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Old 12-13-2012, 03:24 AM   #26
chris the man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris the man
you guys are all wrong...

i found the eeasiest way to get it started.

last night i cut a hole under the back seat and into the fuel take. i dropped the magnet heater in just like ice fishing.

problem solved.

but really GREAT INFO ON HERE!!! YOU GUYS ROCK!!!!!! im running propane.injection
this was a joke just an fyi lol
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Old 12-13-2012, 03:47 AM   #27
drewvdw
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Someone needs to make a writeup on how to set up propane injection.

Maybe I should do a search to find out if someone already has Too tired. Too late.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:26 PM   #28
Concillian
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For startup, you don't need "injection" per se.

All you really need is to get propane into the intake manifold. As witnessed by the guy turning on a torch and leaving it on, It's not really important to meter it like you would on an injection setup, you just need "some" in there.

So you drill a hole, and tap it 1/4 NPT. Then get a 1/4 NPT to 1/4 NPT hose and attach an RV high pressure LPG solenoid to it close to the intake manifold, so it doesn't have to dissipate far. another NPT / NPT hose into a ~10psi regulator ( like this one )Then an adapter for NPT to disposable cylinder (like this one... scroll down to 2098)

Then you need a momentary relay with a programmable delay so it will only activate the soleenoid for a short time when it first gets a 12v signal.

Bam, done.

Now for propane injection for power, it's a totally different story. You need a NOS nozzle and you need to worry about where to put it for even distribution, run much higher pressure, etc... You also need to have EM that can account for it, and it's all kinds of complicated. But just for starting the engine, you can have a pretty simple setup, looks like it might cost $100-200.

Last edited by Concillian; 12-13-2012 at 08:35 PM.
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Old 12-14-2012, 07:15 AM   #29
drewvdw
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I'll have to take a serious look into this.
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Old 12-14-2012, 01:23 PM   #30
albersondh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Concillian View Post
For startup, you don't need "injection" per se.

All you really need is to get propane into the intake manifold. As witnessed by the guy turning on a torch and leaving it on, It's not really important to meter it like you would on an injection setup, you just need "some" in there.

So you drill a hole, and tap it 1/4 NPT. Then get a 1/4 NPT to 1/4 NPT hose and attach an RV high pressure LPG solenoid to it close to the intake manifold, so it doesn't have to dissipate far. another NPT / NPT hose into a ~10psi regulator ( like this one )Then an adapter for NPT to disposable cylinder (like this one... scroll down to 2098)

Then you need a momentary relay with a programmable delay so it will only activate the soleenoid for a short time when it first gets a 12v signal.

Bam, done.

Now for propane injection for power, it's a totally different story. You need a NOS nozzle and you need to worry about where to put it for even distribution, run much higher pressure, etc... You also need to have EM that can account for it, and it's all kinds of complicated. But just for starting the engine, you can have a pretty simple setup, looks like it might cost $100-200.

Man its funny you mention all this because I actualy started building it. Anyone want to carry on the "propane cold start" solution lmk I have some parts you need. I built a momentary switched relay (on-time adjustable by pot), got a low pressure switch for propane (warning for when the tank is low), other junk to make it work. Then by the time I was ready to install, the weather changed, then cold cranking tables became available in RR......

Its a hardware solution that was made obsolete by software.
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Old 12-19-2012, 03:08 AM   #31
Matty_STi
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why not just use one of these? http://www.etipinc.com/universal.asp

Matt
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Old 12-19-2012, 04:48 AM   #32
spoolinsti05
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Why not just give her a shot of starting fluid? Or take a heat gun and heat up your feed line? You guy's think more then me. And I'm the over thinking master.
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Old 12-19-2012, 04:08 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spoolinsti05 View Post
Why not just give her a shot of starting fluid?
What do you think hooking it to a propane tank would be?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
Starting fluid is a mixture of volatile hydrocarbons (heptane, butane or propane)
Soo... using a propane tank & automated solenoid is just automating the starter fluid shot so you don't have to dick around under the hood in -xx degree weather. Just get in, turn the key to acc, wait 3 seconds and start first turn... Or using remote start from your warm house so your car is warmed up when you get in it... luxury!

How are you going to hook up your heat gun if you live in an apt. and park in a lot? or work the 12 hour night shift and your car sits in the lot at work? Even if you do, you're spending 5 minutes standing around with your gun in your hand in -xx degree weather.

Last edited by Concillian; 12-19-2012 at 04:14 PM.
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Old 12-19-2012, 06:20 PM   #34
spoolinsti05
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1.)Another issue to go wrong.

2.)Extra Voltage drop In a system that was designed to operate with what it came with and not much more then that. Esp being the fact it's an STi not a Cadi.. Or an RV

3.) Highly explosive


4.) what a waste of time and money few shots of starting fluid boom good to go. I'd also add some type of oil additive in the winter unless your getting the cut stuff. Maybe marvel mystery oil? Caster oil? redline 2 stroke oil?

Last edited by spoolinsti05; 12-19-2012 at 07:31 PM.
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Old 12-20-2012, 12:24 PM   #35
kalapadea
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My 03 forester starts up every time I first key turn. I live in montana, this morning it was -8F outside and honestly that's kinda warm. I don't have any kind of heater. I let it warm up for like 5 minutes before I go anywhere though.

What am I missing, that you guys are having problems with?
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Old 12-20-2012, 12:26 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by kalapadea View Post
My 03 forester starts up every time I first key turn. I live in montana, this morning it was -8F outside and honestly that's kinda warm. I don't have any kind of heater. I let it warm up for like 5 minutes before I go anywhere though.

What am I missing, that you guys are having problems with?
They have cold start issues with E85 in winter.
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Old 12-20-2012, 03:00 PM   #37
Boostedbob
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I was having issues with starting the car monday at 18 degrees on E bout 10minutes to get her started. I know its in my fuel table's right now the tuner is making adjustments to it so that she starts a lot easier, As much as I love E, not a fan on the starter wear, but I got it knowing this could be a issue.

I am looking into getting a block heater just incase since I am running forged internal's we will see how it goes with the tune first.
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Old 12-20-2012, 05:07 PM   #38
spoolinsti05
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They have cold start issues with E85 in winter.
I haven't had any issues as I haven't switched to E85 yet LOL


But me think's your tuner's need to add more cranking enrichment at those various "Coolant" temps if your having an issue. Maybe also little ignition. I'd also mix in some kinda lubricant honestly because that's another issue when it get's colder with E85.

Last edited by spoolinsti05; 12-20-2012 at 05:39 PM.
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Old 12-20-2012, 05:26 PM   #39
k mier
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I'd also mix in some kinda lubricant honestly because that's another issue when it get's colder with E85.
? ? ?
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Old 12-21-2012, 10:32 AM   #40
slowgenius
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My flex fuel truck starts fine in winter on e85 (e70) in winter, as far as lubrication the intsruction manual says run one full tank of gasoline every 5k miles. I do it every fifth fill up.
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Old 12-22-2012, 12:36 AM   #41
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FYI, I have the ~$35 subaru block heater installed in my STI. If I leave it on for around 3 hours it will heat things up to the point where the intake manifold is pretty hot. Thats pretty good since I run spacers! I purchased a used 120v plug-in appliance timer from eBay for $15 shipped that allows me to warm the car up in the morning without running the heat all night.
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Old 12-22-2012, 02:37 AM   #42
kay95
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I was looking to run this in my impreza and this has always been my concern along with extended storage but thats another thread.


I have a MS2 so if I was to run E85 would I be ok after I richened up the CSE and WUE tables? Is it that much harder to light off then gas because I know my values on the cold side are close but I havent had the time to get them perfect and I only need to press the accel pedal alittle and it fires right up.
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Old 12-22-2012, 03:28 AM   #43
Awd180
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Ethanols melting point is <-100'C and boils around 60'C so it's still liquid on the coldest and hottest days. The problem with cold starts is more with the battery and electronics. If the starter cant fire enough juice to the spark plugs it doesn't matter how much fuel you dump into the cc.
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Old 12-22-2012, 12:12 PM   #44
spoolinsti05
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Originally Posted by Awd180 View Post
Ethanols melting point is <-100'C and boils around 60'C so it's still liquid on the coldest and hottest days. The problem with cold starts is more with the battery and electronics. If the starter cant fire enough juice to the spark plugs it doesn't matter how much fuel you dump into the cc.
I approve the past 3 post's. Don't forget your oil heater. I wonder if this will classify our car's as a hybrid
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Old 12-22-2012, 12:15 PM   #45
spoolinsti05
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Originally Posted by slowgenius View Post
My flex fuel truck starts fine in winter on e85 (e70) in winter, as far as lubrication the intsruction manual says run one full tank of gasoline every 5k miles. I do it every fifth fill up.
Marvel mystery oil, Or Caster oil Caster oil is good for rotard's (Rotary's)

http://www.e85performance.net/forums/showthread.

Last edited by spoolinsti05; 12-22-2012 at 12:37 PM.
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