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Old 10-19-2012, 12:39 PM   #176
Lminette
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Having driven both in autocross environment and I prefer the BRZ. Did the ST have more in the straights of course. But the overall feel was better in the BRZ IMO. Is the ST probably the best FWD car made today? Possibly (i'd probably choose a Cooper S over it) but as far as fun goes the BRZ and ST offer different types. So when inside line says it's just as "fun" as and FR-S/BRZ I can see that but just a different type of fun.
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Last edited by Lminette; 10-19-2012 at 12:45 PM.
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Old 10-19-2012, 12:54 PM   #177
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So I was able to actually test drive one today although not take it to redline and had limited chances to test out the front torque vectoring behavior.

The power of the car is great, it has a lot of low end torque and no real lag to speak of. It was the best part of the car. I thought the torque vectoring stuff worked well, I didn't really feel like it was an electronic nanny interfering and the car didn't torque steer much at all.

The suspension to me is soft but that doesn't necessarily mean it handled badly. I thought it handled very well and didn't really have much understeer the couple corners I thought it would understeer. The turn in was very good for a heavier FWD car and it wasn't really difficult to get the back end to come around either.

I own a BRZ so maybe I'm a bit biased but it's not really a fair comparison, imho. The BRZ is way more fun to drive than the Focus was, it obviously doesn't have the power but the rest of the package is just better. Low to the ground, smaller and lighter, quicker steering, etc. etc. I also didn't really like the interior of the Focus.
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Old 10-19-2012, 01:25 PM   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rootus View Post
The last thing we need is someone who daily drives an autocross car telling us what a good handling daily driver is . Real life isn't an autocross course...
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
Well I sort of agree, A good handling street car cannot be asked to live up to the metric of a good handling race car...
Oh, it's not a race car, it still has a full interior, is mostly quiet when getting 38-40mpg on the highway and still has some rubber bushings in the suspension (although, not many).

The BRZ, while softer, transitions and turns-in as well, if not better, than my modded MCS. That's my idea of fun. There's absolutely no way the ST can replicate that kind of fun off the lot.
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Old 10-19-2012, 01:41 PM   #179
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you are most likely right, but I look forward to your review after you get a spin.
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Old 10-19-2012, 02:22 PM   #180
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There's absolutely no way the ST can replicate that kind of fun off the lot.
Hah, this will only go well...

There is a Ford dealer a few blocks from where I live. I might pop over and see if I can take one for a spin. It will have to be nothing short of amazing for me to opt for one with the new GTI and WRX coming in a year or two.
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Old 10-19-2012, 03:28 PM   #181
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The new GTI will only have 220 HP. So it will not be setting the world on fire with performance. With that being said, It does looks spectacular.
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Old 10-19-2012, 03:38 PM   #182
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This is a cooll little artacle I came across, I know its not in depth but its about the ST and BRZ on the race track which I think both are amzing cars.

http://www.businessweek.com/news/201...-ford-focus-st
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Old 10-19-2012, 03:58 PM   #183
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This is a cooll little artacle I came across, I know its not in depth but its about the ST and BRZ on the race track which I think both are amzing cars.

http://www.businessweek.com/news/201...-ford-focus-st
That article reminds me of a good point for those of us in America. Maybe the Focus ST isn't your thing but, if you're into hot hatches, it's important the car is successful.

Bear with me. The demand for the hot hatch is higher if the ST is successful. More demand will usually translate into more products. It's the same case with the BRZ/FRS, it might not be exactly what I'm looking for, but I hope it does well so other manufactures take notice.

Maybe it's just my selfish motives, but I would like to see the Scirocco R or the Vauxhall Astra VXR come to the states. The more the merrier. I can dream can't I?
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Old 11-24-2012, 04:16 PM   #184
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Old 12-14-2012, 01:44 PM   #185
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I'm awaiting word on the (supposedly) new WRX and have been eyeing the ST if things don't pan out the way I'd like. As of right now, I have an Evo track car, so leave all the magazine racing tenths of a second comparison malarkey out of it, because it's for a daily and I just don't care. It's clearly a fun and sporty car. I don't need to debate it beyond that because it's taking me to work and back, not double apexing Big Bend. It will stay stock or close to it. I'm more concerned about the interior amenities and room.

As of right now, the ST interior takes a steaming dump on the WRX interior. I can't say I'm won over by the exterior styling of the ST though. That whale shark front grill is far worse than the base Focus IMO and the rear taillights coming halfway up the rear quarter panel is absurd. So other than exterior looks and AWD, the WRX doesn't really offer much to me over the ST.

They're pretty comparable at $29k with heated leather seats, HIDs and auto climate control. Although the ST adds 8" touch screen nav, 10 speaker sound system with sub, heated mirrors and daytime LEDs. I like Subaru and my 2.5RS has been pretty good to me, but the WRX is getting dated. I would surely be happy with it, but other companies are stepping up their game.
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Old 12-14-2012, 02:32 PM   #186
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I haven't driven a powerful FWD that I liked, yet. That would probably be the deal killer for me.
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Old 12-14-2012, 04:21 PM   #187
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I haven't driven a powerful FWD that I liked, yet. That would probably be the deal killer for me.
NASIOC.
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Old 12-14-2012, 05:20 PM   #188
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Quote:
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I haven't driven a powerful FWD that I liked, yet. That would probably be the deal killer for me.
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NASIOC.
Physics

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Old 12-14-2012, 05:43 PM   #189
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AWD 4 lyf bro! Amirite?

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Old 12-14-2012, 06:04 PM   #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kukabuka View Post
Physics

Oh, you know how to explain the physics regarding the preference of driving feel in RWD vs FWD...

A better question is probably, have you ever even taken physics beyond a HS level?
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Old 12-14-2012, 06:17 PM   #191
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Oh, you know how to explain the physics regarding the preference of driving feel in RWD vs FWD...

A better question is probably, have you ever even taken physics beyond a HS level?
No need for physics to realize FWD isn't close to the ideal sports car platform. There are good FWD cars, but they were chosen for its practicality and cost.

FWD is never a choice when a sports car is built from the ground up, unless Porsche proves wrong and release a FWD sports car.

But back to the Focus ST, its definitely a fun hot hatch with practicality and value. I would like one as a daily.
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Old 12-14-2012, 06:21 PM   #192
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No need for physics to realize FWD isn't close to the ideal sports car platform. There are good FWD cars, but they were chosen for its practicality and cost.

FWD is never a choice when a sports car is built from the ground up, unless Porsche proves wrong and release a FWD sports car.

But back to the Focus ST, its definitely a fun hot hatch with practicality and value. I would like one as a daily.
I agree with you on all points, I just find it annoying when e-dick waggers answer by alluding to some intelligence they don't have.

because psychology...
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Old 12-14-2012, 07:07 PM   #193
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I think you're reading into my Physics comment a little too much, AllAWD. I just thought it was funny that Rootus got an eye roll for saying that he didn't like powerful FWD cars. Nothing wrong with that sentiment to me. Not sure I deserved being called a dick for it, but hey, that's NASIOC for you I guess.
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Old 12-14-2012, 07:10 PM   #194
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I am curious whether you knew two things when you drove the car and had these impressions:

1) The steering is entirely electronic, any sensations you thought you had were simulated.

2) The engine sound is piped into the cabin through the sound system.

If you honestly liked both of things in spite of them being entirely fake, then more power to Ford! These things are the inevitable wave of the future. I am just wondering if you knew about them going into it.
I think you are wrong.
Electric assist is not drive by wire, it is not simulated.
The engine sound is piped into the cabin via a hose not sound system.

Read more, write less.

Krzys

PS If you think good ST does not translate into better WRX or STI you are wrong.
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Old 12-14-2012, 09:45 PM   #195
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I think you're reading into my Physics comment a little too much, AllAWD. I just thought it was funny that Rootus got an eye roll for saying that he didn't like powerful FWD cars. Nothing wrong with that sentiment to me. Not sure I deserved being called a dick for it, but hey, that's NASIOC for you I guess.
I think you didn't read enough into my stuff, but that's nasioc for you
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:49 AM   #196
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I haven't driven a powerful FWD that I liked, yet. That would probably be the deal killer for me.
There are some pretty good handling FWD cars out there. Much better handling than the WRX and even STI.
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Old 12-15-2012, 07:18 AM   #197
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This car was castrated to front wheel drive in order to make it 'schneller':



http://m.jalopnik.com/5958856/this-i...-tt+rs-racecar
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Old 12-17-2012, 10:03 AM   #198
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I just thought it was funny that Rootus got an eye roll for saying that he didn't like powerful FWD cars. Nothing wrong with that sentiment to me.
He got the eye roll because he said he'd never driven a powerful FWD car but automatically assumed that it would suck.


.. you know.. because test drives are hard.
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Old 12-17-2012, 12:46 PM   #199
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There are some pretty good handling FWD cars out there. Much better handling than the WRX and even STI.
Not many in the states. And that's only one aspect of a car, and not the part that irritates me about a high power FWD.
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Old 12-17-2012, 01:20 PM   #200
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Not many in the states. And that's only one aspect of a car, and not the part that irritates me about a high power FWD.
How would you know? Go drive something.. powerful FWD cars can be a lot of fun.
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