Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Thursday October 30, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Electrical & Lighting

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-02-2013, 02:27 AM   #1
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default Possible problem with aftermarket security? Crank but no start.

For tl;dr version skip to bold red letters at bottom. Good friend of mine traded for an 02 WRX, offered it to me for a very good price because he knows I've wanted one since I was 10, couldn't resist. Found out the previous owner was a piece of... work. Going to be as descriptive as possible on this one.

Had no battery when he got it, was sitting for a while. Friend said he got the car to start and drive shortly, and I do trust him, he's not trying to screw me. Some one else I trust saw it run so I KNOW it CAN start. Previous owner had catch can set up completely wrong (pressurizing crankcase) and some other nuances so I decided to address those first and put as much back to stock as possible. Put evap/vacuum back according to FSM. The only thing not stock on it now is a Spectre (ew) intake and MAF mount clamped to the rubber intake tube after it exits from under the intake manifold, and the boost controller is disconnected with the wastegate looped to mani pressure (basically all unrelated). Also just remembered the EGT is gone because he was screwing with the exhaust, but I'm told that will just throw a CEL.

Picture of car on the day it was picked up from PO. You can see the spectre pipe.


Put the battery in it, double checked everything with a friend to make sure nothing was unhooked, and then we were ready to start. Opened the door and noticed the instrument cluster flashing at me and the corner lights were all flashing in time, almost like hazards. The horn is apparently disconnected so no idea on that. After about twenty seconds it stops. Putting the key in, turning the key to ON, or opening the doors all make the car do this. I have a video of the first attempted start if it helps.

Let the fuel pump prime and turned it over. Engine turns but no fire. It is definitely getting fuel, you can smell it in the exhaust after some cranking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95VBy_rlxHM

Had to work very early the next morning and still had a 90 minute ride home so we couldn't do much after that. It's definitely getting fuel, you can smell it in the exhaust. Didn't have time to pull the coils/plugs to check for spark. Dug underneath the dash quickly and found an Audiovox security system. No remotes or anything came with the car, just a single key. The security system box has thick gauge wires leading upwards towards the steering column so I assume it's wired into the ignition for an immobilizer. The car is just a mess so it wasnt easy to determine in the few minutes I had before my deadline to leave.

I do not have any experience whatsoever with security systems but I assumed the wire from the ignition is interrupted by the SS, which allows connectivity through the main ignition wire when it is what i call "condition green" (everything okay, car not being stolen). I thought about this some more and realized if that were the case, turning the key to ON wouldn't do anything if the SS was the problem.

What exactly would the SS box be intercepting? How would I go about removing it? All I am trying to do is get the car running so I can move it to a more permanent working location. Can't keep it in its current location because the shop owner is relocating. I have wiring diagrams and if I knew what wire to re-splice back to OEM I am confident in fixing it. I figure I could put them all back if the wiring isn't mangled too badly (again, PO was really awful and I'm afraid of what I'm going to find). The only problem is that would take a while, and we had to push the car outside. In my area it is very wet/icy/snowy and about 25-30 degrees lately so if I could do it within 30 minutes that would be wonderful.

Also I tried starting after unplugging the main harness on the SS box. I figured it wouldn't work but worth a shot because I had to try as many things as possible quickly. Called me friend and he said look in the center console for the Subaru SS box, it was not there but there are signs that it once was. Also no security light blinking in the cluster.

One more thing I almost forgot. When I was putting the car back to stock I noticed the green diagnostic plug was connected for some reason. I unplugged it and never thought about it until after I was home. Would that possibly make any difference with it starting? I never tried starting with it connected. I wouldn't think so but figured I should put it in to get EVERY detail I can... It's hard to diagnose without all of the info.

I am going up to try to start it Friday. Hopefully I won't have to pay for a rollback, I'm flat broke after buying the car.

Thanks for any help guys. I've been a member on here for a while but I've mainly been using Legacygt.com and am just now really becoming part of the family since finally getting my dream car. I know she looks rough in the video but I'm rescuing her, and I'm doing everything right-- no shortcuts or cheap routes.

tl;dr Just got the car, everything hooked up, cranks but won't start, even though it should. Has run recently, but not by me. Audiovox alarm system found under dash. How would you proceed?
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2013, 06:39 AM   #2
Aaron'z 2.5RS
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 1026
Join Date: Mar 2000
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Hickigan
Vehicle:
'00 RS/WRX Stg5
'98 RS Stock

Default

you're going to have to trace every connection of that POS alarm and repair the harness... IMO...

You've unplugged, or someone unplugged the brain and the car is still not working, the harness is a mess...

Start tracing wires, find the connection, remove and reinsulate well with tape...


The green connector is the test mode connector, "usually" when that's plugged in, the car is in test mode and does a bunch of weird things, rad fans cycle, fuel pump cycles...ect... IT's also used to flash maps into post 02 cars..

99.99% of the time is stays unplugged

Last edited by Aaron'z 2.5RS; 01-02-2013 at 06:45 AM.
Aaron'z 2.5RS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2013, 10:35 AM   #3
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default

Yeah I knew what the diagnostic connector was for, that's why I unplugged it in the first place when I saw it. I just wasn't sure if it would have an effect in this situation.

I think I may have access to a full trailer with a winch Friday so I will plan on moving it manually. Fighting an alarm system while kneeling on cold wet gravel does not sound enjoyable, lol.
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2013, 08:03 AM   #4
Charlie-III
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 30669
Join Date: Dec 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: 07456, North NJ
Vehicle:
1998 Legacy 2.5GT
Silver Sleeper Wagon

Default

Can you get a manual for the alarm? If so, it will tell you what it's connected to making repair/removal easier.

You may also find a local alarm dealer where you can get a new remote, then maybe no rewiring.
Charlie-III is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2013, 07:34 PM   #5
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default

Probably could if there were markings on the SS box to ID it. I'll look closer tomorrow, I'm taking the drive up tonight and staying at my friend's house. If I have any progress I will update.
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2013, 08:35 PM   #6
Charlie-III
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 30669
Join Date: Dec 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: 07456, North NJ
Vehicle:
1998 Legacy 2.5GT
Silver Sleeper Wagon

Default

Yeah, I understand your issue. We just bought a Jeep with an alarm but no remote, no manual.

I'm guiding my son through the "discovery" on a lot of this. So yes, I'm sorta in the same boat (but the Jeep is starting & running).

Let us know, hopefully someone can help out.
Charlie-III is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2013, 10:45 PM   #7
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default

Tried to start the car with the diagnostic plug connected, no fire still. Moved the car to my permanent workplace at a friend's house. It was about 25 degrees, wet, and windy so I didn't really get much done.

I did take a picture of the alarm system. The shock sensor says Audiovox and the model# is AP5996. I googled it and found nothing. There are also markings to indicate that it was manufactured in November of 02. I went to the Audiovox website and not only didn't find that alarm system or a remote, but I didn't see a way to inquire about it.

Looks like I'll be cutting it out. The good news is it looks like it was professionally installed so it shouldn't be a huge mess when I'm done.

Moving on... I talked to my friend who saw the car run and he said that he and the guy who traded it to me replaced the turbo because the one that was on it had shaft play. He asked if the O2 sensors were plugged in. They are not... none of them are. Neither is the EGT.

Is there a failsafe that stops the car from not starting without at least a front O2? What about the EGT sensor?

The car came with a spare stock manifold that has the EGT and front O2 in it, and because cutting was done for an aftermarket EGT I am pretty much going to have to swap the manifold... I wish it wasn't so cold out. I'm going to do this ASAP but I was just wondering if I should be looking into other things until then.

Also, tried to check for spark from the coil... but couldn't because my leg isn't 4 feet long to hold the clutch while looking and cranking.

Last edited by Tripwire_RC8; 01-04-2013 at 11:41 PM.
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2013, 10:32 PM   #8
Charlie-III
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 30669
Join Date: Dec 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: 07456, North NJ
Vehicle:
1998 Legacy 2.5GT
Silver Sleeper Wagon

Default

Here is where to look for the alarm #, I didn't find anything either on the shock sensor.... http://www.audiovoxproducts.com/support/

I don't see why you couldn't start the car while missing sensors (EGT, O2, etc.).
Charlie-III is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2013, 11:15 AM   #9
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default

The car should run without O2 sensors. With the corner lights/instrument panel blinking I am forced to assume that there is no spark because of the security system. It will be warm on Wednesday so I will go up and take another shot at it. I really want this friggin thing running.
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2013, 11:33 PM   #10
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default

Update: After all of that, I pulled the front O2 out of the stock header and put it on. Car started right up.

Still running really rough unless you rev into closed loop, but I assume that's because I didn't have time to put the EGT probe in.
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2013, 06:34 AM   #11
Aaron'z 2.5RS
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 1026
Join Date: Mar 2000
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Hickigan
Vehicle:
'00 RS/WRX Stg5
'98 RS Stock

Default

Yeah, without the EGT its in limp mode
Aaron'z 2.5RS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2013, 08:49 PM   #12
Tripwire_RC8
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 138968
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Winchester, VA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Blaze Yellow

Default

Front O2 was shot anyway. EGT was stopping it from starting at all. I unplugged the MAF to run in safe mode. Warning: Don't do this unless you know the risks. It's a temporary "fix".
Tripwire_RC8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.