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Old 03-12-2013, 02:00 PM   #1351
EvilCamaroSS
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No, they are Subaru's and will inherently hold their value. An STI will hold its value better than a WRX. The 'rarity' of the limited means nothing in resale as you will have to find somebody who wants that weird shade of orange. So that is a subset of an already small set. Just get the STI and be far happier
I test drove a MY11 STi and a MY13 WRX.

I liked the WRX better by leaps and bounds. I'm not buying this car because I want to rally it. I drive 50 miles round trip per day to work, and I have to get here in rain, snow, sleet, blizzard, hurricane, etc.

The STi felt raw and unrefined. The WRX felt more smooth and refined. For that reason alone I won't buy a STi. If I could get a Legacy GT I would, but Subaru killed my car, and if I want an AWD car with some decent power and a manual transmission for under 30K The WRX is my only option.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:54 PM   #1352
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Engines are assembled on their own lines. The only possible product now for 2.5L turbo engines would be the WRX/STI (Legacy and Forester have already converted to the 2.0 DIT) . The WRX/STI is a low volume car line. It's far cheaper to make only one turbo engine type, the 2.0 DIT. It's likely the only structural change necessary for the current WRX/STI to accommodate the 2.0 DIT is a new cross-member for the chassis (the existing hood scoop could still be used for the intercooler). The "mules" have demonstrated the new engine "fits" fine in the current body.

Edit: Forgot to point out that the Legacy 2.0 DIT in Japan (which has a hood scoop) did not require a full model change (FMC), or even a facelift, to accommodate the new 2.0 DIT engine.
There's a lot of logistics, safety and cost issues around a significant change to a world wide manufactured car, it has nothing to do with a "test mule engine swap" done by a small crew. Just making sure the new engine mounts pass all QC tests and are cleared for production is a significant investment. Again, from a business perspective, it's throwing money out the window. Also, their resources should be focused on finalizing the new WRX, not making changes to the current one.
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:28 PM   #1353
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There's a lot of logistics, safety and cost issues around a significant change to a world wide manufactured car, it has nothing to do with a "test mule engine swap" done by a small crew. Just making sure the new engine mounts pass all QC tests and are cleared for production is a significant investment. Again, from a business perspective, it's throwing money out the window. Also, their resources should be focused on finalizing the new WRX, not making changes to the current one.

I tend to agree, also why would Subaru want to do this?
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Old 03-12-2013, 05:32 PM   #1354
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I tend to agree, also why would Subaru want to do this?
Because one dude wants the new engine in the current car
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Old 03-12-2013, 06:06 PM   #1355
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Because one dude wants the new engine in the current car
There have been people on here "confirming" the new WRX will be a MY2015, so they obviously won't drop the new engine in the MY2014 for the last year of the super old model.

I wouldn't be so sure that there will be a 2.0DIT in the WRX either. I don't care if SOA said it would have a 2.0DIT 1.5-2yrs ago, a lot could of changed in that time. Plus the so-called "industry sources" have been saying the WRX with have EITHER a 1.6DIT or 2.0DIT. Subaru hadn't set anything in stone. It's possible we could see a 1.6DIT in the WRX and a 2.0DIT in the STI. Will be a great way to differentiate the models. Remember, SOA made their 2.0DIT claim a long, long time ago. Plus, FHI wouldn't have told anyone anything by that early stage.
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Old 03-12-2013, 06:41 PM   #1356
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Remember, SOA made their 2.0DIT claim a long, long time ago. Plus, FHI wouldn't have told anyone anything by that early stage.
Actually, I don't remember. WTH are you talking about?
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Old 03-12-2013, 06:47 PM   #1357
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How much input does SOA even have in design and engineering. Seems FHI is the lead?
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:47 PM   #1358
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How much input does SOA even have in design and engineering. Seems FHI is the lead?
Not sure when SOA made that claim, maybe 1.5-2yrs ago? Might have been Car & Driver. People on here made a forum about it.

I'm saying don't take it for granted that the WRX will have a 2.0DIT. Yes there's one for the forestor, but that's a bigger vehicle. Plus with the WRX being so far away from release, there's still plenty of time for them to refine a 1.6 if that's what they're doing. From "rumors" and "quotes from sources" I've read, FHI is very keen on a 1.6DIT as this will deliver good mpg. Plus like I said, FHI wouldn't have told SOA a 2.0DIT was confirmed that early in development. A 1.6 engine would be quite peaky and highly stressed, but there's still a chance a 1.6DIT could be being tested alongside a 2.0DIT.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:50 PM   #1359
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We have no concrete evidence that that mule was testing anything. For all we know it could just be testing the 2.0DIT or maybe hood scoop design. Maybe it could be for an Impreza Turbo.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:52 PM   #1360
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Not sure when SOA made that claim, maybe 1.5-2yrs ago? Might have been Car & Driver. People on here made a forum about it.

I'm saying don't take it for granted that the WRX will have a 2.0DIT. Yes there's one for the forestor, but that's a bigger vehicle. Plus with the WRX being so far away from release, there's still plenty of time for them to refine a 1.6 if that's what they're doing. From "rumors" and "quotes from sources" I've read, FHI is very keen on a 1.6DIT as this will deliver good mpg. Plus like I said, FHI wouldn't have told SOA a 2.0DIT was confirmed that early in development. A 1.6 engine would be quite peaky and highly stressed, but there's still a chance a 1.6DIT could be being tested alongside a 2.0DIT.
I tend to disagree, I think that Subaru will follow the same formula that they have right now. Have the WRX and STI share the same displacement but add a bigger turbo to th STI.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:53 PM   #1361
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We have no concrete evidence that that mule was testing anything. For all we know it could just be testing the 2.0DIT or maybe hood scoop design. Maybe it could be for an Impreza Turbo.
Someone stated on another forum that the mule was spotted in Canada with a auto Trans. Idk how true this is but it's certainly interesting.

Last edited by cannedtuna; 03-12-2013 at 08:59 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:21 PM   #1362
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Not sure when SOA made that claim, maybe 1.5-2yrs ago? Might have been Car & Driver. People on here made a forum about it.
...
Plus like I said, FHI wouldn't have told SOA a 2.0DIT was confirmed that early in development.
This is all nonsense and none of it is true. SOA's current president, Takeshi Tachimori, also serves as an FHI Corporate Senior Vice President and was formerly President of STI. Does anyone else seriously believe he's kept in the dark about FHI's powertrain development plans? SOA has never said anything about the 2.0 DIT engine outside of the context of its use in the new Forester.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:52 PM   #1363
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This is all nonsense and none of it is true. SOA's current president, Takeshi Tachimori, also serves as an FHI Corporate Senior Vice President and was formerly President of STI. Does anyone else seriously believe he's kept in the dark about FHI's powertrain development plans? SOA has never said anything about the 2.0 DIT engine outside of the context of its use in the new Forester.
+1

SOA isn't as disconnected as many think.
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Old 03-12-2013, 10:24 PM   #1364
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We have no concrete evidence that that mule was testing anything. For all we know it could just be testing the 2.0DIT or maybe hood scoop design. Maybe it could be for an Impreza Turbo.
Yea, test the 2.0 DIT in an Imprezza chassis when you already have it in the Forester. Makes loads of sense, or better yet test the hood scoop design by putting a 2.0 DIT in an Imprezza.

Common sense dictates that they put that engine in an Imprezza / WRX chassis for a reason.

I'm just waiting for the NYIAS - Hopefully it will shed some light, Maybe the Legacy is going to have a 2.0 DIT option.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:42 PM   #1365
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Originally Posted by EvilCamaroSS View Post
I test drove a MY11 STi and a MY13 WRX.

I liked the WRX better by leaps and bounds. I'm not buying this car because I want to rally it. I drive 50 miles round trip per day to work, and I have to get here in rain, snow, sleet, blizzard, hurricane, etc.

The STi felt raw and unrefined. The WRX felt more smooth and refined. For that reason alone I won't buy a STi. If I could get a Legacy GT I would, but Subaru killed my car, and if I want an AWD car with some decent power and a manual transmission for under 30K The WRX is my only option.
The LGT wouldn't have been under $30K. Edit. Sorry. I was thinking only the limited they had at the end. Not the premium they might have had if they didn't kill it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NZrex View Post
Not sure when SOA made that claim, maybe 1.5-2yrs ago? Might have been Car & Driver. People on here made a forum about it.

I'm saying don't take it for granted that the WRX will have a 2.0DIT. Yes there's one for the forestor, but that's a bigger vehicle. Plus with the WRX being so far away from release, there's still plenty of time for them to refine a 1.6 if that's what they're doing. From "rumors" and "quotes from sources" I've read, FHI is very keen on a 1.6DIT as this will deliver good mpg. Plus like I said, FHI wouldn't have told SOA a 2.0DIT was confirmed that early in development. A 1.6 engine would be quite peaky and highly stressed, but there's still a chance a 1.6DIT could be being tested alongside a 2.0DIT.

Subaru builds and tests many engines. When they were developing the diesel, they had several variations. It started at something like a 1.2L, then upped to a 1.6L, to a 1.8L before getting to their target 2.0L. That mule could be testing just about anything. E85. Hydrogen. Hybrid. Nuclear. Kidding.
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Old 03-13-2013, 07:14 AM   #1366
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Maybe they will show it first in rallytrim?
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Old 03-13-2013, 07:26 AM   #1367
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Maybe they will show it first in rallytrim?
Here's hoping but I wouldn't want to see them make this attempt and possibly fail it would hurt their company very bad. If you look at WRC recently VW and Citroen are the only players currently, with Hyundai possibly joining in a year or 2. Its just not profitable for companies and seeing how bad PSA is doing as of recent I wouldn't be surprised if they pull out like Ford did and Mini did after only 2 seasons.
But if you're referring to GRC then disregard my ramblings....
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Old 03-13-2013, 09:53 AM   #1368
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Something has happened to me in the past couple of weeks. I want to order an STI. Something has changed my opinion of it from "haphazardly fast, boy-racer chintsy econobox " to "rugged, simple, proven and practical with a precision performance edge "

At the same time, I'm imagining the new WRX to be fragile and soft, overwrought with technology. And if it's any smaller inside, impractical. I think that's driving this.

Really I'm just jonesing for a new car. So much uncertainty. Please Subaru, show something substantial in NY. Please.
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Old 03-13-2013, 10:09 AM   #1369
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And if it's any smaller inside, impractical.
I wouldn't mind it being a bit smaller. I do like that I can carry two rear-facing carseats in the back (a feat I couldn't even pull off in my old 2006 Legacy; the WRX is bigger), but in a couple years I won't need that capability and something a bit more compact would be welcome. I kinda wish we'd get something along the lines of the old pre-02 Impreza size.
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Old 03-13-2013, 10:17 AM   #1370
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Something has happened to me in the past couple of weeks. I want to order an STI. Something has changed my opinion of it from "haphazardly fast, boy-racer chintsy econobox " to "rugged, simple, proven and practical with a precision performance edge "

At the same time, I'm imagining the new WRX to be fragile and soft, overwrought with technology. And if it's any smaller inside, impractical. I think that's driving this.

Really I'm just jonesing for a new car. So much uncertainty. Please Subaru, show something substantial in NY. Please.
That's a lot of adjectives for something you know nothing about.
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Old 03-13-2013, 10:31 AM   #1371
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That's a lot of adjectives for something you know nothing about.
Right!?!?
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Old 03-13-2013, 10:34 AM   #1372
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My imaginary 2014 WRX is not fragile or soft. In fact,
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Old 03-13-2013, 10:48 AM   #1373
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My imaginary 2014 WRX is not fragile or soft. In fact,
Mine looks like a 1968 Mustang, albiet with AWD and a hood scoop.
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Old 03-13-2013, 11:09 AM   #1374
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Someone stated on another forum that the mule was spotted in Canada with a auto Trans. Idk how true this is but it's certainly interesting.
Where did you read that?
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Old 03-13-2013, 11:40 AM   #1375
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Maybe they will show it first in rallytrim?
or rallycross.....
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