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Old 04-13-2001, 01:43 PM   #1
remarcable
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My last car 87 sable did not have ABS and while it stopped alot quicker and was more fun to slide around dirt roads.... I am glad to have ABS on my subie for daily driving.

The ability to steer around deer, pedestrians, and moron drivers while braking is a good thing IMHO.

I wouldn't mind disabling the system for dirt roads though
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Old 04-13-2001, 02:13 PM   #2
stimpy
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If I need my ABS off, I will pull the fuse. This will only occur when doing spirited driving (autox) or on dirt/snow. Otherwise it is enabled because it allows the car to continue to steer. Yes, it can allow you to stop better, but the point of ABS is to allow steering input. Better drivers? Maybe, but when you are in a panic situation, you usually aren't thinking about 'on-the-edge-of-locking-up braking'. You just start praying to God, munching the brakes, and steering around whatever just tried to jump under your car.

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Old 04-13-2001, 04:56 PM   #3
Joe Lee
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Why wouldn't you use the ABS during an AutoX? Seems to me that the CPU will stop you better under VERY hard braking than you could without it...
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Old 04-13-2001, 05:57 PM   #4
Overtime
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I thought that it's been proven that ABS helps you stop faster regardless of your brake-pumping power, no?
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Old 04-13-2001, 06:05 PM   #5
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No it doesnt, it just enables you to steer out of the way of danger, to keep control of the car...

you dont want ABS on autoX or roadracing, because you dont want anything to unbalance the car while doing it. thats why M owners turn off DSC, and NSX owners turn off traction control..

when racing, you want the closest man to machine relationship you can get, the less computerized things you can have between your imputs and its responses the better...

For the average driver, on the street, ABS can and will be helpful. Me personally i dont need/want it, since my previous car didnt have ABS, and i never had use for it, even in hairy emergency situations, but most people find it helpful...
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Old 04-13-2001, 06:59 PM   #6
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when you are on ice........ABS is not your friend!!!!!!!! i wounder how long you actually stop on ice with and without ABS?????

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Old 04-13-2001, 07:46 PM   #7
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wheres this fuse located at? i wanna pull it then play hardball!
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Old 04-13-2001, 07:51 PM   #8
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You will be able to stop better with ABS under most situations. As a vehicle dynamics engineer, I have done evaluations of vehicles in many conditions. As stated above, with the exception of ice, and some loose surfaces, ABS will stop you better. This is particularly the case in dry or wet pavement. We have done test showing stops from 60 mph are some 10 feet or more better with ABS, even with the most experienced of test drivers, none of which I believe frequent this board. Anyone stating they can outbrake ABS in autocross is lying.


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Old 04-13-2001, 07:57 PM   #9
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MArk, I am with you 100%. There is no way one can brake better without ABS. Even in USTCC cars with ABS will have to carry weight penalty. Why? Becuase they will outbrake cars without it.
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Old 04-13-2001, 09:05 PM   #10
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but will pulling the abs fuse hurt the car in any way??
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Old 04-13-2001, 09:54 PM   #11
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Thank god Mark showed up with credentials to end the debate-- I've said what he said and been debated to death about it. Always nice to hear from a professional, of course.

The other nice thing about autocross or open track with ABS is that you can't flat spot your tires.
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Old 04-13-2001, 10:42 PM   #12
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He said funner......
The worst thing about ABS is when you are on the brakes and hit a bump, and the brakes let loose, not engaging for 2 secs.
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Old 04-14-2001, 12:20 AM   #13
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Post I cut my ABS accidently and happy I did.

While replacing my ball joint on thefront left tire I accidently cut the ABS line and now my ABS don't work and the ABS light is on. I should be pissed but I'm not, the car is so much better without ABS(funner to drive). Then again if your a good driver there is no need forABS. Imagine a rally car with ABS, I dont' think so.
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Old 04-14-2001, 12:45 AM   #14
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You could have just pulled the fuse.
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Old 04-14-2001, 12:46 AM   #15
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Did the same thing to my Legacy.. It runs much better.. The only thing I hate is the stupid little light.. but oh well, I don't usually look at my dash while driving..
edit: I just pulled the fuse hehehe

[This message has been edited by ejicon (edited April 13, 2001).]
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Old 04-14-2001, 12:48 AM   #16
Frank
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Again it has nothing to do with the driver, it's the other drivers and the squirrels and the raccoons etc.. Disabling the ABS is def. something i would do but it's there to keep your car "unfun" when on public roads.
Maybe just pull the fuse for AutoX or whatever.
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Old 04-14-2001, 06:36 AM   #17
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Motorcity, no it doesn't let loose, it just feels that way. The brakes are still braking. ABS will pump your brakes at up to 30 times a second.
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Old 04-14-2001, 11:17 AM   #18
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I agree with Mark... ABS and TRACTION control are a huge part of racing and will continue to be!If traction control didnt have an advantage it wouldn't have been banned from F1. German touring car racing all the cars have abs..it makes you faster because you can pretty much just stomp on the brakes at each turn and concentrate on where you want the car to go.I can shut off the ABS in my Quattro with a dash switch but at on track events I would be a fool to do so ...especially in wet track conditions. But in some instances, packed snow and loose gravel roads... there can sometimes be an advantage in no ABS but it is rare.Leave the ABS on and learn how to use it properly ...you will be a much better driver!
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Old 04-14-2001, 02:47 PM   #19
Joe Lee
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ProgWRX - Traction control systems (whatever the acronym) USE ABS but are NOT ABS. I agree that a car that arbitrarily reduces power or brakes a particular wheel (not all wheels evenly) when a computer decides you are doing something silly is a bad thing, esp. in an AutoX/Track situation. HOWEVER, ABS use in AutoX could be the difference between a hot lap and an off-course.

I went to a novice autox school in Englishtown (NJ) and was told by several national champions that you SHOULD use your ABS.

All above statements are OPINION, feel free to disagree.
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