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Old 12-31-2012, 10:09 AM   #26
KillerBMotorsport
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Getting closer...


So far I like this setup the most. Least cabin noise/drone (WAY less than the Q300!) and I can actually now be more annoyed by tire noise when driving at speed. It seems like the noise from the back of the car is only slightly reduced, but there is a lot less going into the cabin. When you get on it, it is certainly not stock sounding.

I've got one more setup I think may be even more quiet, but I'm on the fence on its performance potential.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:51 PM   #27
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Did you guys ever consider making the exhaust exit on the driver's side like this Fujitsubo?



Thanks
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Old 01-02-2013, 10:12 PM   #28
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Passenger side exit has fewer bends...

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Old 01-02-2013, 10:18 PM   #29
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and now 08-10 SEDAN build time!
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Old 01-03-2013, 07:30 AM   #30
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and now 08-10 SEDAN build time!
LOL, but we haven't even started making these yet!

Hope to have some dyno testing data within the month vs Q300
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Old 01-03-2013, 09:44 AM   #31
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Those of you that know me already know this, and for those of you that don't... Some say... I can be a little bit picky when it comes to details. Case in point with this exhaust we use large radius bends. Larger than anyone else, that I know of, but that annoying nit-picky voice in my head kept saying, 'it can be better'. So a couple days ago we increased the radius again, by a lot more

Here you can see the comparison.

Right: Unnammed exhaust, tight bends 3" bend radius
Second from Right: Q300, not as tight 4" bend radius
Second from Left: KBM 1st prototype, 6" bend Radius
Left: KBM 2nd prototype, 11" bend radius



How is this a benefit you ask? Larger bend radii flow higher. The simple physics of it is fairly simple; the closer to straight, the higher the flow capability.

Compounding the effect of the larger bends in the quantity of bends; Unnamed (8), Q300 (11), KBM (4).

On top of that, the sideways muffler is far more turbulent than a thru style. So again Chris, what's your point? Hopefully, to provide a product free of the typical 'all cat-backs net similar results' statement. The system is also designed around the EL header and as such greatly reduced the drone experienced with most GR cat-backs that have gone EL.

So for your viewing pleasure...

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Old 01-03-2013, 11:01 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
LOL, but we haven't even started making these yet!

Hope to have some dyno testing data within the month vs Q300
i know, i know...great updates btw. look forward to the testing and seeing when i can give this a go on the sedan. looks very meticulously thought out, i wonder why? haha
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:28 PM   #33
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So... If all goes well, should have dyno data the end of next week
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Old 01-16-2013, 08:15 PM   #34
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excellent news. this will be interesting. looking forward to it!
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:42 AM   #35
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excellent news. this will be interesting. looking forward to it!
Agreed, it should be interesting at the least I'm on the fence about bringing a complete straight pipe down for comparison. Who'd want that?
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Old 01-17-2013, 11:27 AM   #36
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Agreed, it should be interesting at the least I'm on the fence about bringing a complete straight pipe down for comparison. Who'd want that?
Definitely. If it flows as well as the straight pipe, then there's no reason to use any other exhaust than the quiet version of yours!

BTW, how much power is your car making? Any plans to test it on a higher powered car?
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:06 AM   #37
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The last tune on this car was 344/285 on a Mustang. The tuner recommended the cat-back be changed to the Q300 to free up some power, which we did, but it never went back on the dyno since.

So when we do our testing we will do pulls with an OTS Stage II and then protuned with the Q300, and repeat with the Killer B prototype setup. This should show what can be expected for the masses that are around stage II levels running an OTS map, any additional benefits or safeguards from a protune, and on the low side of what to expect for those running a more powerful setup.
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:16 AM   #38
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I assume that's 344WTQ and 285WHP, not the other way around? What you have planned sounds like a great test. I guess I'd also like to see how it compares with the rear section of the KB exhaust swapped for a straight pipe as well (ie. no muffler at all). That would put to rest any concerns that an N1 or other similar exhaust could outflow it.
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:36 AM   #39
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Is there an N1 for the hatch?
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:16 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
Is there an N1 for the hatch?
Yeah, here are two of the popular ones:

Invidia N1
Resonated and Non-Resonated Available, Can Muffler
Piping Diameter: 76mm



GReddy Ti-C
Resonated, Can Muffler
Piping Diameter: 80mm

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Old 01-18-2013, 10:32 AM   #41
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I must be haing a brain fart... I cannot find those (exactly like the pics) on the website. Links?
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:09 AM   #42
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Here are the links. The photos I posted are the second or third photo for each one.

http://www.rallysportdirect.com/Gred...st-Single-Exit
http://www.rallysportdirect.com/Invi...back-2008-2011
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:45 AM   #43
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Yep, those are them. Thanks!

It looks like the Greddy Tapers down at the DP connection, although I like the Greddy routing better, but both have tight bends and a wee tiny muffler.

Without having one to test I can only speculate (biased at that), that the Killer B setup will perform marginally better (and possibly not even measurable?), but definitely quieter.
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Old 01-18-2013, 12:12 PM   #44
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Yes, the GReddy does neck down a bit. The 80mm piping makes it looks even more drastic. On the smaller piping of the GReddy SP Elite you can barely even notice it necks down. The small mufflers seem like they'd flow well, but they are quite loud.

I'm very interested as to how much the extra bends hurt flow in practical application. My thought would be that the muffler would have a much larger effect. Almost to make the bends negligible. I could be very wrong about this though.

This could especially be an issue with many of the exhausts that have a larger muffler with a side entry. They have a 90 and then a 180 going into the muffler and then 90's out each side! This really can't be good for flow.

How much time are you spending on they dyno? For completeness I think it would be great to also have a stock exhaust and one of the N1 styles, but maybe that's too much. If you did want an N1 style, there are some real cheap ones out there too:

http://www.erzperformance.com/TSUDO-...-p/20-9365.htm
http://www.cntracing.com/CNT-perform.../dp-08subs.htm

My other thought was a center exit. Would this benefit at all (slightly less of a bend)? If you're not really focusing on looks then you could just cut a hole in the diffuser (rally style) or have a turn down and dump it just below the bumper.
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Old 01-18-2013, 01:17 PM   #45
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A well designed muffler (assuming the entry/exit tube is straight in/out) should flow as well as a straight tube. Assuming they both use quality mufflers, then the bends definitely come into play.

If it's quiet and makes better power (measurable and unquestionable) vs the sideways 'dual' exhaust I will have accomplished the goal I set out on. I don't want to get caught up in comparing against more and more setups because it will be never ending. There will ALWAYS be someone who says "I have, or like, X exhaust, but does yours make more power (weight less, sound better, etc.)?" I will post data that may sway people and it may make people question it against other options. I would loose my shirt if I answered all those questions for them
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Old 01-18-2013, 01:24 PM   #46
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Plz design said exhaust for BRZ. Thanks. *throws money*
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Old 01-18-2013, 03:01 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
A well designed muffler (assuming the entry/exit tube is straight in/out) should flow as well as a straight tube. Assuming they both use quality mufflers, then the bends definitely come into play.

If it's quiet and makes better power (measurable and unquestionable) vs the sideways 'dual' exhaust I will have accomplished the goal I set out on. I don't want to get caught up in comparing against more and more setups because it will be never ending. There will ALWAYS be someone who says "I have, or like, X exhaust, but does yours make more power (weight less, sound better, etc.)?" I will post data that may sway people and it may make people question it against other options. I would loose my shirt if I answered all those questions for them
Interesting. I really don't imagine the suitcase mufflers flowing that well, but I could be wrong. The goals for this project sound very reasonable. I am extremely interested. I want stock sound and no power restriction up to 700WHP! I don't care about looks.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:09 AM   #48
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Testing was postponed last week. I will let you know when we get the dyno time re-scheduled.
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:13 PM   #49
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Can you manage to test an Apexi GT spec? the piping is bigger than those and has a resonator
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:39 PM   #50
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Can you manage to test an Apexi GT spec? the piping is bigger than those and has a resonator
See below

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
A well designed muffler (assuming the entry/exit tube is straight in/out) should flow as well as a straight tube. Assuming they both use quality mufflers, then the bends definitely come into play.


If it's quiet and makes better power (measurable and unquestionable) vs the sideways 'dual' exhaust I will have accomplished the goal I set out on. I don't want to get caught up in comparing against more and more setups because it will be never ending. There will ALWAYS be someone who says "I have, or like, X exhaust, but does yours make more power (weight less, sound better, etc.)?" I will post data that may sway people and it may make people question it against other options. I would loose my shirt if I answered all those questions for them
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