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Old 10-09-2012, 11:01 AM   #1
AZP Installs
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Exclamation Fatal LI STi Crash, What Can Be Learned from It.

We just wanted to take a moment and highlight a terrible tragedy that occurred over the weekend. The accident occurred when a teen with a learners permit "failed to negotiate a turn" and went off the road into the trees killing the vehicles 3 passengers, the driver is going to be ok. The images of the crash are horrific and it is difficult to tell if the STI was even a hatch or sedan as it was torn in two.

Here is a link to the article.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.1177440

We think its important for all of us to learn from these events and take them as a warning that all the performance and safety features in the world dont make up for inexperience behind the wheel. We need to respect what these vehicles are capable of and what their limitations are. I know we harp on it constantly but this is why driver education on a closed track is so important.

These courses are not only designed to teach you how to drive fast but to teach you car control skills that will hopefully help you avoid these types of dangerous situations. It will also help teach you a new found awareness for the road and the people around you. Not to mention that once you go flat out on a track, driving that way on the roadway becomes more unappealing. At the end of the day the morning experience and training you have behind the wheel will make you a safer driver. This experience is well worth the couple hundred bucks you will spend on a track day.

Our hearts go out to the families that were affected by this terrible tragedy and we hope that we can all make steps to avoid seeing these types of stories in the future.

-Adam and the AZP Team
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Old 10-09-2012, 11:11 AM   #2
iLuveKetchup
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Not to mention that once you go flat out on a track, driving that way on the roadway becomes more unappealing.
I agree completely!
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Old 10-09-2012, 06:16 PM   #3
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Great advice. The community as a whole should take this as an opportunity to sharpen their own skills and get some instruction. I've been tracking for 10+ years and still continue to learn today from professional race car drivers. I can't say how many times my track experience has saved me from a bad situation on the road.

-mike
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Old 10-09-2012, 07:16 PM   #4
itospeedz1
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I know exactly where this happened. At high speed you need to counter steer quickley on the dips on these turns. some people take them way too fast.
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Old 10-09-2012, 07:48 PM   #5
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I agree... Question though... I know there's defensive courses.. n then track day n autocross.. now r there "agressive" courses for high speed..hard cornering..etc
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Old 10-09-2012, 08:32 PM   #6
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I agree... Question though... I know there's defensive courses.. n then track day n autocross.. now r there "agressive" courses for high speed..hard cornering..etc
that's exactly what HPDE is
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:24 PM   #7
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+1 exactly what an HPDE is. At an HPDE you spend time in the classroom with an instructor and then spend time on track driving aggressively with your personal instructor. They build you up in levels from Novice to experienced over time. The skills taught at an HPDE not only include car control but muscle control as well. These things then become part of your daily driving and end up a very safe driver.

-mike
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:35 PM   #8
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Hpde... Wud u get this for example at englishtown or pocono tracks?... Am away from computer otherwise id ch
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Old 10-09-2012, 09:35 PM   #9
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Check for myself**
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Old 10-09-2012, 10:04 PM   #10
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Yes, they are usually held at Pocono, NJ Motorsports Park in Millville, Watkins Glen, Limerock. It is a great weekend where you get to learn more about yourself, your car and can even take your significant other for the weekend. Watkins Glen is especially nice in the Fall for some track time and some romance. A good organization to start with is http://NASANE.com they offer a phenomenal instruction program.

-mike
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Old 10-09-2012, 11:32 PM   #11
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Well said Mike and Adam, my heart go's out to their families.
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Old 10-10-2012, 01:39 AM   #12
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RIP to those involved
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Old 10-10-2012, 08:14 AM   #13
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HPDE and auto-x are the infamous "driver mods" that we have so often referred to and recommended here when n00bs ask "what is the first mod I should to do my car?" Unfortunately they usually don't take this advice and instead spend the same amount that an HPDE would cost to bolt on some power-adders.
The "driver mod" is actually far more cost effective than any go-fast parts because it remains with you regardless of what car you are driving.
Sadly with regard to the accident in question here, the main factor seems to have been poor decision-making by both the driver and his parents. You can't necessarily fault a 17-year-old for making bad decisions, that's part of the job description of "teenager". However you can certainly fault the parents for making it possible.
Even if this kid had shown up to an HPDE (Mike correct me if I'm wrong here), he wouldn't have been able to participate being underage and unlicensed. Perhaps he could have gotten a ride-along with parental consent?
Maybe the STI should be one of those cars that comes with a complimentary track session, but there are so many cars readily available these days with similar power at relatively affordable prices.
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Old 10-10-2012, 08:27 AM   #14
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1) Don't drive while under the influence of drugs.
2) Don't speed while under the influence of drugs.

Sorry, all sympathy for the driver just went out the door. Here's hoping the families of the victims take the driver and his family to court for EVERYTHING!
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:46 AM   #15
treborfrank
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as the owner of a relatively stock sti with some seat time, i still respect the hell out of the car and know that it is way to much for me.

a 17 year old kid with a car like that is not appropriate. why would his parents be ok with something like that?
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Old 10-10-2012, 12:41 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulder View Post
HPDE and auto-x are the infamous "driver mods" that we have so often referred to and recommended here when n00bs ask "what is the first mod I should to do my car?" Unfortunately they usually don't take this advice and instead spend the same amount that an HPDE would cost to bolt on some power-adders.
The "driver mod" is actually far more cost effective than any go-fast parts because it remains with you regardless of what car you are driving.
Sadly with regard to the accident in question here, the main factor seems to have been poor decision-making by both the driver and his parents. You can't necessarily fault a 17-year-old for making bad decisions, that's part of the job description of "teenager". However you can certainly fault the parents for making it possible.
Even if this kid had shown up to an HPDE (Mike correct me if I'm wrong here), he wouldn't have been able to participate being underage and unlicensed. Perhaps he could have gotten a ride-along with parental consent?
Maybe the STI should be one of those cars that comes with a complimentary track session, but there are so many cars readily available these days with similar power at relatively affordable prices.
Depends on the state. In NYS, you can't do a HPDE til you are 18. In NJ, you can do them at 17. In PA you can do em at 15 with or without a lisc.

Teen car control clinics and autox are open to anyone with a learners permit I believe.

Mike
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Old 10-10-2012, 12:59 PM   #17
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It's more for parents not to buy a car for a kid till he actually has a license. Simple as that. I'm an advocate for track days for driver skill improvements and entice friends and ricers alike.
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Old 10-10-2012, 01:34 PM   #18
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yes it is a tragedy, i feel for the familys. but a 17 yr old with no experiance driving should not have a car like that. they are asking for trouble like that.
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Old 10-10-2012, 01:40 PM   #19
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MAIN Lesson is- If you are EVER "high/ drunk" do NOT drive a vehicle- End of Story
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Old 10-10-2012, 02:12 PM   #20
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That kid is an idiot. I hope he feels terrible for killing four of his friends.
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Old 10-10-2012, 02:59 PM   #21
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RIP. He is too damn inexperienced to be driving an STI anyway. Now he's going to live with that guilt for the rest of his life, though, like yellow said, I'd blame the parents even more so for enabling it.

The thing about track days is that just because you go to them and they give you your pretty little certificate doesn't mean you now have a license to drive at the limits in the street. Just saying, because some of the yahoos I ride track with here in Cali think that they can go Rossi (or Solberg for you cagers) in those public roads. If anything else, track days are great for not only teaching effective technique, but also show you how much the dude in the Miata will make you look like an incompetent fool in your stage 2 STI. Sure, proper racing technique may have saved this kid, but who knows?
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Old 10-10-2012, 05:26 PM   #22
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While the kid is in idiot, his PARENTS are the biggest idiots for buying him the car.

The lesson here isnt "go to track day"

The lesson is you can't buy common sense for the parents or the kid.....
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:21 PM   #23
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RIP. He is too damn inexperienced to be driving an STI anyway. Now he's going to live with that guilt for the rest of his life, though, like yellow said, I'd blame the parents even more so for enabling it.

The thing about track days is that just because you go to them and they give you your pretty little certificate doesn't mean you now have a license to drive at the limits in the street. Just saying, because some of the yahoos I ride track with here in Cali think that they can go Rossi (or Solberg for you cagers) in those public roads. If anything else, track days are great for not only teaching effective technique, but also show you how much the dude in the Miata will make you look like an incompetent fool in your stage 2 STI. Sure, proper racing technique may have saved this kid, but who knows?
I think the point is more to get driver training, more driver training may not have helped but a proper HPDE program should not only teach driving techniques but also teach you the maturity that one needs to go with the power of the cars on the road today.

-mike
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:23 PM   #24
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While the kid is in idiot, his PARENTS are the biggest idiots for buying him the car.

The lesson here isnt "go to track day"

The lesson is you can't buy common sense for the parents or the kid.....
Agreed, but getting performance driver training, WILL help you to become a more mature street driver as well. This isn't a bash the parents or the kid thread, it is what can be taken away from this tragic situation in a positive light.

-mike
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:39 PM   #25
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I think the point is more to get driver training, more driver training may not have helped but a proper HPDE program should not only teach driving techniques but also teach you the maturity that one needs to go with the power of the cars on the road today.

-mike
True. But I'm pretty sure the parentals had enough on the budget for an STI, but not a track day. If this kid had a few hundred dollars, he'd most likely plunk it down on some exhaust rather than a track day. The priorities are all ****ed up.
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