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Old 04-28-2005, 02:11 PM   #1
AsphaltsCry
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Default Ej20g + Ej257 = ?

So the EJ20 G that i spent the better part of a year installing, **** the bed on me. Turns out the vibration in the engine was not the transmission mount but the engine firing on three cylinders. Upon dissassembly i discovered the piston squirter on #4 had vibrated out somehow. And i think that the lack of lubrication/cooling/ previous owner abuse caused the thrown rod which i also discovered, thereby sending the freed piston into the innocent valves.

anyway... I checked the heads and they are ok, so i ordered EJ257 shortblock and that will be here in a few days. what headgaskets are advisable to run, given the large head capacity of the EJ20G heads and the resulting low compression ratio? Also what timing belt is best? EJ257?

I was also concerned about the oil pan. The STi oil pan is reversed 180 degrees from normal. I am not getting this oil pan with the shortblock. Is the oil pan dependant on the oil pickup, in which case i could use the pickup and pan from the EJ20G?

Lastly, with a EJ20G intake manifold, do you think a helix TMIC should fit. Their site listed the width at 8", but i think that is just the core itself.

Oh and can you snip the tips on EJ20G injectors like you can with the pinks?

I will be using the stock TD05 16G for now.

I would really appreciate any insight people have to offer.
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Old 04-28-2005, 04:00 PM   #2
Scoobie Steve
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Some good questions here. I would say you need to run the ej257 headgasket, check to make sure some of the cooling passages line up. I dont think the EJ257 short block comes with any timing belt idlers or tensioner. I think they still drill the newer Phase II blocks for the old style tensioner. Just use the G oil pan and pickup, clean them very well.

There are alot of "I thinks" in there good luck and lets us know how you make out

Did you check the valves with thinner? A visual inspection won't always find bent valves?

Dont mod the injectors unless you plan on some kind of engine management
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Old 04-28-2005, 06:24 PM   #3
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Noah at Cobb runs this set up on his wagon. To my knowledge he didn't have any major issues. Use the EJ257 head gaskets. And you can use the old tensioner on that block with no problems. EJ257 timing belt is fine.

I wouldn't mess with the injectors either. Injectors that old are delicate and you might mess them up in addition to the EM comments.

BTW, what EM are you using? The larger volume of the Ej25 may cause some tuning issues...
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Old 04-28-2005, 08:34 PM   #4
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Well as for the valve story, i am replacing the #4 valves anyway, although i am considering ordering all new valves, which brings up the question of what SOA valves to order. I know that the EJ20G heads are manual lash adjustment. The funny thing is that physically the rest of the head is the same as a 96 DOHC 2.5 head, which is HLA. So does that mean i order valves from SOA out of a 96 2.5 DOHC ? I have to look around the shop some more and see if i can dig up some old valves to compare.
i checked the plane of the heads with a straighedge and they aren;t warped. upon plastigauging the cam bearings i even i found them to be within factory specs. i was kind of surprised at this given this is an a MY 95 engine and that the one ehaust cam was seized in the head from the piston striking the valves in #4. This caused a few scuffs in the center cam bearing on the exhaust cam, but you can;t catch a fingernail on it. and it is in spec... so i will just keep an eye the oil pressure

and the fueling issue..... well i don;t plan on modding the injectors right now, just curious if i could in the future, since it would be cheaper than SR20 injectors. Although i know i will need more fuel due to increased displacement. But i feel like i have a few things in my favour. 1) that i have that special 5th injector which might help, i mean it could, humour me. 2) that i know it is pretty common for people to swap NA EJ22s into legacys and foresters with NA EJ25 DOHC that have headgaskets problems, not that thats all that common (SOA with gun to back* grin * grin*) and in those cases they would run rich for a little while, then the O2 would see a rich mixture and it would just lean it out. and they run fine. 3) I don't think 500 cc is that big of a difference. i know a couple of independand shops that do these swaps regularly around here... or at least when people had those leaky 2.5 DOHC.

well athough the hydra looks very nice, they don;t currently make a version for the GC8, just the NA ones, WRX, and STi, like everyone else.
i was considering the possum-link from possum borne and link enterprises. they have one for early WRX which would be plug and play. About time. but then i would have to get a single DIN fold out monitor and hard drive under the seat to monitor it..... sigh


shortblock is supposed to come in tommorow
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Old 04-28-2005, 09:02 PM   #5
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I just completed this conversion on 97 L.
EJ20G heads
257 Block
use the 257 headgaskets
stock pan and pickup works fine.
The helix topmount will definitely NOT FIT, stock wrx IC fits tight let alone an upgraded unit.

As far as the injectors, I looked at them, they do NOT look snip friendly
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Old 04-28-2005, 09:19 PM   #6
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I think the yellow top 440cc from a ver 5/6 STi are a drop in for the G. They are mod friendly if you decide to get crazy in the future
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Old 04-28-2005, 10:59 PM   #7
AsphaltsCry
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good to know about the helix top mount. I knew people had problems RS manifolds and big top mounts... well top mounts period.. thought the EJ20G throttle body might be farther forward. maybe one from a FXT or baja turbo... wide and short.... sneak off to the showroom

although if a WRX fits. a STi should work as well
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Old 04-28-2005, 11:01 PM   #8
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Current engine set up:

EJ257 shortblock
EJ20K heads/intake manifold
IHI VF30 (replaced VF23 that whined like a bratty 3 yr. old)
Clapped out STi V3 TMIC.
STi 440 cc yellow top injectors (stock on STi V3)
Apexi Power FC EMS
Scoobysport 2.5" turboback exhaust w/one cat in midpipe

Here's what she did today @ Godspeed:

1st clean run on the Apexi Power FC vs. peak power run.


We turned the boost down a bit to decrease the chance of detonation (got some with higher boost levels) to ~ 1.2 bar (17.5 psi)
True HP/Torque is ~ 280 hp/326 ft. lbs of torque.


STi V3 EJ20 w/~ 1.1/1.2 bar (last summer before she blew up) vs. Peak power run today.

She's probably get some bigger injectors (very very surprised that the stock 440's push as much power as they do) a more effecient IC, and some more dyno time.

I'm very happy w/her powAh level right now. She'll be a blast @ the autoX and on the strip.

-mykr.

Last edited by mykrrrr; 04-29-2005 at 05:18 PM.
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Old 04-29-2005, 12:30 AM   #9
Scoobie Steve
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Holy torque drop off. Whats up with that? Impressive peak number.


The yellow top injectors are underrated. If someone had them flowed numbers would be closer to 500cc.
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Old 04-29-2005, 12:45 PM   #10
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If your Ej20G has manually adjusting heads, then those are STi heads. All of the non-STi WRX EJ20G's has HLA's under bucket...

v5/v6 STi yellow injectors will work on that manifold, but if you've got an STi EJ20G top end, your injectors already flow about the same. What color are they?

And mykrrr, an STi v3 should be an EJ20K with the head redesign...
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Old 04-29-2005, 01:15 PM   #11
Jaxx
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i was thinking the same thing v.3 -ej20k is it coil on plug or coil pack on manafold?

v5/v.6 are phase 2 side feed (taller than phase 1)

v.2 (phase 1 yellow top) are 550s
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Old 04-29-2005, 05:18 PM   #12
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Sorry...typed the wrong character.

Coil pack on manifold.

Not exactly what's up w/the torque drop off. Any speculations?

-mykr.
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Old 04-29-2005, 05:28 PM   #13
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its only a vf-30 ... i woudl suspect your running out of turbo

ej20k then
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Old 04-29-2005, 08:14 PM   #14
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[quote=Matt Monson]If your Ej20G has manually adjusting heads, then those are STi heads. All of the non-STi WRX EJ20G's has HLA's under bucket...

when i decoded my vin, i found i had a V1 WRX RA from a sedan

v5/v6 STi yellow injectors will work on that manifold, but if you've got an STi EJ20G top end, your injectors already flow about the same. What color are they?

not sure i haven't taken them out of the manifold yet. i just got the shortblock today and was cleaning up my oil pan (took forever) and puting it on. Tommorow i will do some more swapping of sensors and get the heads ready for the EJ257 headgaskets which are coming on monday, they were backordered when parts checked them yesterday, but today it was listed in stock in the warehouse. so they will be here monday
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Old 04-29-2005, 09:56 PM   #15
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i don't think so
i think you want
v.2 injectors or sr20 injectors

i have a set of sr20 550s in my garage that i am going to play with after this weekends autocross is done (no evens for a month)
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Old 04-30-2005, 09:33 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaxx
its only a vf-30 ... i woudl suspect your running out of turbo

ej20k then
That and the fact that the IC isn't in the best of shape.

Power is good enough for me right now.

You should have heard the death whine of the VF23...

-mykr.
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Old 04-30-2005, 09:59 AM   #17
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LObester Glad to see you ,made it to the forums
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Old 06-09-2005, 06:21 PM   #18
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i am running ej20g heads and a ej257 block =x
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Old 09-28-2005, 08:22 PM   #19
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so does anyone know the compression of this combination? g heads and a 257 block?
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Old 09-29-2005, 12:33 PM   #20
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random dig dugging of og post.

seems like the 5th jecktor shows up on WRX-RA non sti's as well. must be sti fagtory option then..
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Old 09-29-2005, 03:26 PM   #21
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pm suberboy he is running it
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Old 09-29-2005, 06:39 PM   #22
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IIRC it is somewhere around 7.8:1 The Ej20G heads have a 57cc combustion chamber, and the STi bottom end has less piston dish than an Ej205. You can run the math on Ejcalcs...
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Old 09-29-2005, 10:26 PM   #23
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what is the 205 combustion chamber?
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Old 09-29-2005, 11:52 PM   #24
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Don't order the 96 EJ25 DOHC valves. You need the hollow stem sodium valves from the EJ20G. There is a special procedure for discarding the old bent ones that may be worth taking a look into as well.


Jay Storm
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Old 09-30-2005, 02:40 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson
IIRC it is somewhere around 7.8:1 The Ej20G heads have a 57cc combustion chamber, and the STi bottom end has less piston dish than an Ej205. You can run the math on Ejcalcs...
when i did that same messurment i got a CR of about 9.1:1 using a EJ257 head gasket.
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