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Old 09-05-2012, 12:47 PM   #1
luis4685
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Default Stage 4 detonation warnings

Just wondering if anyone would like to chime in on this- why am I getting detonation warnings on stage 4 BASE map if Turbo XS is supposed to be rich? I'm getting like 5400rpm flashing check engine lights, which means it's lean. And my turbo xs tuna is reading about 12 or so, which I think is too lean.

Why would this happen?

18G turbo, sti pinks, mrt tmic, Walbro fuel pump, Samco inlet, factory bypass valve, factory air intake. I'm in central Florida. Running 93 Octane.

Beginning to worry about one of the injectors not delivering fuel properly.

Thanks!
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:06 PM   #2
evan_impreza
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Any number of things can cause knock. 12:1 at WOT is quite lean for an OTS map. I would suggest doing this: check your fuel trims (or have someone check for you) to see how far off your injector scaling is. You could then reduce your injector scale which would make the map globally richer. Another option would be to pull a degree of timing in the area where you are seeing knock until it goes away.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:09 PM   #3
evan_impreza
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Also, I believe that map is for a vf series turbo correct? In that case, your turbo is moving more air than the map is calling for, which would make a leaner condition.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:30 PM   #4
luis4685
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by evan_impreza View Post
Also, I believe that map is for a vf series turbo correct? In that case, your turbo is moving more air than the map is calling for, which would make a leaner condition.
OH really?? Well that makes sense, then if that is true. I think the 18g does indeed push some more air than the VF, and the map is for an sti type turbo. Ok then.

I don't understand what you mean by scaling back my fuel. Don't I want to add more fuel? I go to the cell site where I see the knock and if it says, "1.1" for example, I put "1.3" to increase fuel and make it more rich. I am having difficulty knowing just how much I should increase- is a .2 increment too small?? And how much can I go? 1.9?? 5.0???? I have no clue.

Thanks for the help man. Really appreciate the kindness of the people around here.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:27 PM   #5
evan_impreza
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By scaling the injectors smaller it adds more fuel globally to the whole map. The injectors operate on a pulse width, so the ECU tells the injectors to open for a certain amount of time to give you X a/f ratio. If you have the injectors that are 550cc (pinks) scaled to 600cc, the ECU thinks it will need to open a smaller amount of time since they flow more, and you get a leaner mixture. If you scale the same injectors to 500cc the inverse happens and you get a richer mixture. This is the quick and dirty way to add fuel to the whole map, but can throw off your fuel trims.

If you are lean in the whole WOT section of your map, you can select all those values and increase them by .5 to start out with. Then log how much the a/f ratio has changed and it will give you an idea of how much to add/subtract.

I would strongly suggest you find someone with a Tactrix cable that can run a Learning View and see how far your fuel trims are off. This will tell you whether to adjust the injector scaling or the fuel map itself.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:36 PM   #6
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Ok according to the TXS website, the stage 4 map is made for an 18g. Did you also remember to upload the stage 4 parameters along with the map?
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:38 PM   #7
luis4685
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OHHHHH I understand now. You mean going to the actual parameters section instead of the fuel map and then setting the injector scale there. I have them right now at 565cc. Ok well I'm going to try that quick and dirty way and probably scale down to 525cc.

Thank you, sir!
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:42 PM   #8
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Correct. Be careful with the scalar though, small increments will make big changes everywhere. This will affect your closed loop fueling as well. You dont want to max out your fuel trims. Try 550cc first and see what happens. Let me know how it works.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:51 PM   #9
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And just to make sure, the stage 4 base map uses Open Loop fueling, correct? Make sure it does and is on in the parameters.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:54 PM   #10
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One last thing. Read the UTEC manual and then this:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1221413

It's how I learned.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:54 PM   #11
luis4685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evan_impreza View Post
Ok according to the TXS website, the stage 4 map is made for an 18g. Did you also remember to upload the stage 4 parameters along with the map?
Woops I didn't see this post. Yes, I uploaded the stage 4 parameters. I had already tried 550cc but then I read that pinks flow out 565, so I changed it to 565 last night, thinking it may help. That's why I said that I'll try 525 now (I also read that Subaru had rated them at 525cc).

I wonder why I'm having so many problems if it's made for an 18g then?
Well I'll try to keep adding fuel at the problem areas and let you know. I'm just really puzzled why this is happening if the base maps are supposed to be rich anyway.
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Old 09-05-2012, 05:04 PM   #12
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I agree, your mod list and what the map calls for are very close, except your tmic and stock intake. I would think the fueling would be very close since you have the Walbro and pinks. Although the stock intake could be throwing off the MAF readings.

If you just installed that inlet, check and double check for post MAF leaks around the inlet area. A post MAF leak could cause all of this also. If you can't find any leaks, and aren't having any luck with the injector scalar, it might be a good time to make the switch to speed density fueling. It is super easy to tune and yields really solid afrs.
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Old 09-05-2012, 05:14 PM   #13
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Great. Will keep this in mind. Ugh, I hate removing that huge intercooler to get to the inlet pipe, but yes, I've been meaning to check for these leaks. Going to check the vacuum hoses around that inlet for post maf leaks asap.
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Old 09-05-2012, 05:35 PM   #14
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Grab a bottle of soapy water and spray all the connections on the inlet pipe and watch for bubbles.
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Old 09-12-2012, 10:16 AM   #15
jaxscuby
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blinking cel with utec is knock.
and stock ecu is misfire.

your afr of 12 is lean.
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Old 09-12-2012, 11:25 AM   #16
luis4685
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Yea I know, I was just wondering why it would happen with a base map. It's really odd that it would if it's supposed to be rich.
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