Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Monday December 22, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Built Motor Discussion

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-03-2013, 10:53 AM   #1
ehiddenidentity01
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 279169
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: marysville oh
Vehicle:
2004 impreza wrx sti
wrb

Default dry sump oil system

so im building a 700hp+ car and thinking about running a dry sump system. has anyone done this on their street cars? or race cars for that matter.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
ehiddenidentity01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2013, 11:35 AM   #2
68Cadillac
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 95901
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Las Vegas, USA
Default

Mick the Ginge did one.

He also wrote later:
Quote:
Originally Posted by mick_the_ginge View Post
So the question is, what would I do differently if I had to do it all over again?

Answer: I would not do a dry sump system.


I've mentioned this in other threads and thought I would note down my thoughts in a thread of it's own.

If I had to do it all over again I would install the follow which IMO is going to satisfy 95% of the builds.

#1 - Larger Oil Pan with integrated pickup
#2 - Larger or modified stock location oil pump
#3 - Accusump :- Optional but recommended for AutoX and Track use
#4 - Oil Cooler :- Optional but recommended for Track use

With these parts IMO you have a pretty bullet proof setup, so let me explain.

#1 - Larger Oil Pan with integrated pickup
More oil is better and there are now multiple options on the market that are tried and tested. I am not going to comment on which one I think is better, just look for one that has a larger oil capacity (Duh), integrated oil pickup and some sort of baffling. This is going to help with high G oil starvation and potential problem that have been seen with the stock pickup cracking.

#2 - Larger or modified stock location oil pump
Built engines with larger than stock bearing clearances need more flow and oil pressure. Again you now have so many options for stock location oil pumps. The 11mm and 12mm dealer supplied as well as the aftermarket modified versions of these. Combined with the larger oil pan and pickup you will have a great oil supply. Note: You need an oil pressure and oil temp guauge to know what pressure you are running at what RPM. Rule of thumb, 10psi oil pressure needed for 1000 rpm. I like to add 5psi to this. So at 7000 rpm you want 75 psi min at the max operating temp. Either shim or change oil to get this.

#3 - Accusump :- Optional but recommended for AutoX and Track use
If you plan to do alot of AutoX or track time which will high G stress the car I still recommend an Accusump.

Even with a larger oil pan with pickup and baffles and higher flow oil pump you may still be able to starve the oil pump or suck up some air which will reduce your oil pressure. An Accusump is a good backup system for if this happens. It's a simple oil accumulator which backs up your engine oiling system. The oil pump pressurizes it and when the oil pressure drops off the accusump keeps the pressure stable for a little amount of time. So if you suck up an air bubble the Accusump will keep the oil pressure stable until the oil pump picks up again. An Accusump will also help with oiling during initial start up. Oh and you get to run yet another 2-3 quarts of oil as it's stored in the accusump itself.

You can plumb the Accusump into either the front or rear oil galley on top of the block. Or "T" it in (with no backfill check valve) to your oil cooler. Or I think it could be plumbed into a port on an oil sandwich adapter.

#4 - Oil Cooler :- Optional but recommended for Track use
As oil gets hot we all know it gets thinner. Track use especially in hot areas will stress the cooling system and an oil cooler can help manage oil temps. Remember the oil goes to more places than the coolant so it does the lions share of engine cooling. Again, many options on the market now. Look for ones that have at least dash 10 input/output otherwise the oil cooler may actually cause a restriction. I personally like the sandwich adapters that include a temperature controlled valve which bypasses the oil cooler while the oil is cool.
68Cadillac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2013, 11:10 PM   #3
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

There's no point on a street car. The ONLY time we recommend them is a circle or oval track setup.

If you want the best high performance wet sump available for a Subaru feel free to look us up
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 09:31 AM   #4
CatfaceType-R
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 81102
Join Date: Feb 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Only if you believe, brodo. x2
Default

I like element tuning's kit...I would love a dry sump, if u can afford it, do it.
CatfaceType-R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 11:19 AM   #5
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

A proper dry sump, for a boxer, will scavenge off the heads as well as the sump. This is why we don't recommend OTS kits as none have this feature. They run WAY more oil than needed to compensate for this which is not my preference.
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 05:14 PM   #6
CatfaceType-R
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 81102
Join Date: Feb 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Only if you believe, brodo. x2
Default

Iirc, there is space for additional stages, all u would need is hardware to accomplish that.
CatfaceType-R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2013, 09:32 PM   #7
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

5-stages to do it properly IMO and ONLY on a timing belt not a rubbed belt. The dry sump kits (that I'm aware of) put their 2-3 stages in a location where there is no room for the longer 5-stage scavenge pump setup. DIY is the way to go here.
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 12:29 AM   #8
cpturbo
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 49175
Join Date: Nov 2003
Vehicle:
2004 STI
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
5-stages to do it properly IMO and ONLY on a timing belt not a rubbed belt. The dry sump kits (that I'm aware of) put their 2-3 stages in a location where there is no room for the longer 5-stage scavenge pump setup. DIY is the way to go here.
One of these "systems" is used by Element Tuning and Phil has not lost a motor. We all know how competitive he is. He races what he sells and wins very often. In my book, there are two major shortcomings of the EJ motor. The oiling and the cylinder heads!

Element has a road race answer to oiling and, perhaps, Killer B has one for autocross and street driving. I have used both Element and Killer B stuff. Both have their niche and both work very well!
cpturbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 08:28 AM   #9
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpturbo View Post
One of these "systems" is used by Element Tuning and Phil has not lost a motor. We all know how competitive he is. He races what he sells and wins very often. In my book, there are two major shortcomings of the EJ motor. The oiling and the cylinder heads!

Element has a road race answer to oiling and, perhaps, Killer B has one for autocross and street driving. I have used both Element and Killer B stuff. Both have their niche and both work very well!
And the Element one runs boat loads of oil as I already stated. It works, but IMO this is a band-aid method. Nothing against Phil he's certainly earned his reputation, he's found what works for him and that's great, we just have different philosophies. The better method is to pull oil from the heads (not letting them just fill with oil) like the Porsche guys do.

FWIW our products are tested and used on a Suby team that runs 24 hour events on the Nurburgring. This is the most greuling motorsports event we've come across and their performance expectation are demanding to say the least. Since switching to the Killer B wet sump setup a few years ago they have not had one single instance of oil starvation vs the OEM/Cosworth setup. Our products are run on MANY time attack-cars (regional and national time-attack podium finishes too) as well as national Rally Champs.

So back to my original statement... I see no need for a dry sump except on an oval or circle track setup. The costs to do it well FAR outweigh the benefits.

As far as Auto-X or street level performance... If you ever read some of our technical stuff you'd know we do NOT recommend our high performance sump for a mild street car (it's just not required), nor for 95% of the auto-x courses. I'd never recommend someone spend unneeded money, and the OEM sump is just fine for these duties. Do a lot of guys run our sump on the street, without a doubt. They are very often used to compliment engine builds for those seeking the best performance potential. The setup really makes a contribution on road coarses, where the OEM setup falls short.
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 12:34 PM   #10
Class5
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 350172
Join Date: Mar 2013
Default

What are some of the good dry sump systems? Who has best price, cosworth seems pricey!
Class5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 01:28 PM   #11
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

^ DIY save your money.
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 01:37 PM   #12
Matty_STi
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 333602
Join Date: Sep 2012
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Vehicle:
2012 STi
DGM

Default

Not that I'm planning on it myself - but: what sort of maintenance is required of the dry sump components. Read on a few product pages about increased maintenance requirements but nothing specific as to what is required. Lots if emphasis seems to have been placed on more work being required. What would be so important to place that extra emphasis?

Matt
Matty_STi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 02:09 PM   #13
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

Impeller, bearings, pulley, etc... It's a item that doesn't take well to neglect and will bite you in the butt if it is. For teams that run on a 40-50 hour rebuild schedule it's no big deal, it's just part of the breakdown, inspection and rebuilding process like many other components of an engine. On a street car 50 hours passes by VERY quickly, sooner than a typical OCI

FWIW I like the Peterson 5-Stage setup
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 02:17 PM   #14
Element Tuning
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 54918
Join Date: Feb 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Gaithersburg, MD
Vehicle:
673 WHP Element
Tuning Pro Comp Engine

Default

Some people need a dry sump and others don't it's as simple as that. Our car couldn't survive without it but we run slicks and tons of downforce. No improved oil pan worked for us and there are other cars running upgraded pans/pickups/windage and are on their 5th motor. Some people just don't want to listen but whatever right?

Ok so a bigger/better oil pan and pickup won't help you if the oil is stuck in the heads around a high g turn. Once you're done with the high g turn it's too late but the oil does eventually make it's way down to the pan. When the oil gets stuck in the head the crankcase pressure that is ventilated through the valve covers pushes the oil out into your intake or into your catch can. Even if you have a drain back catch can it won't work 100% but if you have a drain back to the crankcase it's just another vent for the crankcase pressure to push out of.

We sell the Killer B stuff to our street guys, drag racers, and track day customers so I don't have anything bad to say about it.

Cars that we build specifically with slicks and high downforce we recommend our dry sump (I can't speak for other kits) because we've tested it and made adjustments so it's proven.

So I totally disagree with a lot of what said in this thread so I'm going to address a few things in regards to our dry sump:

A) You don't need a 3 stage oil pump with our engines. Our engines are blueprinted and designed to maintain proper oil pressure using the OEM oil pump. If you have an engine that is not capable we can add a 3rd pressure stage to our kit and it does fit in the same location. We also do small 3rd scavenge stages for low mount turbochargers like what some of the Porsche swaps use.

B) A scavenge pump pulls a healthy amount of vacuum to the pan and oil recovery is exceptional.

C) When oil gets trapped in the heads momentarily it's pushed into the vent tubes which terminate in your dry sump tank. So it doesn't stay trapped in the valve covers, it pushes into the dry sump tank to be recycled.

D) Most of the oil capacity is just in hoses and we only run the dry sump tank 1/2 full so the engine has exceptional breathing capacity and the ability to separate air from oil and not push excessive oil into the catch can.

So if you're a "hard parker" you don't need the dry sump but if you're a hard core racer and $3400 isn't going to bankrupt you, it's cheap insurance for that $12k motor.

Know who you are, what you do, and if you can afford it, well worth it. If you try to make a kit on your own and you get it wrong well that's your fault so buy something that's proven/tested in a racing Subaru.

Thanks,
Phil Grabow

Last edited by Element Tuning; 03-14-2013 at 02:44 PM.
Element Tuning is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 03:19 PM   #15
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

Phil,

your opinion is based on your knowledge and experience and no one is questioning the place you've earned in the Subaru community. We just have a difference of opinion.

We have our measly wet sump setup on dedicated race cars all over the world including 24 hour events on the 'ring', open class a Pike's Peak, and even on Time-Attack podium finishing cars, similar to your own. These are RACE CARS, not weekend play toys. To date not one single instance of stavation has been datalogged. With years of data from many sources my opinion on the subject stays. Unless your going in continuous circles or upside down, like some of our aircraft customers, a dry sump system is not needed.

We've consulted those running circle/oval and aircraft setups in the design of a dry sump system. I just never saw the point of putting together a pile of somone else's parts and selling it as our own. Although I'm the first to admit, I fail horribly as a marketing guy, and I detest salesmen and how they sell fear or glamorize products. At the level of needing a dry sump I would hope the knowledge is also there to assemble fittings, lines, build a REALLY good setup, and save a few bucks in the process.
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 03:32 PM   #16
ckyguy68
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 316296
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Metro Detroit
Vehicle:
2006 STIROID
10.5@131 on 29psi

Default

Chris, I am very excited to be running your pan and windage tray. Sounds like a cost-effective solution to any oiling concerns for most of the people on here. Of course there is an end-all be-all oiling system but it sounds like you have the facts and experience to back up an affordable product!
ckyguy68 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 03:32 PM   #17
CatfaceType-R
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 81102
Join Date: Feb 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Only if you believe, brodo. x2
Default

dry sumps are good for reliability in high stress/power, this is what's important. Not starving for oil (per kb's purported data) doesn't mean it didn't almost starve for oil. (As phil said, cheap insurance)

If u read marco from magnus' posts as one of the premier 4g63 builders; he, like Phil, feels they keep their motors alive.

My .02 cents from reading.

Gm and porsche put it on their high end stuff, they see little or no aerial or ground racing. . Again, see cheap insurance.
CatfaceType-R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 04:00 PM   #18
Irv Weissmanhowerton
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 278519
Join Date: Apr 2011
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Area P, Alliance Fab
Vehicle:
30r E85 STI K'biz
Phatbotti Tuning

Default Mock up, If everyone had of one these their motors would last




Give or take 3500+ when done the whole set-up is ready

Last edited by Irv Weissmanhowerton; 03-14-2013 at 04:10 PM.
Irv Weissmanhowerton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 04:47 PM   #19
Element Tuning
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 54918
Join Date: Feb 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Gaithersburg, MD
Vehicle:
673 WHP Element
Tuning Pro Comp Engine

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
Phil,

your opinion is based on your knowledge and experience and no one is questioning the place you've earned in the Subaru community. We just have a difference of opinion.

We have our measly wet sump setup on dedicated race cars all over the world including 24 hour events on the 'ring', open class a Pike's Peak, and even on Time-Attack podium finishing cars, similar to your own. These are RACE CARS, not weekend play toys. To date not one single instance of stavation has been datalogged. With years of data from many sources my opinion on the subject stays. Unless your going in continuous circles or upside down, like some of our aircraft customers, a dry sump system is not needed.

We've consulted those running circle/oval and aircraft setups in the design of a dry sump system. I just never saw the point of putting together a pile of somone else's parts and selling it as our own. Although I'm the first to admit, I fail horribly as a marketing guy, and I detest salesmen and how they sell fear or glamorize products. At the level of needing a dry sump I would hope the knowledge is also there to assemble fittings, lines, build a REALLY good setup, and save a few bucks in the process.
Like I said not needed by everyone but I can tell you I probably know many of the same people as you. I do know of many that have your product and or others who are still losing motors due to spun bearings. Now I also know of guys that race at the ring and they didn't have problems with the OEM pan and neither did I until I crossed a certain threshold. You don't hear about it because they don't blame your product or the other wet sump solutions, it's just the reality of some race cars.

Killer B and other pan upgrades help, no doubt, but people are starving bearings using them, it's not a perfect solution. I will name somebody if you want, don't feel I need to however, because it's foolish to think a wet sump pan is going to solve everyone's oiling issues. If this was the case there would be no "dry sump."

It's this threshold crossing that you will either learn the hard way or you'll spend the money on a dry sump and never know if you really needed it. So if you are close to thinking you need it and you have $3400 why not? Trust me when I say this, people who have chosen to go dry sump will not cost you any business because they've all had either your pan or others and let's face it nobody wants to spend $3k on a dry sump.

I burned up 3 motors back to back and then dry sumped it and lived happily every after. I only offer a dry sump because it was absolutely needed by yours truly and trust when I say, I'm not getting rich selling dry sumps, I offer it because some people really need it and I wanted to offer an affordable one for my customers. The improvements we've seen on the race car engine in terms of ring seal, cylinder wall lubrication, oil blow by/recovery, and bearing life are worth the price alone!!!

For most people a pan/pickup/windage tray will do, I'm not disagreeing here.
Element Tuning is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 06:50 PM   #20
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

I've seen the datalogs on OEM and other aftermarket wet sumps showing starvation, but have not on our setup. Obviously, the designs are different.

I don't think you're giving the hardcore racers enough credit here. For the most part, well versed in datalogging and can determine what caused the engine failure during the autopsy. There are some that do go things on their own and many others that I hear from; privateers regularly do touch base too as their budgets don't have as much tolerance for failure. We supply MANY other shop's race cars with our sump setup as well. Not only do they run the part, they sell it too. If they have a problem with a product they sell, like said product blowing motors up, it would be REALLY bad and I'm CERTAIN we'd hear about it. Heck in the years we've been making the product if it caused failures someone would have surely posted about it on nasioc, iwsti, clubwrx, rs25, etc., etc., etc..... You want to talk about picky and anal retentive to the bazillionth degree, start working with aircraft guys! Talk about a group concerned about engine failure! From my experience Subaru guys tend to be more knowledgable and educated about the mods, processes and if something's not right, you hear about it! Heck I hear about it if we forget to put a sticker in the box!

You're absolutely right, I have zero concern about dry sump taking away Killer B sales. The market is just tiny. I even got a provisional patent on a multi-pickup wet sump system that would truly eliminate the need for dry sump in ANY situation, but never went forward with manufacturing because even at 1/2 the cost and complexity of a dry sump the market that needs it is too small to justify making them. That, and I've personally NEVER seen an instance of oil starvation on our current setup. If I had data showing otherwise, a product like might make sense.

For the record, I recommend the OEM pan for anyone who street drives or tracks occasionally. Beyond that, the performance levels tend to push the OEM sump beyond its capabilities. That is when I will recommend our oiling setup as a means to assure proper oiling is acomplished. Just like I will never recommend an oil cooler (no matter how hella awesome your 'build' is) unless you can tell me what your oil temps actually are first

I hope this doesn't come off as a Phil bashing session because that's not the intention here. We've both had our respective journeys (as a shop and as a manufacturer) that have brought us to where we are today. His experiences have formed his opinion and my experiences have formed mine, which is all good with me.
KillerBMotorsport is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2013, 07:00 PM   #21
Matty_STi
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 333602
Join Date: Sep 2012
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Vehicle:
2012 STi
DGM

Default

Multipickup wet sump. Sounds naughty. I like it. In my ever expanding quest for knowledge that will likely provide me with little to no benefit I must learn more about this!!!

-Matt
Matty_STi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2013, 04:19 PM   #22
Innovative Tuning
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 67958
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: www.InnovativeTuning.com
Vehicle:
MY96 Time Attack
and 06 STI daily

Default

A dry sump system provides control over the oiling system that a wet sump design isn't capable of. As soon as oil exits your pickup and enters the oil pump, your wet sump pan relies on the factory oiling system to get that oil through the engine etc. all the way back to your pan and therein lies a significant limiting factor in the effectiveness of a wet sump system.

A high HP time attack car like Phil's can put lots of power down at high RPM while taking a high speed sweeper. That induces the following combination:
significant crankcase pressure
high oil flow
high oil flow requirement
high G
long duration corner

That combination is a recipe for disaster without proper oil control that a good dry sump system provides. Oil is being pumped very quickly and he needs to flow a lot of oil to support the RPM and power level. Then the crankcase pressure is firing oil into breathers and G forces are holding oil in the head on the outside of the corner so a significant amount of oil is not getting back to the pan. If the corner is long enough that the oil capacity of the pan is overcome...game over.

When a significant amount of oil isn't getting back to the pan, improved pan/pickup design and larger capacity only buy you time. The same goes for an Accusump.

As Phil stated, a wet sump is sufficient for the vast majority of Subaru owners.
Innovative Tuning is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2013, 11:17 PM   #23
scby rex
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 104878
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: copperas cove
Vehicle:
02 wrxbastardchild
aw, MPS 2.34 breaking in

Default

The setup Irv posted is very similar to the Zen performance setup in the UK. Will it be ran off the timing belt idler too or crank pulley?
scby rex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2013, 11:45 PM   #24
dstroy
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 283711
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Newport
Vehicle:
2012 STI sedan
Black with scratches

Default

That looks like a Daley engineering dry sump. Where are you going to drill and tap the heads at?
dstroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2013, 11:49 PM   #25
Matty_STi
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 333602
Join Date: Sep 2012
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Vehicle:
2012 STi
DGM

Default

V8 guys talk about gaining some serious power from dry sump (in some cases like 40-60hp). Is that something that is seen on subies (perhaps not those levels of hp gains, but meaningful ones)?? Just to throw another wrench in the works.

Matt
Matty_STi is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:30 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.