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Old 04-28-2014, 11:21 AM   #126
arghx7
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Will the 4C kill Lotus?
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Old 04-28-2014, 04:57 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by arghx7 View Post
Will the 4C kill Lotus?
Having no North American followup to the Elise will kill lotus. The Evora can't carry them here and the Elise isn't being sold here anymore.

The 4C doesn't compete with the Evora.. so no, I don't think it will kill them.
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Old 06-11-2014, 07:15 PM   #128
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http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1...-4c-from-55195

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For too long, Alfa Romeo's U.S. return seemed like a dream. Now, that dream is becoming reality, because not only does the storied Italian brand have a new car to sell, it has a place to sell it.

Alfa announced the establishment of a dealer network in the U.S. and Canada, comprising 86 stores drawn from existing Fiat and Maserati franchisees. In the U.S., there will be 82 Alfa dealers in 33 states, with California, Texas, and Florida having the largest concentration. Canada will have to make do with just four dealerships. The Italian carmaker will award additional franchises later this year.

Of course, the only product those dealers will have to sell for the time being is the 2015 Alfa Romeo 4C sports car, which arrives in North America later this year. Deliveries will initially be limited to 500 Launch Edition models, which will start at $69,695, while the regular 4C will start at $55,195 (both prices include destination), Autoblog reports.

That comes pretty close to the approximately $54,000 base price previously suggested. Preliminary reports also suggested that the 4C would gain weight on the way to the U.S. and, sure enough, North American models will reportedly weigh 342 pounds more than their European counterparts. Total curb weight squeaks under 2,500 pounds at 2,495.

The increase is attributed to extra safety equipment and a thicker carbon fiber tub. The lighter European model actually skirts certain safety regulations with a sales cap of 1,000 units per year.

Extra weight doesn't appear to blunt the U.S.-spec 4C's performance, though. Alfa estimates it will do 0 to 60 mph in the mid-4 second range, reach a top speed of 160 mph, pull 1.1 g in corners, and 1.25 g under full braking. Stay tuned, as we've driven the car and will be bringing you our first drive report soon
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Old 06-13-2014, 10:54 AM   #129
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Old 06-13-2014, 11:30 AM   #130
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It's sad to see they added this much weight.
But they have the ability to give the car an increase in power.
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Old 06-17-2014, 06:24 PM   #131
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damn motor authority

Last edited by torquemada; 06-18-2014 at 03:05 PM.
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Old 06-18-2014, 03:06 PM   #132
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Old 06-18-2014, 05:22 PM   #133
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Kick off US revival my ass with an expensive 1.7L turbo L4.
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Old 06-22-2014, 08:56 AM   #134
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Maybe the base model will be lighter.
Last time around, with the 164, they did not change the specs for US, once they went ahead with it, between 1991-1993. In '94 the 24 valve V6 came and even then, the 94 and 95 did not differ.
As far as turbo cars, the Alfa 75 (AKA Milano in US), did not change spec in EU, once it started. There was a heavily spoilered version, possibly called evoluzione, which may have been based on the turbo, but I think it was based on the QV (AKA Verde in US).

So the odds are not great that Alfa will turn up the power next year, to compensate for the extra weight in US.

So below are my imaginary news and rumors for the 4C (for lack of any good news...)

In an ideal world, next year, we discover (in US), that the curb weight including the extra 342 lb, was for the launch edition and that the regular and cheaper edition weighs 200 lb extra.
Then, Alfa (per the statements made that they will improve this every year), turns up the boost (while having the car tuned to run on 91 octane fuel ) and brings the power close to 300 HP.

Then, the used car market welcomes all 4c's with huge value drops (as usual for Alfa, except for the collectible ones) and finally, 5 years from now, one can buy a 300 HP 4C, used, depending on condition, for $ 25 000 (just like the $60 000 1991 Alfa 164 was worth $10 000 in '97).
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Old 06-22-2014, 11:11 AM   #135
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The main point is that reviews say the US spec 4C is fun to drive. Bench racing regarding power and curb weight as in the above post is pointless, especially seeing that this would get waxed by a Corvette, afaik. Having such a mini-Ferrari would be about emotion, not 1/4 mile dick swinging.
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Old 06-22-2014, 12:00 PM   #136
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first: this video is german
second: itīs boring if you donīt understand german
third: itīs boring even if you understand the german language
fourth: Lotus wins

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Old 06-22-2014, 12:04 PM   #137
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Old 06-22-2014, 12:32 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shikataganai View Post
The main point is that reviews say the US spec 4C is fun to drive. Bench racing regarding power and curb weight as in the above post is pointless, especially seeing that this would get waxed by a Corvette, afaik. Having such a mini-Ferrari would be about emotion, not 1/4 mile dick swinging.
I don't see a lot of reviewers becoming enamored over the driving experience to suggest that it's anything like a Ferrari. The carbon tub accounts for the higher price, but the soft suspension, goofy handling (compared to its contemporaries) and mandatory DCT are turn-offs for someone looking to spend money on such a tiny car. I don't really understand who they're trying to target here. It's built like an exotic but trimmed out like a really crappy grand tourer.
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Old 06-22-2014, 01:25 PM   #139
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It's priced like an exotic but trimmed out like a really crappy grand tourer.
fixed
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Old 06-23-2014, 10:19 AM   #140
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I'm buying this car for only one reason.

Dat ass.
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Old 06-24-2014, 08:54 AM   #141
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First Test: 2015 Alfa Romeo 4C

Alfa's Atonement for Past Sins Puts us in a Very Forgiving Mood



http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...4c_first_test/
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Old 06-24-2014, 09:53 AM   #142
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Good article.
I was hoping the base model was lighter, but it seems it does well as it is.
In 5 years, I may join the Alfisti again..
OH BTW, worrying about your Alfa performing how an Alfa should perform is something that:
a. Has nothing to do with a Corvette
b. Has nothing to do with (a) Ferrari (who started by working for Alfa anyway, before he branched out)
c. Doesn't need to have anything to do with a 1/4 mile track, (my 164 never saw one, nor the car of any club guys I talked to, although many brought the cars to a circuit track)
e. Has everything to do with cancelling the effect of neutering regulations that the factory is forced to abide by, when making the cars available here.

This is best described by:
I was waiting for my water pump to be done on my 164, at the Alfa Clinic in Long Island, as couple guys were working on a GTV6, with a 3.0 liter conversion, with a Webbers conversion.
Bring it back to the most enjoyable form, ditch the fuel injection, put in it the engine that should have been in there from the get go (Alfa only had the 3.0 in the GTV6 for the South African market, never understood why)..
They may have gained 60 HP with all that work, but man did it sound glorious when they were done..

All Alfisti know that Alfas are (deeply) flawed, but they love the flaws as well, it's part of the personality of the car.
I could write pages, but will stop here. Clarkson is right, it's a disease, but a wonderful one.
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Old 06-24-2014, 10:13 AM   #143
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I agree, Vlad.. some cars are wrong in all the right ways.
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Old 06-24-2014, 10:14 AM   #144
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Sounds like a hella-lot of justification to like an expensive, unreliable car.
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Old 06-24-2014, 10:15 AM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad View Post
c. Doesn't need to have anything to do with a 1/4 mile track, (my 164 never saw one, nor the car of any club guys I talked to, although many brought the cars to a circuit track)
About the only thing a 164 has in common with this is the badge. How would taking a slow, large sedan to a drag strip have any bearing on this car? 1/4 mile times are a useful benchmark; I wouldn't drag this vehicle but I'd know a lot about the performance if it were a 12 second car.
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Old 06-24-2014, 10:21 AM   #146
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Vaguely related, here's a wheel off a GTV6 from an HPDE at Lime Rock from 1998. That Italian build quality left the rest of the vehicle on the downhill, putting the car on its roof.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg AUT_0035.JPG (64.0 KB, 12 views)
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Old 06-24-2014, 10:37 AM   #147
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meh, everybody knows wheels are a wearable item

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Old 06-24-2014, 10:37 AM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses View Post
Sounds like a hella-lot of justification to like an expensive, unreliable car.
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Old 06-24-2014, 10:58 AM   #149
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Vaguely related, here's a wheel off a GTV6 from an HPDE at Lime Rock from 1998. That Italian build quality left the rest of the vehicle on the downhill, putting the car on its roof.
Not something that I'm going to debate.

Neither am I debating the general usefulness to bring a given vehicle to the 1/4 mile track, you're probably right.
Neither am I going to bring up the poor performance of the 164 at the 1/4 mile track, you're most likely right.

But you know what? At the circuit track, the good old GTV6 (granted, with mods), was keeping up with the much newer E36 M3.
At the circuit track, it DID make sense to take the big heavy old 164, especially in an S or QV and in the '90's it was not as far behind an E36 M3 as you'd expect.
The fine print here is that Alfa never sent to the US the Alfa 155QV, which COULD keep up with the E36 AND beat it at the track, based as it was, on the Lancia Delta Integrale drivetrain.
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Old 06-24-2014, 11:08 AM   #150
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Believe me when I write that the badge that the two have in common, stands for a lot of good and bad that they will turn out to have in common, on a general level.
Mechanically, you're right, nothing in common.

Other than this, yes, lots of flaws with Alfa:
Wrong design of the seating position (as for a person with long arms and short legs, as all know in the Alfa community)
Wrong position of the pedals, offset sometims

Very difficult to shift transmissions, for the transaxle cars (GTV6, Alfa 75/Milano, Alfetta).
Maybe not so easy to understand, but it's a badge of honor and a right of passage to be able to put one of the above cars through its paces by properly shifting those gearboxes.

In sum, there's very little I can say that makes logical sense, to defend these cars, I know they are laughable to your common guy.
But I love them, that's just me.
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