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Old 11-15-2012, 04:48 PM   #1
maxg1989
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Default Car get stuck in open loop at highway speeds and low load!! Please help!!!! :(

Ok I have a 02 wagon stage 2 spt intake and full exhaust. And tuned. My car will get stuck in open loop for what I can tell "no reason" or at least one I can't figure out. It usually only happens above 60. I can be driving down the highway at 70mph and about 75-90 load and and it will be fine in closed loop and then for no reason it will pop into open loop no change in load not going into boost or change in speed. Now if I were to slow down bery slowly keeping load the same, as soon as I get under 60mph it would pop back to closed. Even if I let off the throttle completely and then slowly get back on to maintain speed it will still be stuck in open loop. The only way to get it out of open loop is to drop to 4th and floor it and do a decent pull.
I have my tune set with no delays and the speed parameters are set higher. Everything else is pretty stock in the closed loop to open loop tables major changes have been made to the open loop fuel tables though pretty typical.

Anyone have any ideas?!? It's driving me nuts anything I do doesn't seem to help no matter what it always gets stuck in open loop.

The car seems to get crappy mileage too.. Always seems like it's working to hard to maintain speed and is always on the verge of boost at 75-80 mph
Please help
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Last edited by maxg1989; 11-15-2012 at 08:00 PM.
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:08 PM   #2
FIWRX
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I'm not 100% sure but if you have your delay set to all zeros it doesnt take much to get into open loop. I would change the delays to a low value but not zero and see if that fixes the situation.

Hope someone else chimes in and confirms or denies the advice....good luck
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Old 11-19-2012, 02:17 PM   #3
maxg1989
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The delay goes both ways.. It will delay it from going back to closed loop also. Alot of the newer Wrx's don't use delays from the factory. So I'm 99% sure it's not hurting me any. After I changed them to 0 the car drove alot better before it woul hit 7 psi or so before it would hit open loop and drop from 14.7. So if any thing 0 delay is helping me. It's almost like its going into a secret safe mode.

I've also realized that its rpm rather than speed based. It's only at or above 2500rpm I've noticed it at speeds of like 25-35 while I'm accelerating

Thanks for your input though!!!
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Old 11-24-2012, 05:34 AM   #4
matte_white_bandit
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its worth a try to set the delays to a low value, not zero.
im not confident if this will fix the problem but it is worth a shot.
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Old 11-27-2012, 09:25 AM   #5
jaxscuby
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look over rpm and speed threshold for open loop
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:58 AM   #6
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I'm not very familiar with 16-bit, but 32-bit ECUs will drop into OL when the Primary Open Loop (POL) Fueling table specifies an AFR richer than the threshold in the "Minimum Active POL Enrichment" table. (If switches immediately if the delays are all zero.)

If your ECU has a "Minimum Active POL Enrichment" Table then compare that value to the POL cells in the cruise area. You probably just need to make the 14.7 region extend to slightly higher loads.
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Old 12-03-2012, 01:04 AM   #7
lancelucas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxg1989 View Post
The delay goes both ways.. It will delay it from going back to closed loop also. Alot of the newer Wrx's don't use delays from the factory. So I'm 99% sure it's not hurting me any. After I changed them to 0 the car drove alot better before it woul hit 7 psi or so before it would hit open loop and drop from 14.7. So if any thing 0 delay is helping me. It's almost like its going into a secret safe mode.

I've also realized that its rpm rather than speed based. It's only at or above 2500rpm I've noticed it at speeds of like 25-35 while I'm accelerating

Thanks for your input though!!!
Huh? From memory I can tell you very specifically that GR WRX and STI use a delay value of 750. I would listen more and argue less.
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:39 PM   #8
BlazeRex
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Did you zero every CL/OL delay table..? Its been a while since I've played with the CL to OL delay. I know where I want it now so I always use that, but if I remember the car should always be in CL in negative MRP unless you're setting it like NSFW specifies.
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:19 AM   #9
maxg1989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancelucas View Post
Huh? From memory I can tell you very specifically that GR WRX and STI use a delay value of 750. I would listen more and argue less.
Not arguing just stating what I have already learned. And I have seen stock Sti maps with no delays. I've read on the transition between cl/op and from my understanding the delays will both keep it from going into open loop, and also from going back into closed loop. Again not arguing. And besides from what I stated earlier.. It will go into open loop at say 2500 rpm and like .80 load. Or Negative manifold pressures. It's always above 2400 rpm. Once it happens I can slow down below 2400 rpm and keep a steady load and accurate above 2400 and as soon as it hits 2400 it kicks over to open loop, again not in any kind of boost.

I logged fueling final base, and watched it as it switched.. Again at 2400 rpm it would switch from 14.7 base fueling to 13.99 and my wbo2 will read about 13.4

I can't seem to find a lead or anyone else who has this problem. I've also ha this same exact problem even when I had delays.

I keep looking for a 2400 rpm switch of some kind but nothing is standing out. Also all my coolant temp compensation and load rpm table are all zeros out. Along with I've tried setting "Minimum Active Primary Open Loop Enrichment really low, like 13.5 and it will still do the same exact thing.
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:36 AM   #10
jaxscuby
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send copy of your rom file..

a second set of eyes helps..

jaxscuby@hotmail.com
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:24 AM   #11
lancelucas
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If your delays are zero'd, it is following the OL Fuel Table. Simple as that.

And no, no stock vehicle uses all zero'd delay values from the factory. Stop making claims as such.
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Old 12-11-2012, 11:31 AM   #12
maxg1989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancelucas View Post
If your delays are zero'd, it is following the OL Fuel Table. Simple as that.

And no, no stock vehicle uses all zero'd delay values from the factory. Stop making claims as such.
Sry but your wrong at least on the delays part.. I logs to prove it will stay in closed loop even in boost levels as much as 3-5 psi . As for the stock Rome with no delays I haven personally tuned one. Just from researching delays and very heavily..

You don't need to be rude either... I'm just asking for help. And I've tried all the tried suggestion before. Like I've said I've researched cl/op function intensively. And seen how it all works.
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:07 PM   #13
maxg1989
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Try it yourself. Change all delays to 0 and log cl/ol status. 7 being warm up 8 is closed loop and 10 is open loop. Yeah 0 delays makes it easier but that's only what they are... Delays not a switch there are many other criterias that have to be met to switch to open loop, those of which I won't go into.
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Old 12-11-2012, 12:40 PM   #14
lancelucas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NSFW View Post
I'm not very familiar with 16-bit, but 32-bit ECUs will drop into OL when the Primary Open Loop (POL) Fueling table specifies an AFR richer than the threshold in the "Minimum Active POL Enrichment" table. (If switches immediately if the delays are all zero.)
NSFW already told you the same (correct) thing. But fine, continue believing as you wish.
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:02 PM   #15
maxg1989
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Yeah.. And he is correct in what he's saying. Exactly what I'm saying to.. It will go into open loop when your primary open loop tables calls for a Afr that is richer than the minimum actiive pol. Which it's working just fine. That's not the same thing as " always in open loop" those are a few of the "other parameters" I was talking about. Again if you read what he said correctly.. He states (If switches immediately if the delays are all zero.) meaning exactly what I said.. Not always in open loop but will switch immediately once parameters are met. Again that's not the problem I'm having. Constant speed and at loads where it's targeting 14.7 even in my ol table it will all of a sudden drop way richer that even my ol table is targeting.. Such as
2600 rpm and .80 load wbo2 reading 14.8-15.1 the. No changes in speed or load it will kick down to 13.0-13.99. Shouldn't be a delay problem, cause it did this with delays too as stated earlier.
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:12 PM   #16
BlazeRex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxg1989 View Post
Sry but your wrong at least on the delays part.. I logs to prove it will stay in closed loop even in boost levels as much as 3-5 psi . As for the stock Rome with no delays I haven personally tuned one. Just from researching delays and very heavily..

You don't need to be rude either... I'm just asking for help. And I've tried all the tried suggestion before. Like I've said I've researched cl/op function intensively. And seen how it all works.
I have yet to see a stock car with no delays. Please give me a ROM ID of said ROM with no delay. 750 is indeed the GR value. The GR wrx has 0 delay in intelligent mode, but since there is no SI drive, that table is null and void.

Also, I'm not sure how lance was being rude
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxg1989 View Post
Try it yourself. Change all delays to 0 and log cl/ol status. 7 being warm up 8 is closed loop and 10 is open loop. Yeah 0 delays makes it easier but that's only what they are... Delays not a switch there are many other criterias that have to be met to switch to open loop, those of which I won't go into.
Have you touched ANY CL/OL delay tables besides the actual delay value itself? Or any CL fueling tables?
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:24 PM   #17
maxg1989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazeRex View Post
I have yet to see a stock car with no delays. Please give me a ROM ID of said ROM with no delay. 750 is indeed the GR value. The GR wrx has 0 delay in intelligent mode, but since there is no SI drive, that table is null and void.

Also, I'm not sure how lance was being rude

Have you touched ANY CL/OL delay tables besides the actual delay value itself? Or any CL fueling tables?
Yeah I've made he rpm and speed and base puls width setting higher thinking it would be harder to go into open loop but still the same thing
I've tried changing pretty much every table I can think of with no results at all.
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:31 PM   #18
maxg1989
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Ill post A tune when I can
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Old 12-13-2012, 10:54 PM   #19
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I'm keeping an eye on this, I'm noticing excessive open loop fueling on my car too.
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Old 12-13-2012, 10:59 PM   #20
maxg1989
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Yeah mines got a mind of its own. I even have Carberry that coded his own Rom (carberry rom) on it and he is at a loss of words too. He thinks it's a corrupted tune at this point. I'm starting over on a fresh tune and trying that's. I patched. Launch control into my current tune and that might have done it. We will see I'm uploading my new tune in the morning and im going to test it out.
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