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Old 02-05-2013, 01:39 PM   #2760
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Originally Posted by 79letour View Post
If Subaru had a new "rs" with a 175-200hp engine that doesnt burn oil, and a proper six speed, maybe I'll own another... But I really cant see buying a Sube if I had it to do over again. I should have bought another used car.
Everyone I know has had really good experiences with their Mercedes. The old man down the road and I talk cars a lot. 20ish will buy a decent used Benz.
Might buy you you a new Benz but ANY work that needs to be done cost three times as much. My mother has one, I know the expenses. I know they are reliable buy Mercedes has mechanics also. They DO break down. If you can't afford a brand new merc then chances are one mechanical problem will overwhelm you. Please don't take this the wrong way. I have a 12 wrx and love it but a merc would suck me dry. Hope thing work out for you
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:25 PM   #2761
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Default Brakes

Anyone have problems with the brakes too! It's crazy! 45K on my 2012 Impreza and the brakes are bad, and rubbing on the rotors. And yeah, I should have heard it, but I had the heater blowing and was driving in crappy weather, so it's hard to hear all the little extras. Plus, 45K for brakes? And no, it's not the way I drive. Never had the problem on my other vehicles.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:29 PM   #2762
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Anyone have problems with the brakes too! It's crazy! 45K on my 2012 Impreza and the brakes are bad, and rubbing on the rotors. And yeah, I should have heard it, but I had the heater blowing and was driving in crappy weather, so it's hard to hear all the little extras. Plus, 45K for brakes? And no, it's not the way I drive. Never had the problem on my other vehicles.
Where do you live? Do you drive on roads with lots of snow/salt/dirt? I know you have 45k miles on the car. How long (in months) have you owned it?

You probably just need to pull the brakes, and then clean everything and lubricate the slider pins.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:35 PM   #2763
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Where do you live? Do you drive on roads with lots of snow/salt/dirt? I know you have 45k miles on the car. How long (in months) have you owned it?

You probably just need to pull the brakes, and then clean everything and lubricate the slider pins.

Took delivery end of December 2011. Live on a dirt road, drive 140 miles / day. lots of sand and salt. Live in SW NY state.

Thanks for the pointer, maybe I'll get lucky and it's just the pads..
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:44 PM   #2764
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45k he he wanna change, my honda ate brakes every 15k due the the ebd being rear biased. I drop in to hawk ceramics to mitigate having to change brakes materials often.

45 is pretty good right no one belives my blanket statements so:
http://www.accordsettlement.com/

you can google any car brand, and have fun with premature brake wear. In comparison to the following cars I have driven this past year: mazda 6, hyundai tucson, kia soul, 2011 honda civic sedan, kia optimo, your subaru has better stopping and less brake fade and wear than the pad materials on these vehicles. Manufacturers lately have been skimping on tires, brakes, wiper blades as cost cutting measures.

PS: honda has redesigned the accord brakes 4/5 times now and the problem continues, I would be very careful if you get a new accord
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:46 PM   #2765
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hmm dirt road, debris on pads or rotors is defintely likely, rocks can also find there way into places that can make your brakes go nutty. You can try reversing to see if the wheels can get rid of the rocks and do what sgoldste01 says
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:28 PM   #2766
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:47 PM   #2767
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Looks like Honda is replacing a string of bad Compression rings. THIS IS WHY YOU NEED TO CHECK YOUR COMPRESSION AND LEAK DOWN 79! They seem to have pin pointed the production numbers also

They are also not afraid of telling each other their whole Vin numbers. They seem to have their crap together.
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:48 PM   #2768
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No brake problems. knock on wood...
They dont have a lot of stpping force imo, but theyre holding up well.
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:52 PM   #2769
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While i'm very sure that other manufacturers produce oil-burners, we are wondering why not ALL fb engined subarus burn oil and some of us do.
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:54 PM   #2770
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Originally Posted by auskip07 View Post
Looks like Honda is replacing a string of bad Compression rings. THIS IS WHY YOU NEED TO CHECK YOUR COMPRESSION AND LEAK DOWN 79! They seem to have pin pointed the production numbers also

They are also not afraid of telling each other their whole Vin numbers. They seem to have their crap together.
Can't you rent the equipment for free at Autozone?
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:54 PM   #2771
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While i'm very sure that other manufacturers produce oil-burners, we are wondering why not ALL fb engined subarus burn oil and some of us do.
In the links provided, not all of those cars burn oil either??
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Old 02-05-2013, 03:58 PM   #2772
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Can't you rent the equipment for free at Autozone?
or you can go to harbor freight and make it for 15 dollars in parts
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Old 02-05-2013, 04:03 PM   #2773
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If you're thinking about getting a used Volvo or Mercedes and have the means to do so, why don't you go ahead and pull the trigger? Life is too short to be upset over a machine IMO!
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Old 02-05-2013, 04:41 PM   #2774
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Can't you rent the equipment for free at Autozone?
Yeah, but just like me monitoring and noting my oil consumption, it has to be dealer-verified. So no sense in doing something that has to be done by subaru.
I am going to have a consumption test started at my next service visit.
The results of this will determine if soa will do a leak-down test.
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Old 02-05-2013, 04:45 PM   #2775
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I just today read this entire thread from the beginning.
Wow.
Thanks to all who have remained objective and on subject. And many thanks to the few of you who have followed along who have been sympathetic to my plight.
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