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Old 08-14-2013, 04:46 PM   #476
manitou
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Haha! but now he wants a closed deck, o-rings and beefy studs and he has a turbo to push those boundries!

Ron sure did a nice job on your tune Juan! I love the way the torque builds and just holds flat at 450 all the way out. It looks like the motor will keep revving forever
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Old 08-14-2013, 06:04 PM   #477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal_Imprezav View Post
Told you should have upgraded the rods when I had it apart!
At the time I had a FP black and was only shooting for 500whp

Quote:
Originally Posted by manitou View Post
Haha! but now he wants a closed deck, o-rings and beefy studs and he has a turbo to push those boundries!

Ron sure did a nice job on your tune Juan! I love the way the torque builds and just holds flat at 450 all the way out. It looks like the motor will keep revving forever
Yeah! I am still waiting for Crystal to really test the closed deck block .
I want to see some dyno number or some V-box numbers.

I still don't feel confident about the o-ring but oversized studs seem to work well. How you received the 1/2" studs yet?

Last edited by juanmedina; 08-14-2013 at 07:10 PM.
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Old 08-14-2013, 07:24 PM   #478
manitou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
At the time I had a FP black and was only shooting for 500whp



Yeah! I am still waiting for Crystal to really test the closed deck block .
I want to see some dyno number or some V-box numbers.

I still don't feel confident about the o-ring but oversized studs seem to work well. How you gotten the 1/2" studs yet?
I'm where you were on the power. I thought I would make 500whp max with E85 on my build but.....!

I have not gotten the 1/2" studs yet, the initial email I got said they shipped last week but they are drop shipping from ARP in Cali and they ship either today or tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

So we did comp and leak down test on my motor, 135 psi down from 150-155 and 10% leak down. We know the HG's are hurt and leaking but it looks like the block and motor is OK! I might have a little warping of the heads so they will go back to the machine shop for a deck and high AR finish. My buddy Angel is optimistic about the 1/2" studs but he wants to install time-serts or big-serts as long as there is room around the water jackets for inserts to handle the 1/2"-13 studs. If the machining/ insert quote is reasonable and it works out it will be a good and less expensive alternative!

I'm not positive on the o-rings either but Jr and Paul Szuba are both convinced they really help even with the stock cylinders. Look at what PnL has done on stock sleeves with o-rings.

We are going to confer with our machine shop in Detroit on the o-rings. My problem is I would like a closed deck but I have 99.5mm (3.9145") custom MPS LR pistons. When I talked to John Rykowski/ Outfront he does think his machinist could do slightly looser inserts and not to distort the bore as much so that I could use my pistons with a light hone and re-ring, we'll see. I'm in the research mode! LOL

My take at this point is we will do at the minimum, beefier studs and probably copper o-ring, oem HG and give that a shot.
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Old 08-14-2013, 07:32 PM   #479
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal_Imprezav View Post
Told you should have upgraded the rods when I had it apart!
Quote:
Originally Posted by manitou View Post
I'm where you were on the power. I thought I would make 500whp max with E85 on my build but.....!

I have not gotten the 1/2" studs yet, the initial email I got said they shipped last week but they are drop shipping from ARP in Cali and they ship either today or tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

So we did comp and leak down test on my motor, 135 psi down from 150-155 and 10% leak down. We know the HG's are hurt and leaking but it looks like the block and motor is OK! I might have a little warping of the heads so they will go back to the machine shop for a deck and high AR finish. My buddy Angel is optimistic about the 1/2" studs but he wants to install time-serts or big-serts as long as there is room around the water jackets for inserts to handle the 1/2"-13 studs. If the machining/ insert quote is reasonable and it works out it will be a good and less expensive alternative!

I'm not positive on the o-rings either but Jr and Paul Szuba are both convinced they really help even with the stock cylinders. Look at what PnL has done on stock sleeves with o-rings.

We are going to confer with our machine shop in Detroit on the o-rings. My problem is I would like a closed deck but I have 99.5mm (3.9145") custom MPS LR pistons. When I talked to John Rykowski/ Outfront he does think his machinist could do slightly looser inserts and not to distort the bore as much so that I could use my pistons with a light hone and re-ring, we'll see. I'm in the research mode! LOL

My take at this point is we will do at the minimum, beefier studs and probably copper o-ring, oem HG and give that a shot.
Great, post pics of the studs when you get them.
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Old 08-14-2013, 07:45 PM   #480
manitou
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Sure thing!
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Old 08-25-2013, 06:12 PM   #481
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Update. Took the car to cars and coffee and then had some fun :



With that ^





I beat this ^

and wanted to race this \/



Great times. Thanks to Ron at Phatbotti for working his magic
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Old 08-25-2013, 07:23 PM   #482
Layvon
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Fun day! Congrat#s
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Old 08-25-2013, 07:33 PM   #483
manitou
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You would have beat it also! Nice job Juan!
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:15 PM   #484
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Awesome stuff!

Congrats Juan! Your graph reminds me of mine LOL!!

Bet it was a fun run with the Vette.
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:24 PM   #485
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Juan why are you thinking about 1/2" studs don't you have the custom age 625's? Have the 625's been failing?
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:28 PM   #486
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625s are a pain because they are $$$$ and the ones Juan found are well under $200. I believe the 625s are the ones that require special treatment otherwise they get weakened from atmospheric conditions

Don't quote me on the second part but I know the ones juan found are a hell of a lot cheaper
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:33 PM   #487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manitou View Post
You would have beat it also!!
Not today but...catface type R plug Lol
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:38 PM   #488
juanmedina
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Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Juan why are you thinking about 1/2" studs don't you have the custom age 625's? Have the 625's been failing?
I haven't had any head gasket issues with the arp 625+. There was another thread on the Built motor section that suggested that the threads on the block are weak and they were pulling out when running L19 and 625+ studs. I suggested that if that was the case they could run time-serts or bigger studs. I found some universal 1/2" arp studs that should work in our car that can be had really cheap. Another guy installed time-sert and he said that they seem to work.

Yeah thanks guys it was a fun weekend. I can't wait to put a real engine on the car and crank up the boost.
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:49 PM   #489
TDagen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Layvon View Post
625s are a pain because they are $$$$ and the ones Juan found are well under $200. I believe the 625s are the ones that require special treatment otherwise they get weakened from atmospheric conditions

Don't quote me on the second part but I know the ones juan found are a hell of a lot cheaper
Yeah the 625's aren't cheap. Well worth the extra $ if they hold my heads tight @ 700whp tho!

I think the h11/L19 is the material that corrodes. 625's won't corrode like that iirc, some one correct me if I am wrong tho.

So the 1/2" studs are cheaper but they require machine work done to the block which is going to cost extra $ and add another thing for a machinist to possibly mess up. That's why I'm rooting for the 625s. Keep it simple.
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:59 PM   #490
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
I haven't had any head gasket issues with the arp 625+. There was another thread on the Built motor section that suggested that the threads on the block are weak and they were pulling out when running L19 and 625+ studs. I suggested that if that was the case they could run time-serts or bigger studs. I found some universal 1/2" arp studs that should work in our car that can be had really cheap. Another guy installed time-sert and he said that they seem to work.

Yeah thanks guys it was a fun weekend. I can't wait to put a real engine on the car and crank up the boost.
Ok good to hear!

I'm going with the 625's for sure. I've seen way too many builds have success with the h11/L19 material to even think about worrying. The specs are very similar between the h11/L19 and the 625's.

Stock sized studs ftw.

It all comes back to keep it simple FTW!

Juan seeing your power and hearing about these races really has me itching to get mine going! Woooo woooo watch out when Juan hits full boost.
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Old 08-26-2013, 12:40 AM   #491
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L19's corrode. 625's are one of the most corrosion resistant materials you can get. And inconel isn't cheap
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Old 08-27-2013, 12:38 PM   #492
manitou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manitou View Post
You would have beat it also! Nice job Juan!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Layvon View Post
Not today but...catface type R plug Lol
Oh, sorry Layvon! I meant Juan would have beat that red F car also.

You probably would have beat them both also

Last edited by manitou; 08-27-2013 at 07:59 PM.
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Old 08-29-2013, 12:05 AM   #493
TDagen
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Juan did you guys tune this to try and keep the torque as low as possible?

I remeber you mentioning that was your plan with the stock rods. Then looking at your plot the torque is flat as can be from 5000 rpm up.
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Old 08-29-2013, 07:31 PM   #494
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Also Juan are you running drag radials?
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Old 08-30-2013, 08:31 AM   #495
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Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Juan did you guys tune this to try and keep the torque as low as possible?

I remeber you mentioning that was your plan with the stock rods. Then looking at your plot the torque is flat as can be from 5000 rpm up.
Yeah we tried to keep torque as low as possible. I am running a ACT full face disk without any issues and I am loving it. I also have a stock r160 and I don't have a DCCD. Torque just break stuff, I feel that my car makes all the torque it needs.

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Also Juan are you running drag radials?
Nope, I am running 215 tires . No traction issues here at all if the road is dry.
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Old 08-30-2013, 11:37 AM   #496
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Are you running the act 6mt full face disc or the 5mt full face. My full face 5mt disc wouldn't hold my 30r's torque on E85 for anything. Torque just tears **** up LOL....

I'm running the 5mt act street flywheeland 5mt act pressure plate/6 puck in my 6mt and its working well. I figured its rotating mass weight savings so ill run it till she dies and pick up the 6mt clutch/flywheel setup then.

I think your luck with traction is torque related also.
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:55 PM   #497
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Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Are you running the act 6mt full face disc or the 5mt full face. My full face 5mt disc wouldn't hold my 30r's torque on E85 for anything. Torque just tears **** up LOL....

I'm running the 5mt act street flywheeland 5mt act pressure plate/6 puck in my 6mt and its working well. I figured its rotating mass weight savings so ill run it till she dies and pick up the 6mt clutch/flywheel setup then.

I think your luck with traction is torque related also.
I am running the 6 speed Xtreme PP and the 6sp full face disk
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Old 08-30-2013, 03:50 PM   #498
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Juan I think I am going to make a new low torque map when I get my motor in and touch up the last tune.

Then I will run both maps at the track and see which one I like more. I think the low torque map will possibly be great for getting traction and cutting decent 60 ft's, then let the big whp take it from there. I know torque is good at breaking the tires loose.
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Old 08-30-2013, 04:22 PM   #499
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That where gear dependant or speed dependant boost comes in handy. Lower boost in first and second or below a preset speed then full bore from there
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Old 08-30-2013, 05:50 PM   #500
TDagen
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Originally Posted by kellygnsd View Post
That where gear dependant or speed dependant boost comes in handy. Lower boost in first and second or below a preset speed then full bore from there
Yeah that's true that does work well.

But I'm talking about keeping boost up and using a lower torque tune to establish traction and let those ponies run (whp) from there. Juan seems to be having fun with it. Possibly could help keep parts from breaking too thats always a good thing. I guess I will see what Juan's car does at the track for 60' ft to get a better estimate.

Juan when is it hitting the track?
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