Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Tuesday July 7, 2015
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > News & Rumors > Non-Subaru News & Rumors

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-17-2012, 10:35 AM   #151
schweezly
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 187013
Join Date: Aug 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Buffalo Grove, IL
Vehicle:
2013 ST

Default

I drove one of these yesterday with the mid level package and some options (partial Recaros, Sony, moonroof, Nav, keyless entry/push button start, etc...). A quick 10 minute test drive doesn't tell you much, but I really enjoyed it. Granted, I drive a veloster that probably wasn't my smartest purchase (for what I like).

If I were switching cars I'd have a hard time with the ST against a limited WRX sedan, but for a DD car I think I'd lean towards the ST. It just felt great all around and I didn't really notice any torque steer. I am at a point though where any car I drive is going to stay stock, so a nice package is good.

I don't think the $28.5k price tag was bad. Especially for what you get.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
schweezly is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 10-17-2012, 11:51 AM   #152
Derbagger
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 32113
Join Date: Jan 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Trollhatten, Japan
Vehicle:
05 Saabaru
Satin Grey

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Scotty View Post
what i wanna know is this....

is there an available lsd unit that will fit and work with the focus st???
Likely an afyermarket one could be fitted. Back in the day, my brother put a quaife lsd in his 92 sho. The thing is the lsd would cost about 1.5k to buy and another 1k or so to install. If Ford had it as an option, they could do it as a 1k option.
Derbagger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2012, 07:23 PM   #153
Spenk
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 7164
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Arizona Bay
Vehicle:
2000 Miata LS
Evo Orange Mica (1/644)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Scotty View Post
what i wanna know is this....

is there an available lsd unit that will fit and work with the focus st???
Dunno. Currently, Quaife doesn't offer one.

If the e-diff trickery on the ST is anything like the ATTS from the '97-'01 Prelude SH, the diff can't be swapped without sensors and warning lights going nuts.

I put a Quaife in my '01 non-SH 'Lude. FWD with drop-throttle oversteer. Whoa.
Spenk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2012, 08:23 PM   #154
moonrider_99
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 258628
Join Date: Sep 2010
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: PA
Vehicle:
2009 WRX stg2-SOLD
2012 MS3

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by schweezly View Post
I drove one of these yesterday with the mid level package and some options (partial Recaros, Sony, moonroof, Nav, keyless entry/push button start, etc...). A quick 10 minute test drive doesn't tell you much, but I really enjoyed it. Granted, I drive a veloster that probably wasn't my smartest purchase (for what I like).

If I were switching cars I'd have a hard time with the ST against a limited WRX sedan, but for a DD car I think I'd lean towards the ST. It just felt great all around and I didn't really notice any torque steer. I am at a point though where any car I drive is going to stay stock, so a nice package is good.

I don't think the $28.5k price tag was bad. Especially for what you get.
Did you consider a MS3? I got my 2012 with the tech package for 25k-ish if I remember correctly. That's just the price for the car.
moonrider_99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2012, 08:31 PM   #155
moonrider_99
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 258628
Join Date: Sep 2010
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: PA
Vehicle:
2009 WRX stg2-SOLD
2012 MS3

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
IF this thread has proven anything, you should not take one persons opinion, and cite it as fact. It is like arguing which Mark Twain Novel is better. The answer is purely subjective to the feel and emotions of what the reviewer likes and expects.

We all go into every test drive with baggage, expectations, and desires. These taint our opinions of the cars. Knowing the metrics used to compare against helps.

for that review you pointed out, there is another between the same two cars, and the reviewer said the focus is far more fun to drive. Are you saying your youtube poster is more credible than my youtube poster?

That is nonsense. Neither is better or worse.

To some people magazine numbers rule the roost. Others do not care so much. Two different articles have called the focus ST the greatest all around hot hatch in the world today. No two ways about it, those are big words. But it still is not for everybody. Those who live on a track or like others to believe they do, will not buy this car because of its 'limitations' which will probably never surface ever on a daily drive at legal or even near legal speeds.

I posted my review of the car as honest as I could and gave you what I was comparing it to to help in anybodies personal reference frame.

I do not really care what jane or John youtube say.
I disagree. My point is that FWD with power needs a LSD and I posted a video that supports my claim. What else am I supposed to do? Online reviews, just like anything else contains those with better reputation and worst (according to the general public), some more interested in track performance versus others more in every day use. That's normal and it should not prevent me from quoting one as a reference.

I am disappointed that the ST does not have more of the RS DNA. The RS had a LSD and so does my car and I don't think the ST can reach its full potential without one.
moonrider_99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2012, 08:44 PM   #156
schweezly
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 187013
Join Date: Aug 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Buffalo Grove, IL
Vehicle:
2013 ST

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonrider_99

Did you consider a MS3? I got my 2012 with the tech package for 25k-ish if I remember correctly. That's just the price for the car.
I've been meaning to test drive one for the hell of it. There are some 2010's around I'd probably take for a spin. I'm not usually a fan of beating on a new car I'm not buying. Interesting point though, I think the ST manual states there is no break in period.
schweezly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2012, 10:49 PM   #157
SCRAPPYDO
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Just outside of Houston TX
Vehicle:
2014 GLK350/2016 WRX
Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonrider_99 View Post
I disagree. My point is that FWD with power needs a LSD and I posted a video that supports my claim. What else am I supposed to do? Online reviews, just like anything else contains those with better reputation and worst (according to the general public), some more interested in track performance versus others more in every day use. That's normal and it should not prevent me from quoting one as a reference.

I am disappointed that the ST does not have more of the RS DNA. The RS had a LSD and so does my car and I don't think the ST can reach its full potential without one.
You stated your opinion and then posted a video with somebody agreeing with you. Nothing wrong with that. But stating the video as a validation of your opinion as fact is not. It is just one person agreeing with you.

I will contradict your video with another video...


My video journalist can beat up your video journalist.

I am not any more right or wrong than you. I just have a different opinion based on my personal beliefs, needs and wants.

Your opinion is that a LSD would make the car better. Maybe maybe not. Depends on what your definition of better is. Better lap times? Perhaps.

Is the electrodiff good enough for 99.9% of the driving you will ever do and put a smile on your face...Well sure. THe question you have to ask yourself is how important is that 0.1% to you.

This is actually a very similar argument as the STI vs EVO. THe EVO is more like the MS3... Hardcore track toy. The ST is more like the STI. Very liveable day to day and not as razor sharp. Better to live with, and better to enjoy day to day, but will probably be a tenth or so slower on the track. Each person will have to weigh what is important to him / her.
SCRAPPYDO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 12:17 AM   #158
4S-TURBO
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 67807
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Sneakercon Valley
Vehicle:
.... Subaru +
Toyota

Default

I already covered those two videos before the great child seat fallout of last page...
4S-TURBO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 10:03 AM   #159
endlesss
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 196720
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Vehicle:
2015 WRX STI
Dark Gray Metallic

Default

Reviews of the car, for what they're worth, have been overall positive. I personally use auto reviews as meer guidelines. They may point you in the right direction but ultimately it's up to you to compare cars and form an opinion.

In an effort to stay on topic since, after all, this is the "2013 Ford Focus ST Review Thread," I'll post a short blurb from the "Inside Line Full Test."

"We also found the brake pedal a bit soft after a spirited blast on a tight and technical blast though a canyon. Given the lack of hard braking on this route, we speculated that this might be attributable to the selective braking from the torque-steer mitigation system while powering out of turns."

This is a bit of a red flag for me. It may be a blast to drive with the eDif, but this seems like an inevitable consequence.
endlesss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 10:15 AM   #160
SCRAPPYDO
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Just outside of Houston TX
Vehicle:
2014 GLK350/2016 WRX
Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000

Default

yeah, I wondered about that as well, AND I was curious how many times you would have to change brake pads on this thing. EVO's use a similar technology and they wear out pads quickly. I would hate to 'use up' my brakes during hard corning and then need them to slow down later.

It really depends on the cars intended use if this will ever actually be an issue, but it is worth noting.
SCRAPPYDO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 11:02 AM   #161
Rootus
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 89821
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: A Series Of Toobs
Vehicle:
2015 STI LE

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moonrider_99 View Post
Did you consider a MS3? I got my 2012 with the tech package for 25k-ish if I remember correctly. That's just the price for the car.
They've gone up. Used to be that the MS3 was the bargain option. We bought our loaded 2010 for 22.3K. Even with the torque steer we might have kept it longer if the back seats had a few inches more legroom. For what we paid there wasn't any competition. At $25-26K there is a bit more competition so it's a tougher choice.
Rootus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 02:52 PM   #162
heavyD
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 194216
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
2015 FST

Default

Doesn't sound like Edmunds Inside Line thinks the ST needs a mechanical LSD. From their full review;

http://www.insideline.com/ford/focus...full-test.html

Quote:
Those doubts and digits will disappear in a cloudy haze of dust and smoke in your rearview mirror. The 2013 Ford Focus ST is quite simply the best front-wheel driver's car to date. It is as fun to pilot as the rear-drive Toyobaru twins and more nimble than the bang-for-the-buck Mustang.
heavyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 05:12 PM   #163
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: in a minefield of caddishness.
Vehicle:
1984 That's *Sir*
Weinerlicks of Douche 2u.

Default

It also sounds like they need a vacation.. they're huffing too much glue in the office. As fun as the BRZ? Puhleeze.
Calamity Jesus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 07:05 PM   #164
endlesss
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 196720
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Vehicle:
2015 WRX STI
Dark Gray Metallic

Default

Watching the videos in this thread really makes me want a VXR. Damn shame it isn't offered over here. I think it looks absolutely fantastic! Go figure, an American made car I would actually buy and they won't sell it here....
endlesss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 08:41 PM   #165
heavyD
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 194216
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
2015 FST

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
It also sounds like they need a vacation.. they're huffing too much glue in the office. As fun as the BRZ? Puhleeze.
Edmunds has an FR-S in their longterm fleet as well as an ST. They have spent more time driving both cars than probably anyone else. Their praise of the ST is no different than R&T's so I would say where there's smoke there's fire and you will have to accept that the ST is the real deal or maybe it's you huffing the glue.
heavyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 08:43 PM   #166
heavyD
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 194216
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
2015 FST

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by endlesss View Post
Watching the videos in this thread really makes me want a VXR. Damn shame it isn't offered over here. I think it looks absolutely fantastic! Go figure, an American made car I would actually buy and they won't sell it here....
I agree. It's a good looking hatchback especially the rear 3/4's.
heavyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-18-2012, 08:51 PM   #167
Dex
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 163775
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Whale's lady garden
Vehicle:
2014 Ford Fiester ST
Murica Red

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD View Post
I agree. It's a good looking hatchback especially the rear 3/4's.

It is indeed a beauty, they should have brought it over as a Satur-- Oh... yeah, NM.


Or at least a Chevy.
Dex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 09:27 AM   #168
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: in a minefield of caddishness.
Vehicle:
1984 That's *Sir*
Weinerlicks of Douche 2u.

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD View Post
Edmunds has an FR-S in their longterm fleet as well as an ST. They have spent more time driving both cars than probably anyone else. Their praise of the ST is no different than R&T's so I would say where there's smoke there's fire and you will have to accept that the ST is the real deal or maybe it's you huffing the glue.
Fun in a completely different way, maybe... ie: fun mashing the throttle.. but there's no way it's as satisfying to corner or push to the limits. My '08 WRX was an absolute hoot as far as mashing the throttle was concerned.. 300ft-lbs under 3000rpm and very little lag.. it would slam you into the seat just squirting through traffic. .. but it wasn't fun in the corners. My miata was still more fun, and a miata is still less fun than a BRZ. I have a very hard time believing the ST really matches up to a BRZ in fun given good roads. On the freeway and around town, I don't doubt it's more fun.
Calamity Jesus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 09:30 AM   #169
schweezly
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 187013
Join Date: Aug 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Buffalo Grove, IL
Vehicle:
2013 ST

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus

Fun in a completely different way, maybe... ie: fun mashing the throttle.. but there's no way it's as satisfying to corner or push to the limits. My '08 WRX was an absolute hoot as far as mashing the throttle was concerned.. 300ft-lbs under 3000rpm and very little lag.. it would slam you into the seat just squirting through traffic. .. but it wasn't fun in the corners. My miata was still more fun, and a miata is still less fun than a BRZ. I have a very hard time believing the ST really matches up to a BRZ in fun given good roads. On the freeway and around town, I don't doubt it's more fun.
I agree. I didn't drive it for very long, or push it too hard, but man was it a fun car. I briefly had a 2011 WRX and enjoyed it, but the early power and how linear it is just feels great. I wouldn't fault anyone that bought either.

I don't expect it to be nearly as good as the brz/fr-s at what they do. I do think it would make a great daily driver
schweezly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 10:09 AM   #170
SCRAPPYDO
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Just outside of Houston TX
Vehicle:
2014 GLK350/2016 WRX
Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
Fun in a completely different way, maybe... ie: fun mashing the throttle.. but there's no way it's as satisfying to corner or push to the limits. My '08 WRX was an absolute hoot as far as mashing the throttle was concerned.. 300ft-lbs under 3000rpm and very little lag.. it would slam you into the seat just squirting through traffic. .. but it wasn't fun in the corners. My miata was still more fun, and a miata is still less fun than a BRZ. I have a very hard time believing the ST really matches up to a BRZ in fun given good roads. On the freeway and around town, I don't doubt it's more fun.
In all fairness, you should really drive it before you condemn it to mediocrity.

I know you are capable of making an unbiased opinion about a car. Go give it a spin...it may surprise you at how fun it actually is.
SCRAPPYDO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 10:30 AM   #171
KC
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 442
Join Date: Oct 1999
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: RI/SE Mass
Vehicle:
13 Crosstrek XV
00 S2000

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD View Post
Doesn't sound like Edmunds Inside Line thinks the ST needs a mechanical LSD. From their full review;
Quote:
Those doubts and digits will disappear in a cloudy haze of dust and smoke in your rearview mirror. The 2013 Ford Focus ST is quite simply the best front-wheel driver's car to date. It is as fun to pilot as the rear-drive Toyobaru twins and more nimble than the bang-for-the-buck Mustang.
http://www.insideline.com/ford/focus...full-test.html
I'll give them best FWD driver's car one can get today, but nothing will ever usurp the Integra Type-R for best FWD drivers car to date.

--kC
KC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 10:42 AM   #172
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: in a minefield of caddishness.
Vehicle:
1984 That's *Sir*
Weinerlicks of Douche 2u.

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
In all fairness, you should really drive it before you condemn it to mediocrity.

I know you are capable of making an unbiased opinion about a car. Go give it a spin...it may surprise you at how fun it actually is.
I intend to.. I just take issue with a car that's less 'raw' than a MS3 being called more entertaining than a BRZ. It's simply hard to imagine.

The problem, of course, is that daily driving a MCS on 450/350lb-in springs makes just about anything off the lot feel like a Buick. In the past I've found that test driving the newest bestest hot hatch on the market while driving a modded autocross car is usually a disappointment. I decided long ago that most automotive journalists have no idea what good handling is.
Calamity Jesus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 11:11 AM   #173
Rootus
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 89821
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: A Series Of Toobs
Vehicle:
2015 STI LE

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
I decided long ago that most automotive journalists have no idea what good handling is.
The last thing we need is someone who daily drives an autocross car telling us what a good handling daily driver is . Real life isn't an autocross course...
Rootus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 12:02 PM   #174
KC
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 442
Join Date: Oct 1999
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: RI/SE Mass
Vehicle:
13 Crosstrek XV
00 S2000

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rootus View Post
The last thing we need is someone who daily drives an autocross car telling us what a good handling daily driver is . Real life isn't an autocross course...
You're right, it isn't. It's an HPDE. No timers, no winners, but be as fast as possible.

I have exactly 23 turns over 22 miles to get to work and when the wife asks where I am, I tell her what turn.

--kC
KC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2012, 12:31 PM   #175
SCRAPPYDO
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Just outside of Houston TX
Vehicle:
2014 GLK350/2016 WRX
Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000

Default

Well I sort of agree, A good handling street car cannot be asked to live up to the metric of a good handling race car...

this goes back to what we said earlier. WE ALL have outside influences that taint everything we do. Dozens of factors go into describing one trait and while handling is a generic term, the metrics which must be met to be deemed 'good' are not universal. Unfortunately, we must rely on the written word to convey our sentiments. And that means putting more effort into things in order to accurately distinguish where our individual metrics lie.
SCRAPPYDO is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2015 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2015, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.