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Old 01-20-2013, 04:01 PM   #101
Md05STI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john 1badSTI
^^^^ding ding ding dyno #'s are irrelevant,1/4 mile #'s tell the tale of hp.
There not irrelevant, there just not good for comparing one car to another.
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:20 PM   #102
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What manifold/header are on this car?
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:48 PM   #103
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Stock manifold, Perrin EL header.
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:55 PM   #104
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Stock heads? If so how they holding up?
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:56 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by isca21 View Post
Stock heads? If so how they holding up?
Stock heads and cams...it's all in the OP.

Holding up fine, I guess???
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Old 01-21-2013, 03:50 PM   #106
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Doesn't say anything about heads in the op or I just can't see lolol
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Old 01-22-2013, 10:17 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isca21 View Post
Doesn't say anything about heads in the op or I just can't see lolol
Sorry you were right, I thought I had copied all the data from my website but it missed the heads/cam part...updated!
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:04 PM   #108
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Got bored this afternoon and decided to merge some dyno plots together. This is more out of curiosity, since a few people PMd me asking how my GTX compared to other turbos. I'm really not a specialist here, but grabbed a few plots that were pretty similar in builds (built engines, all bolt-ons upgraded), and I tried to make sure they were all running E85 as well, similar boost levels, all from Virtual Dyno (dynojet), etc.

So, just for comparisons sake:


whoznext - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums//sho...php?p=39001662
pet3r - this thread
juks - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2411484
ticktack - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2432563
juanmedina - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2429748
xluben - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2078765

Last edited by pet3r; 01-27-2013 at 07:14 PM.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:32 PM   #109
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Wow nice charts. I like that
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:37 AM   #110
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Wonder why whoznext is so heavy? Passengers?
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:38 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pet3r View Post
Got bored this afternoon and decided to merge some dyno plots together. This is more out of curiosity, since a few people PMd me asking how my GTX compared to other turbos. I'm really not a specialist here, but grabbed a few plots that were pretty similar in builds (built engines, all bolt-ons upgraded), and I tried to make sure they were all running E85 as well, similar boost levels, all from Virtual Dyno (dynojet), etc.

So, just for comparisons sake:
http://www.pet3r.com/images/dyno-plots.jpg

whoznext - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums//sho...php?p=39001662
pet3r - this thread
juks - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2411484
ticktack - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2432563
juanmedina - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2429748
The cars with the 07+ tranny's (longer 4th gear) show much better spool. I just got a long gear 6 speed and my 4th gear pulls spool much sooner (rpm-wise) than the 3rd gear pulls in my 5 speed.

Here's an example:

http://www.benjohnsonphotography.com...znqZdBh-XL.jpg

It makes me sad to see how hard my turbo drops off up top compared to those bigger turbo's
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:52 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xluben View Post
The cars with the 07+ tranny's (longer 4th gear) show much better spool. I just got a long gear 6 speed and my 4th gear pulls spool much sooner (rpm-wise) than the 3rd gear pulls in my 5 speed.

Here's an example:

http://www.benjohnsonphotography.com...znqZdBh-XL.jpg

It makes me sad to see how hard my turbo drops off up top compared to those bigger turbo's
Shouldn't you be using 4th on your 5 speed for comparison to 4th on the 6 speed? Iirc, the 6 speed has two overdrive gears while the 5 speed only has one.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:21 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pet3r View Post
Got bored this afternoon and decided to merge some dyno plots together. This is more out of curiosity, since a few people PMd me asking how my GTX compared to other turbos. I'm really not a specialist here, but grabbed a few plots that were pretty similar in builds (built engines, all bolt-ons upgraded), and I tried to make sure they were all running E85 as well, similar boost levels, all from Virtual Dyno (dynojet), etc.

So, just for comparisons sake:


whoznext - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums//sho...php?p=39001662
pet3r - this thread
juks - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2411484
ticktack - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2432563
juanmedina - http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2429748
WOW Is funny how my boost drops vs yours. I need to do something about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xluben View Post
The cars with the 07+ tranny's (longer 4th gear) show much better spool. I just got a long gear 6 speed and my 4th gear pulls spool much sooner (rpm-wise) than the 3rd gear pulls in my 5 speed.

Here's an example:

http://www.benjohnsonphotography.com...znqZdBh-XL.jpg

It makes me sad to see how hard my turbo drops off up top compared to those bigger turbo's
Are you sure? look at my thread. My 07 5-speed WRX vs my 2011 6-speed 4th gear look almost identical as far as spool. You can see the boost plots on both charts
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:55 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
WOW Is funny how my boost drops vs yours. I need to do something about it.
not necessarily. boost does not equal airflow. You have cams and he doesnt.

And as we already discussed, it is 100% evident that there is a leak or an issue on your current setup. Your MAF volts with your green at 21psi at redline were 4.6 with the same intake.....and you're still at 4.6 volts now at 4-5 more psi and a 16lbm larger turbo. There has to be a huge leak after the maf and before the turbo to be keeping the maf volts down. that or the turbo is blown.

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Are you sure? look at my thread. My 07 5-speed WRX vs my 2011 6-speed 4th gear look almost identical as far as spool. You can see the boost plots on both charts
They should be very identical. If you look at the "engine to speed ratio" column in airboy and compare them....the 07wrx number falls right in between an 07+ 6speed 3rd and 4th gear.

So just based off that, the 6speed should spool slightly faster in 4th than the wrx in 3rd.

Last edited by Phatron; 01-27-2013 at 01:01 PM.
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Old 01-27-2013, 07:11 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
not necessarily. boost does not equal airflow. You have cams and he doesnt.

And as we already discussed, it is 100% evident that there is a leak or an issue on your current setup. Your MAF volts with your green at 21psi at redline were 4.6 with the same intake.....and you're still at 4.6 volts now at 4-5 more psi and a 16lbm larger turbo. There has to be a huge leak after the maf and before the turbo to be keeping the maf volts down. that or the turbo is blown.



They should be very identical. If you look at the "engine to speed ratio" column in airboy and compare them....the 07wrx number falls right in between an 07+ 6speed 3rd and 4th gear.

So just based off that, the 6speed should spool slightly faster in 4th than the wrx in 3rd.
What you mean by my turbo is blown? The seals?

I took the turbo off last week to fix my transmission leak. The turbo wheels looked perfect, there was no shaft play and there was no oil on the hot side. There was a little oil on the compressor side and some on the intake and in the intercooler but it wasn't much for me to be concern. Something that was weird is that I left the turbo sitting facing up on the hotside for a week or so while I was fixing the tranny leak. When I grabbed the turbo to install it noticed that some oil was on the exhaust wheel. I guess the oil sneaked down.

My car doesn't smoke at all and it doesn't burn oil.
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Old 01-27-2013, 07:14 PM   #116
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Updated it with xluben's plot, since his turbo has some very different spool characteristics, and didn't realize he added a 6pd! Why did you get it if you already had a built PPG 5spd?

Man thats a snappy torque turbo, but I guess you do lose the top end. I'd be shifting at like 5800 if I was running the 1/4.

I'm sure if these members sent me their logs I could make the plot prettier, and bigger...

Last edited by pet3r; 01-27-2013 at 07:20 PM.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:25 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post

What you mean by my turbo is blown? The seals?

I took the turbo off last week to fix my transmission leak. The turbo wheels looked perfect, there was no shaft play and there was no oil on the hot side. There was a little oil on the compressor side and some on the intake and in the intercooler but it wasn't much for me to be concern. Something that was weird is that I left the turbo sitting facing up on the hotside for a week or so while I was fixing the tranny leak. When I grabbed the turbo to install it noticed that some oil was on the exhaust wheel. I guess the oil sneaked down.

My car doesn't smoke at all and it doesn't burn oil.
Yeah Juan I'm thinking u have a cut in ur inlet. Basically right where it connects to the turbo it gets tight and my buddies was sliced on the left side and was having ur same findings. Not saying for sure but a boost leak test couldnt hurt
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:36 PM   #118
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^ thats basically what i've been telling him. if it is a leak causing this mis-reading it has to be between the maf and turbo. a leak post turbo will make the mafv read higher than usual and the car would be running rich as hell.

the problem is, that as soon as he fixes the problem the car will not be drivable....the boost will have to be turned down to less than 20psi to keep the MAFv below 5.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:38 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post

What you mean by my turbo is blown? The seals?

I took the turbo off last week to fix my transmission leak. The turbo wheels looked perfect, there was no shaft play and there was no oil on the hot side. There was a little oil on the compressor side and some on the intake and in the intercooler but it wasn't much for me to be concern. Something that was weird is that I left the turbo sitting facing up on the hotside for a week or so while I was fixing the tranny leak. When I grabbed the turbo to install it noticed that some oil was on the exhaust wheel. I guess the oil sneaked down.

My car doesn't smoke at all and it doesn't burn oil.
Juan, do you have an AOS installed or a catch can to clean the intake air tract of crank case ventilation oil? I'm sure you know this but if you have oil on your compressor wheel, in your inter cooler and your intake manifold then you may have CC venting issues which polite your intake air and lower your effective octane rating of your fuel! I'm using the Crawford AOS now and it's working very well for me!!
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:40 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
^ thats basically what i've been telling him. if it is a leak causing this mis-reading it has to be between the maf and turbo. a leak post turbo will make the mafv read higher than usual and the car would be running rich as hell.

the problem is, that as soon as he fixes the problem the car will not be drivable....the boost will have to be turned down to less than 20psi to keep the MAFv below 5.
It sounds like Juan should go to a speed density tune!
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:43 PM   #121
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No offense, but while I love diagnosing problems on a hot subaru, could we please move this discussion to another thread?

If there is a cut in the inlet, it could also not be apparent unless under boost, like how it can collapse with older non-steel ribbed inlets...maybe.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:53 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pet3r View Post
No offense, but while I love diagnosing problems on a hot subaru, could we please move this discussion to another thread?

If there is a cut in the inlet, it could also not be apparent unless under boost, like how it can collapse with older non-steel ribbed inlets...maybe.
Sorry man! Just trying to help out! Did not mean to divert from your thread!!

Your build is beastly good very nice job and results!
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:55 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by manitou View Post
Sorry man! Just trying to help out! Did not mean to divert from your thread!!

Your build is beastly good very nice job and results!
No worries, I think he might benefit more if it were in a new thread as well.

Thanks!
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:01 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by 05_wRex View Post
Shouldn't you be using 4th on your 5 speed for comparison to 4th on the 6 speed? Iirc, the 6 speed has two overdrive gears while the 5 speed only has one.
On the 2011 WRX 5 speed 3rd gear is closest to 1:1. The current gen 6 speed ratios don't have gear that matches exactly (3rd is shorter and 4th is longer). Here is a quick table:

Code:
Transmission	Gear	MPH@7k
2011 WRX 5MT	3	100
2011 WRX 5MT	4	133
2011 STI 6MT	3	85
2011 STI 6MT	4	113
Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Are you sure? look at my thread. My 07 5-speed WRX vs my 2011 6-speed 4th gear look almost identical as far as spool. You can see the boost plots on both charts
Your 07 WRX 5MT and your 2011 STI 6MT have longer 3rd (5MT) and 4th (6MT) than the 04-06 STI 4th that the other plots are using. Here's a quick table of the gears commonly used for logging. Spool will look best on the ones with a taller gear (high MPH@7k).

Code:
Transmission	Gear	MPH@7k
04-06 STI 6MT	4	96
08+ WRX 5MT	3	100
06-07 WRX 5MT	3	105
07+ STI 6MT	4	113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
They should be very identical. If you look at the "engine to speed ratio" column in airboy and compare them....the 07wrx number falls right in between an 07+ 6speed 3rd and 4th gear.

So just based off that, the 6speed should spool slightly faster in 4th than the wrx in 3rd.
Yep, his 5MT's 3rd gear is the quickest spooling (longest) of any common tuning gear other than the 07+ 6MT 4th gear. Just looking at the original plot that pet3r had put up I was comparing the 04-06 4th vs. the 07+ 4th. The 07+ 4th gear is a LOT longer than the short gears and will improve spool considerably.

Just as an FYI, here is how my spool compares with the different gears. I found that the 2011 5MT in 3rd and the 2011 6MT in 3rd spool very similarly. The 2011 6MT in 4th spools much earlier in the RPM range.

Code:
Trannsmission	Gear	RPM@20PSI	RPM@26PSI
2011 WRX 5MT	3	3500		3900
2011 STI 6MT	3	3500		4000
2011 STI 6MT	4	3100		3400
The 5MT spool was seen on many, many logs. The 6MT runs were done back to back at the exact same spot. Two runs in each gear. Spool was the same for back to back runs, so the earlier spool in 4th isn't a fluke, like I thought it could have been.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pet3r View Post
Updated it with xluben's plot, since his turbo has some very different spool characteristics, and didn't realize he added a 6pd! Why did you get it if you already had a built PPG 5spd?

Man thats a snappy torque turbo, but I guess you do lose the top end. I'd be shifting at like 5800 if I was running the 1/4.
I wanted to try the different gearing and the better diff's. Looking at that plot makes me really want top end. My spool is better, but the top end just falls off. My whole powerband is shifted a solid 1k to the left from these "real" turbos. Maybe someday I can get some top end...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slimsti View Post
Yeah Juan I'm thinking u have a cut in ur inlet. Basically right where it connects to the turbo it gets tight and my buddies was sliced on the left side and was having ur same findings. Not saying for sure but a boost leak test couldnt hurt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
^ thats basically what i've been telling him. if it is a leak causing this mis-reading it has to be between the maf and turbo. a leak post turbo will make the mafv read higher than usual and the car would be running rich as hell.

the problem is, that as soon as he fixes the problem the car will not be drivable....the boost will have to be turned down to less than 20psi to keep the MAFv below 5.
Yep, I saw you mention this before and it seems like it must be true. No way that turbo and that boost should have such low MAF readings. You should be maxing out the MAF at way lower boost. Time to fix a leak and go speed density!
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:02 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post

What you mean by my turbo is blown? The seals?

I took the turbo off last week to fix my transmission leak. The turbo wheels looked perfect, there was no shaft play and there was no oil on the hot side. There was a little oil on the compressor side and some on the intake and in the intercooler but it wasn't much for me to be concern. Something that was weird is that I left the turbo sitting facing up on the hotside for a week or so while I was fixing the tranny leak. When I grabbed the turbo to install it noticed that some oil was on the exhaust wheel. I guess the oil sneaked down.

My car doesn't smoke at all and it doesn't burn oil.
That's usually normal.
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