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Old 05-10-2014, 09:55 AM   #1
flyinpig
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Default FHI Focus on STI Brand

From a response.jp article - from the 5/9 conference.

Yasuyuki Yoshinaga (FHI President & CEO):
Quote:
Especially with car enthusiasts, STI has great brand appeal and it's a valuable asset to us. We put this into our (most recent) management vision. We want to strengthen the STI brand.
Effective April 1, the former FHI Corporate Senior VP & Senior GM of Subaru's Engineering Division, Yoshio Hirakawa, has been appointed STI's new President (and Technical Advisor of FHI).

Quote:
We would like to develop a plan by reviewing our activities including motorsports.
Naoto Mutou (Director & FHI Corporate Executive VP):
Quote:
The STI brand has represented a sporty ride, and now, we will develop it towards offering a more refined driving experience. STI cars are assembled by first disassembling a base model and then adding STI parts. If we can assemble them on a line like a mass production vehicle, we can better meet customer needs while improving efficiencies.
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Old 05-10-2014, 10:32 AM   #2
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Quote:

"We would like to develop a plan by reviewing our activities including motorsports."

I hope this includes a return to American Road Racing! I mean KIA is actually contending a viable car for the second year.

Quote:

"The STI brand has represented a sporty ride, and now, we will develop it towards offering a more refined driving experience. STI cars are assembled by first disassembling a base model and then adding STI parts. If we can assemble them on a line like a mass production vehicle, we can better meet customer needs while improving efficiencies."

We all know this means profit..but what the hell. If produces good cars at a fair price, go for it.
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Old 05-10-2014, 11:11 AM   #3
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Maybe this will lead to the return of the $32k base STI price?
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Old 05-10-2014, 11:28 AM   #4
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Pretty sure this is referring to STI special vehicles, not STI production vehicles (IE TS, S20X etc....)
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Old 05-10-2014, 12:12 PM   #5
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I'm holding my breath.
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Old 05-10-2014, 05:46 PM   #6
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Don't like the line about being more refined.
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Old 05-10-2014, 05:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skanky View Post
Don't like the line about being more refined.
Why not?

Turning STI into something more like AMG or M// would be a good thing. Then they can still have hardcore cars (like the black series) that are just bonkers!
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Old 05-10-2014, 11:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
Why not? Turning STI into something more like AMG or M// would be a good thing. Then they can still have hardcore cars (like the black series) that are just bonkers!
Refined is code for boring basically. You want a refined torque curve like the E90 m3? Ok enjoy the immense boredom that provides. 3800lb car with the same amount of torque as a wrx that doesn't come in an exciting lump. You refine that lump out and you just get smooth, boring acceleration. Bam BMW.
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Old 05-11-2014, 12:34 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by litany View Post
Refined is code for boring basically. You want a refined torque curve like the E90 m3? Ok enjoy the immense boredom that provides. 3800lb car with the same amount of torque as a wrx that doesn't come in an exciting lump. You refine that lump out and you just get smooth, boring acceleration. Bam BMW.
So linear torque curve is boring, and the sloppy torque is better. What automotive era am I in?
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Old 05-11-2014, 12:39 AM   #10
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The '08-'10 STI was a move to refine the STI. It had the LGT's soft LCA bushings and wallowed around like a pig. The Japanese market that can afford STIs wants a nice ride to drive clients around in while still enjoying the STI brand prestige from their youth. They don't want them to go to track days with. Remember, the WRX doesn't even exist in Japan anymore.. they got the S-GT in '08 instead and then that has been replaced by the Levorg. Refinement is a terrible direction for STI to go.
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Old 05-11-2014, 08:46 AM   #11
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I always wondered how the Sti fabrication worked.

I guess the engines came off the assembly line, were shipped off to Sti, they disassembled them, upgraded them, reassembled them manually, then they were shipped back to the line and put into the selected chassis (for the S cars).

Sti was a very self-contained business, with probably a separate set of engineers and technicians. They were clearly involved in factory racing program in the past.
The parts programs carry a notice to call Sti direct for specialized parts of the S cars.
Having a separate parts system and part numbers and parts organization is not efficient.

This can mean as little as relocating these guys and the facilities into the Subaru factory, maybe reducing the cost to put together an S car and maybe making more of them.

Refinement is a bad word though ..
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Old 05-11-2014, 11:57 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scino View Post
So linear torque curve is boring, and the sloppy torque is better. What automotive era am I in?
Yeah when it comes to an exciting feel for the car it is. Is it maybe technically better on the track? Sure. Does it FEEL like something exciting is happening? No. Have you ever driven one? Even reviews of it mention it's boring lol. In many ways Refinement sucks.
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Old 05-11-2014, 12:02 PM   #13
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Well it doesn't. If it does, they should use single scroll turbo with a lot of lag so they you don't have a smooth throttle response. And that would be exciting for you. I have 15 WRX and I love it a world better than the one it replaces. Every review says it's better as well.
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Old 05-11-2014, 12:44 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scino View Post
Well it doesn't. If it does, they should use single scroll turbo with a lot of lag so they you don't have a smooth throttle response. And that would be exciting for you. I have 15 WRX and I love it a world better than the one it replaces. Every review says it's better as well.
People need to start putting what transmission they have on their '15 WRX.

'15 WRX but no mention of the transmission type is like half of the cookie.

Do you like eating half of anything?
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Old 05-11-2014, 01:59 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scino View Post
Well it doesn't. If it does, they should use single scroll turbo with a lot of lag so they you don't have a smooth throttle response. And that would be exciting for you. I have 15 WRX and I love it a world better than the one it replaces. Every review says it's better as well.
The '15 WRX also has a stiffer suspension than any previous WRX and a noisemaker inside the dash... the opposite of refinement.
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Old 05-11-2014, 02:40 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A W View Post
People need to start putting what transmission they have on their '15 WRX.

'15 WRX but no mention of the transmission type is like half of the cookie.

Do you like eating half of anything?
Ok, let me try again, 2015 Subaru WRX WRB Pearl limited HK/Keyless 6MT Full front Xpel Ultimate wrap with interior LED light mod.

Edit: the only thing I hate the most about the new WRX is the shifter. It's just bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
The '15 WRX also has a stiffer suspension than any previous WRX and a noisemaker inside the dash... the opposite of refinement.
I was talking about torque curve, not chassis. However stiffer chassis doesn't mean harsher ride. Not to mention the new WRX chassis is just a stiffened Impreza chassis, it wouldn't be as stiff as those IS/3/C chassis. There are many other element that make a car raws without losing refinement, something like magnetic ride control.

Last edited by Scino; 05-11-2014 at 02:46 PM.
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Old 05-14-2014, 05:49 PM   #17
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read somewhere in an article, an american one in an interview with the cheaf that leads the STI nurburgring and the BRZ300 gt. He stated in the last centances his biggest dream is to return in WRC. But het stated also Subaru doesn't have a car who will fit in. Only one could and that is the BRZ. But further he stated RWD could not be changed in AWD due to rules...

We have to wait and see I guess.
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Old 05-15-2014, 06:31 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by litany View Post
Refined is code for boring basically. You want a refined torque curve like the E90 m3? Ok enjoy the immense boredom that provides. 3800lb car with the same amount of torque as a wrx that doesn't come in an exciting lump. You refine that lump out and you just get smooth, boring acceleration. Bam BMW.
BMW refined the M3 with the F80. Tons of torque. Not sure how M3s are boring though?
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Old 05-15-2014, 07:45 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a2cpc View Post
I hope this includes a return to American Road Racing! I mean KIA is actually contending a viable car for the second year.
AWD is always going to carry a huge penalty in weight, power and tire for any road racing series after Audi decimated touring car and Trans-Am fields with the A4. Unfortunately the WRX doesn't stand a chance. The only hope for Subaru championships is the BRZ.

And like others have said, WRC and RallyCross seem like a foregone conclusion too unless Subaru can build something the size of the Polo or Fiesta.
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Old 05-15-2014, 08:50 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4wdwrx View Post
BMW refined the M3 with the F80. Tons of torque. Not sure how M3s are boring though?
Thanks, and well said.

The Golf R I had was anything but boring, but it was certainly refined. AND CHEAPER than an equally equipped STI.
Refined can mean a lot of things.

YOu know what is refined,

NOT all plastic door cards.
NOT fake carbon Fiber on the center console
Soft touch plastics and high quality leather
Keyless entry and start
Cars that do not rattle themselves to death

We are not talking about seats that give you a message and lane departure crap.

To all of you who complaining about an STI going more main stream and upscale. THe EVO did not do this... and look what happened. The market for a pure all out track beast is practically non existent.

The new 2015 Golf R with almost 300 HP / AWD / and a manual is the car the STI should target. That level of 'refinement' would be welcome.

Then as others have said. If you want to make it a track beast, spend a weekend with your wrench and take off what you do not want.
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Old 05-15-2014, 12:43 PM   #21
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Perfect analogy Scrappy.

Better interior, better build quality on top of the existing powertrain and suspension.
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Old 05-15-2014, 03:02 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by litany View Post
Refined is code for boring basically. You want a refined torque curve like the E90 m3? Ok enjoy the immense boredom that provides. 3800lb car with the same amount of torque as a wrx that doesn't come in an exciting lump. You refine that lump out and you just get smooth, boring acceleration. Bam BMW.
First off, let me agree that after driving turbo motors for years, N/A engines can seem a bit boring on a first drive. But it doesn't take more than a week before you learn to immensely appreciate instant throttle response, and a linear, high-revving motor.

That being said, given the choice of the 8k+ redline 400+ HP V8 that is the S65, and your ****-heap EJ25...you're taking the EJ? The engine in the E90 costs more than your car (literally) for a reason.

I have a much more powerful TT N54 (~400/400 crank), which makes gobs more power in the low and mid range vs. my M3. And even my wife will tell you that despite being worlds slower, the M3's engine is more entertaining to wring out from a driver's standpoint.

Anyway, I get the excitement of the lag, lag, lag, WHAMMM feeling of EJs. They're a hoot.

But believe me, it doesn't take long to appreciate a motor with much greater driveability.

And if Subaru gave people a high revving, 350 HP NA H6, for example, I think you'd find a lot of buyer's lining up for one. For the same reasons some people are upset that the M3/M4 is now FI. Screaming engines are disappearing left and right.

Last edited by SoapBox; 05-15-2014 at 03:09 PM.
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Old 05-15-2014, 03:18 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
Thanks, and well said.

The Golf R I had was anything but boring, but it was certainly refined. AND CHEAPER than an equally equipped STI.
Refined can mean a lot of things.

YOu know what is refined,

NOT all plastic door cards.
NOT fake carbon Fiber on the center console
Soft touch plastics and high quality leather
Keyless entry and start
Cars that do not rattle themselves to death

We are not talking about seats that give you a message and lane departure crap.

To all of you who complaining about an STI going more main stream and upscale. THe EVO did not do this... and look what happened. The market for a pure all out track beast is practically non existent.

The new 2015 Golf R with almost 300 HP / AWD / and a manual is the car the STI should target. That level of 'refinement' would be welcome.

Then as others have said. If you want to make it a track beast, spend a weekend with your wrench and take off what you do not want.

Couldnt agree with you more Scrappy, hell id be happy with a reduction in road noise in the cabin at this point. Thats one thing that has always frustrated me with subarus
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Old 05-15-2014, 04:22 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoapBox View Post
First off, let me agree that after driving turbo motors for years, N/A engines can seem a bit boring on a first drive. But it doesn't take more than a week before you learn to immensely appreciate instant throttle response, and a linear, high-revving motor.

That being said, given the choice of the 8k+ redline 400+ HP V8 that is the S65, and your ****-heap EJ25...you're taking the EJ? The engine in the E90 costs more than your car (literally) for a reason.

I have a much more powerful TT N54 (~400/400 crank), which makes gobs more power in the low and mid range vs. my M3. And even my wife will tell you that despite being worlds slower, the M3's engine is more entertaining to wring out from a driver's standpoint.

Anyway, I get the excitement of the lag, lag, lag, WHAMMM feeling of EJs. They're a hoot.

But believe me, it doesn't take long to appreciate a motor with much greater driveability.

And if Subaru gave people a high revving, 350 HP NA H6, for example, I think you'd find a lot of buyer's lining up for one. For the same reasons some people are upset that the M3/M4 is now FI. Screaming engines are disappearing left and right.

Right here dude. I'll take a 300+HP H6 over the turbo because from their recently released PR they are working on cylinder deactivation. I don't see how that will work on a turbo 4, but definitely can happen on a H6. Cut 2 cylinders off for pedestrian driving.

An on/off turbo switch would work much the same. Straight H4 for commuting then switch on the turbo for spirited driving or passing.

Either will work. Mfr's are going to have to play this game to keep up with EPA mandated MPG. I hope we see it sooner than later.
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Old 05-15-2014, 04:33 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by intercede007 View Post
AWD is always going to carry a huge penalty in weight, power and tire for any road racing series after Audi decimated touring car and Trans-Am fields with the A4. Unfortunately the WRX doesn't stand a chance. The only hope for Subaru championships is the BRZ.

.
I would agree to a point, but Phoenix Racing had a very competitive car last year with 1 win at NJ before Subaru dropped them. Weren't the Volvos also AWD and fairly successful?
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