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Old 01-15-2013, 06:33 PM   #1
ckyguy68
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Default Another Rod thread... Brian Crower H vs I Beam

I've already talked to Dustin at BC about their rods and I wanted to hear some EXPERIENCES. Not what you heard or a friend of a friend but just curious what people have experienced first hand.

He said both H and I beams are good for over 1000 crank horsepower. Just wondering what people have ran at at what power/torque level!

At 530g for the H beams and 561 for the I, both with 625 fasteners, it seems that the H would be the hot ticket.

Thanks guys.

_AK
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:13 PM   #2
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If you are building a big HP car stick to Pauter/Carrillo or TurboTuffs. They may cost more, but it is worth it in the end.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:43 PM   #3
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If GST and TIC can use the BC I beams in their road race cars, and gtx35r or bigger turbos, what makes you say not to use them? He was specifically asking for experiences. I have them in my garage and although they aren't installed yet the big end machining was very consistent. I'll get around to measuring the rest of it later.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:43 PM   #4
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Like has been posted before most h beam forgings are coming from the same source and have seen first hand an xxxxxx h-beam snap after a few 600whp (10.40's @136) drag passes in a lightweight 03 bugeye drag car.If you want big power than you had best run a beefy rod for insurance---pauter,oliver,crower I BEAM,carrillo,turbotuffs.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:50 PM   #5
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I really don't understand where this misperception about I-beam vs. H-beam came from.

H-beam rods have the potential to provide better strength and stiffness in the areas most highly stressed in a high power turbo application (high compression loads) with less mass. I-beam rods are typically preferred for a normally aspirated application where the tensile loads are the biggest concern.

That is not to say that there are not I-beam rods with sufficient strength for a big power turbo application but I am saying that this strength is achieved at a weight penalty in comparison to a well-designed H-beam rod.

This understanding comes after detailed discussions with Arrow which produces some of the best quality rods in the UK. The produce both I-beam and H-beam profiles and have done detailed FEA analysis of the distribution of stresses in the different rod designs. For the type of applications in question here, they would always recommend an H-beam type over I-beam.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:51 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john 1badSTI View Post
Like has been posted before most h beam forgings are coming from the same source and have seen first hand an xxxxxx h-beam snap after a few 600whp (10.40's @136) drag passes in a lightweight 03 bugeye drag car.If you want big power than you had best run a beefy rod for insurance---pauter,oliver,crower I BEAM,carrillo,turbotuffs.
I agree with that. I don't know where the BC H beam rods are made but their I beams are American. Oliver stopped making the Subaru rods last time I asked them though
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:54 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RalliSpec View Post
I really don't understand where this misperception about I-beam vs. H-beam came from.
Because the cheap Chinese versions that don't have the same cross section as arrow or carrillo suck for that sort of application and so people assume they all do.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:59 PM   #8
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and truth be told Pauter's are actually an x-beam style and I have always used them without any failures.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:10 PM   #9
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I like Pauter X beams or Carrillo PRO H's in my motors.

My old race motor had carrillo pro h's, like RalliSpec said H beams are the right rod to get. The problem is getting good rods, like it was mentioned a lot of companies use cheap Chinese junk..

I don't want to get into bashing anyones rods, so I am just offering my unbiased and tested opinion. I have never seen a broken Pauter or Carrillo pro rod, and I have been around a few fast subies
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:32 PM   #10
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Jr I'm not asking you to bash anything and the fact that you've been around some fast subies is why people trust your opinion. But have you had experience with BC I beams? Good or bad it's still experience which is more than many can say. I just think most people bash the company based on he said she said and not facts that's all. You're one of the people that may actually have experience.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:53 PM   #11
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I personally have not had good luck with BC across a few different platforms including Subaru. Maybe their newer stuff IE like last year or so is good, I am unwilling to give it anymore chances.

Pauter/Carrillo will be my choice for anything I build. Oliver, arrow are great choices as well.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:04 PM   #12
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Jr, any idea which version of Carrillo H beams the old Cosworth rods are?
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Old 01-15-2013, 11:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior2JZ View Post
I like Pauter X beams or Carrillo PRO H's in my motors.

My old race motor had carrillo pro h's, like RalliSpec said H beams are the right rod to get. The problem is getting good rods, like it was mentioned a lot of companies use cheap Chinese junk..

I don't want to get into bashing anyones rods, so I am just offering my unbiased and tested opinion. I have never seen a broken Pauter or Carrillo pro rod, and I have been around a few fast subies
If I remember correctly I remember some inside information on the BC stuff now using different metal that ISN'T Chinese now, can anyone confirm this?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior2JZ View Post
I personally have not had good luck with BC across a few different platforms including Subaru. Maybe their newer stuff IE like last year or so is good, I am unwilling to give it anymore chances.

Pauter/Carrillo will be my choice for anything I build. Oliver, arrow are great choices as well.
I hear what you are saying Jr, on your experience with Pauter and Carrilo. I am interested in giving BC a chance on my next build because I haven't been wronged yet. I'm really teetering on right now between Pauters and BC.

I guess curiosity did kill the cat, though.
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Old 01-16-2013, 12:04 AM   #14
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Junior were any of the rods used on a Subaru these specific I-beam BC rods?
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:22 AM   #15
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Cosworth hasn't used Carillo as their rod supplier for about 2 or 3 years. But when they did they sold both the Pro-H and Pro-A (I don't think it was the SA version).
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:48 AM   #16
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I emailed Dustin at BC about the I beams specifically and he said the steel is American. I can't say the h beam for sure but based in the rest of the product line I would guess it is also made in the US now. There is another thread where Dustin mentions a couple details about their products.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dustin213 View Post
This is Dustin from BC. If anyone has any questions or concerns with the BC line of products please feel free to contact me direct @ 619-749-9018 or email me at dustin@briancrower.com
We have used the I beam rod is some very high HP builds through the years without any issues. Manley also makes a high quality rod as well as they used to make our rods when we were getting the rod shop started. i have not used the 3MI rod but from what i hear it is a very nice piece as well. You can use any of the rods listed and you won't have any issues.
On our valve train products we use the same cam core as GSC, CROWER and JWT and our springs are wound in michigan by PAC racing who also make them for COMP, KIGGLEY and GSC.
We stand behind our products 100% and if anyone ever has an issue please contact me direct.
Idk about past products but really I think their current stuff is pretty decent.
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:14 PM   #17
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This is straight from Dustin. If these numbers are legit, the rods must be legit. Who is GST? Maybe they will chime in?

The most accurate HP for the rods I listed below as when they rated the rods on the site they have all of the different engines with the same rating and we both know that every application is different.

BC6608 –we have these in 1000HP (at the crank) engines
BC6607 –these can be used in the 1000HP engines as well
BC6606 –this is the best rod as we have these in 1200HP engines (GST ran these in the time attack car that one the championship and they were making 1200+ all season)



Thank you,

Dustin Spencer
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:37 PM   #18
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I didn't look to see when this was written but anyway if you haven't heard of them.

http://www.globaltimeattack.com/gst-motorsports/
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:53 PM   #19
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You are not likely to see Mike chime in...he is too busy making the L the fastest ****ing thing with AWD.

Although I heard rumors about something new this year. I bet some little birdies know more

http://www.globaltimeattack.com/tag/gst-motorsports/
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Old 01-16-2013, 11:56 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
Junior were any of the rods used on a Subaru these specific I-beam BC rods?
They were not I-beams, they were Hs.
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Old 01-17-2013, 01:11 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior2JZ View Post
They were not I-beams, they were Hs.
I suspected. Its kinda been beated to death lately, but there is VERY little info about the BC I-beams out there. Which is why I asked Spent quite some time searching and calling around when looking at a set and found nothing, other than the info about GST and TIC.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:15 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
I suspected. Its kinda been beated to death lately, but there is VERY little info about the BC I-beams out there. Which is why I asked Spent quite some time searching and calling around when looking at a set and found nothing, other than the info about GST and TIC.
this.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:28 AM   #23
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Old 01-17-2013, 09:08 AM   #24
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All those Rods threads make me feel gay..... why's there no Muffins thread! ;-)
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Old 01-17-2013, 01:45 PM   #25
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Still fishing for a BC user that makes series power. (That can chime in)
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