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Old 09-20-2002, 02:37 PM   #1
chuglobal
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Default TurboXs UTEC

Has anyone actually ran the new TurboXs UTEC. What was your whp increase and what mods did you have? Are you guys/gals sharing the base maps? How much tunning time did you put in? How much gain in whp did you get from tunning vs. no tunning? Any problems yet? So is anyone gonna keep a database of base maps where we can download the info? I'm seriously looking into getting a UTEC so I would like to see what the average REX driver is getting. Someone local needs to get the UTEC so I can check it out. Thanks.
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Old 09-20-2002, 02:50 PM   #2
SubyRex
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So many questions, so much lack of information.

Ya people, give us options or else I'm going Unichip
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Old 09-20-2002, 02:56 PM   #3
luckyguyvw
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the problem is not alot of people have it yet. Give it a couple of months and there will be wealths of informantion. Granted its not for everyone, if you want something you won't ever have to play with the unichip is the way to go. If you want the ultimate tuning power then the only choice is the Utech.
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Old 09-20-2002, 03:20 PM   #4
Ryan23
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It is the best thing since sliced bread, how 'bout that? I have been running the UTEC for just over a month and am very pleased with it. My Dyno Charts are under the "Proven Power Bragging" forum, try a search as I don't have the thread bookmarked. Back to the UTEC, driveability is outstanding you don't even notice it's there. No part throttle hesitation or any issues to speak of. I'm not sure what software version will make it to the public, so I really don't want to comment too much on the interface as I may be putting out bad gouge. One of the biggest benefits for me is that I can go to the track, rotate a knob, fill up with C116 Race gas and GO. My race gas map allows me to run much more ignition advance and allows me to lean it out some. No hit and miss, "How's the ECU going to take to Race gas today?!". Timing is fixed although my ECU still has the ability to pull timing if it hears knock. The big difference is that it only pulls timing DURING a knock event, not for the rest of the day.
After my dyno tune appointment I really haven't seen a need to change my tune too much. I know a bunch of people want a solution that they don't have to mess with. This is it. There is no need to tweak it every other day. For those who enjoy tweaking all the time (maybe even when it's not necessary ) the option for you to do that is there. It's got 4 user selectable/tuneable maps. You can copy your "base" map to another slot and tweak away. If you screw it up or get a little nervous, flip back to your reliable base map. It's great. The upgrade path is another benefit. Do you want a feature that isn't supported? Just ask. Right now they are making sure all the basic functions work (consistently) along with a couple expanded features. When everything is stabilized I think there will definately be an avenue for extra "feature sets". The hardware on the board can most definately support it. Let me know if you have any specific questions and I will TRY to get you some answers as long as it doesn't take an engineer to figure it out As someone pointed out in another thread, I am a User not an engineer.

Ryan
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Old 09-20-2002, 03:24 PM   #5
crazyhorse
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chuglobal: I'm currently working on a site along with another i-clubber for users to share maps and discuss the utec.. I'd show you while you're up at the dragon but i had to cancel my trip because I've got a job interview in California I've got to be at Saturday. Thankfully.. they're paying my way..

Ryan: If you wouldn't mind.. could you pm me so I can get a list of the mods you have.. hopefully you wouldn't mind contributing the first maps to the new site we're working on. It's almost ready to go but I don't want to announce it till it's finished.. eta early next week.
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Old 09-20-2002, 03:38 PM   #6
cobra117
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I might buy one just to get some use out of this friggin laptop. But aside from that...

How easy is it to tune, for those of us who have no tuning experience? How easy would it be to blow up the car on accident?

I mean, i figure just playing it safe, with the WRXs low compression, with a knocklink and some guages (Fuel pressure, EGT, boost) I could fare ok.

I'd like to think.
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Old 09-20-2002, 03:53 PM   #7
SGOSWRX
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ryan23
It is the best thing since sliced bread, how 'bout that? I have been running the UTEC for just over a month and am very pleased with it. My Dyno Charts are under the "Proven Power Bragging" forum, try a search as I don't have the thread bookmarked. Back to the UTEC, driveability is outstanding you don't even notice it's there. No part throttle hesitation or any issues to speak of. I'm not sure what software version will make it to the public, so I really don't want to comment too much on the interface as I may be putting out bad gouge. One of the biggest benefits for me is that I can go to the track, rotate a knob, fill up with C116 Race gas and GO. My race gas map allows me to run much more ignition advance and allows me to lean it out some. No hit and miss, "How's the ECU going to take to Race gas today?!". Timing is fixed although my ECU still has the ability to pull timing if it hears knock. The big difference is that it only pulls timing DURING a knock event, not for the rest of the day.
After my dyno tune appointment I really haven't seen a need to change my tune too much. I know a bunch of people want a solution that they don't have to mess with. This is it. There is no need to tweak it every other day. For those who enjoy tweaking all the time (maybe even when it's not necessary ) the option for you to do that is there. It's got 4 user selectable/tuneable maps. You can copy your "base" map to another slot and tweak away. If you screw it up or get a little nervous, flip back to your reliable base map. It's great. The upgrade path is another benefit. Do you want a feature that isn't supported? Just ask. Right now they are making sure all the basic functions work (consistently) along with a couple expanded features. When everything is stabilized I think there will definately be an avenue for extra "feature sets". The hardware on the board can most definately support it. Let me know if you have any specific questions and I will TRY to get you some answers as long as it doesn't take an engineer to figure it out As someone pointed out in another thread, I am a User not an engineer.

Ryan
Your sig says you ran 12.2 @112mph which is very impressive. What are your mods?
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Old 09-20-2002, 04:09 PM   #8
SubyDoobyDoo
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Sorry for busting in, but does the UTEC control boost better than lets say the Greddy Profec B? I know its been said its way better than the Unichip, but I was wondering if anyone can go into specifics. Like would the UTEC hold max boost till redline? My Unichip does like 15lb in 1st and 2nd gear and doesn't reach full boost (18lb.) till 3rd gear.
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Old 09-20-2002, 05:16 PM   #9
RiftsWRX
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Quote:
Originally posted by SubyDoobyDoo
Sorry for busting in, but does the UTEC control boost better than lets say the Greddy Profec B? I know its been said its way better than the Unichip, but I was wondering if anyone can go into specifics. Like would the UTEC hold max boost till redline? My Unichip does like 15lb in 1st and 2nd gear and doesn't reach full boost (18lb.) till 3rd gear.
Is it better.. yes.. for the amount of resolution it gives..

But... your ability to hold such and such boost is completely dependent on (A what your asking of (B your turbo.

Jorge (RiftsWRX)
www.ProjectWRX.com
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Old 09-20-2002, 05:41 PM   #10
wackie
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Shameless plug into a thread looking for custom maps (I'm the one working with crazyhorse).

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=247777

We're building a site to help people share their maps, tuning experiences, etc.

JD
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Old 09-21-2002, 02:00 AM   #11
Ryan23
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Quote:
Originally posted by SGOSWRX


Your sig says you ran 12.2 @112mph which is very impressive. What are your mods?
Just beat that time tonight I've been grinning for the last hour and a half . Here's my mods:

VF34
MRT FMIC
TurboXS Turboback
TurboXS UTEC (Dyno tuned)
TurboXS HPMBC
STI Injectors
MRT Unifilter
NOS Nitrous wet kit, 50 Shot
One step colder NGK plugs
Vishnu Pulley
Vishnu Uppipe
Gauges, A/F, EGT, Boost, Oil Pressure and Delta Dash

I think that's pretty much it on the engine side. I may be forgetting a couple things (it's late). It's a great setup though and very liveable on the street. I have no complaints thus far.


Ryan
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Old 09-21-2002, 09:28 AM   #12
dman918
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So the 12.06 is on the spray? What do you run without it?
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Old 09-21-2002, 02:50 PM   #13
lgstucki
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ryan23


Just beat that time tonight I've been grinning for the last hour and a half . Here's my mods:

VF34
MRT FMIC
TurboXS Turboback
TurboXS UTEC (Dyno tuned)
TurboXS HPMBC
STI Injectors
MRT Unifilter
NOS Nitrous wet kit, 50 Shot
One step colder NGK plugs
Vishnu Pulley
Vishnu Uppipe
Gauges, A/F, EGT, Boost, Oil Pressure and Delta Dash

I think that's pretty much it on the engine side. I may be forgetting a couple things (it's late). It's a great setup though and very liveable on the street. I have no complaints thus far.


Ryan
I thought that the UTEC controlled boost. So wouldn't that make your MBC pointless?? Correct me if I'm wrong That would be a lovely set up. If only I had the $$$.
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Old 09-21-2002, 03:41 PM   #14
DSMcG
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Default road work vs. drag results

Ryan23,
Can you give us a little insight to how the Utec handles things like partial throttle senarios: ie. Auto X, track days, Mountain twisties? This is my #1 concern. So far we've heard from the Drag contingent (WOT)- how about anyone that has thrown the test through a series of corners? Low traction / high speed throttle sensitivity?

Thanks in advance - DSMcG
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Old 09-23-2002, 11:56 PM   #15
D_REX
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Quote:
Originally posted by lgstucki


I thought that the UTEC controlled boost. So wouldn't that make your MBC pointless?? Correct me if I'm wrong That would be a lovely set up. If only I had the $$$.
This is something I'd really like to know. The closed loop boost control of the utec is one of it's biggest selling features to me. If it's not adequate enough for you please let us know why.

Thanks,
Dustin
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Old 09-24-2002, 09:35 AM   #16
nmyeti
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Quote:
Originally posted by D_REX


This is something I'd really like to know. The closed loop boost control of the utec is one of it's biggest selling features to me. If it's not adequate enough for you please let us know why.

Thanks,
Dustin
Dustin,
We've played around with the closed loop control, and although it works better than most things on the market, we have decided to play around with the software for a bit longer. The initial closed loop software was nice but when we started testing it on a lot of other cars it was having a hard time with boost spikes when you would downshift and nail the gas. This is unacceptable, and rather than release the software that was either too slow to be of use or that had problems with spikes we pulled the closed loop control out of the initial version of the software. By the time most of you get your Utec delivered off the back-order list, we should have the updated software in place. The first batch however will have an open loop duty cycle version that we are using as a backup.

This is a situation that we are unhappy with, and are working around the clock to fix it ASAP.

In reference to why Ryan is using the HPMBC for boost control… He is using that setup because I sent it to him when we took the closed loop code out of the UTEC.

I’ve ditched much more expensive boost controllers for the HPMBC (SBC-iD, AVC-R, profec-B) and want to make sure that our closed loop setup is indeed better than what is in my mind the “standard”.



-Nathan
www.turboxs.com
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Old 09-24-2002, 09:55 AM   #17
D_REX
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Quote:
Originally posted by nmyeti


Dustin,
We've played around with the closed loop control, and although it works better than most things on the market, we have decided to play around with the software for a bit longer. The initial closed loop software was nice but when we started testing it on a lot of other cars it was having a hard time with boost spikes when you would downshift and nail the gas. This is unacceptable, and rather than release the software that was either too slow to be of use or that had problems with spikes we pulled the closed loop control out of the initial version of the software. By the time most of you get your Utec delivered off the back-order list, we should have the updated software in place. The first batch however will have an open loop duty cycle version that we are using as a backup.

This is a situation that we are unhappy with, and are working around the clock to fix it ASAP.

In reference to why Ryan is using the HPMBC for boost control… He is using that setup because I sent it to him when we took the closed loop code out of the UTEC.

I’ve ditched much more expensive boost controllers for the HPMBC (SBC-iD, AVC-R, profec-B) and want to make sure that our closed loop setup is indeed better than what is in my mind the “standard”.



-Nathan
www.turboxs.com
After wading through most of what is available on the UTEC here I was under the impression that your closed loop boost controller allowed the PID parameters to be modified by the end user. Different exhausts will require different control loops, right?

As it stands now is the open loop boost map 2 dimensional using TPS and RPM for indexes?

Forgive me if I'm skeptical but I've bought many a product that promised more features at a later date, most have failed to deliver on their promises. I DONT want to spend another grand only to find out that what I've bought doesn't do the things I bought it to do.

Thanks,
Dustin
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:08 AM   #18
nmyeti
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Quote:
Originally posted by D_REX


After wading through most of what is available on the UTEC here I was under the impression that your closed loop boost controller allowed the PID parameters to be modified by the end user. Different exhausts will require different control loops, right?

As it stands now is the open loop boost map 2 dimensional using TPS and RPM for indexes?

Forgive me if I'm skeptical but I've bought many a product that promised more features at a later date, most have failed to deliver on their promises. I DONT want to spend another grand only to find out that what I've bought doesn't do the things I bought it to do.

Thanks,
Dustin
Dustin,
The closed loop program that we were working with allowed the user to adjust the parameters of; gain up, gain down, dead zone time and a few other little things. What we found was that with all of those settings they varied quite a bit from car to car, and needed a lot of work to get them right.

My only advice here is that if you are uncomfortable with a utec that has open loop control, then don't buy one. If you have an order already in the system please feel free to call and cancel it.

The utec WILL have closed loop control. We have already had it working, but we are unhappy releasing an unstable system that requires lots of tuning time from the average customer.

-Nathan
www.turboxs.com
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:17 AM   #19
D_REX
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Quote:
Originally posted by D_REX

As it stands now is the open loop boost map 2 dimensional using TPS and RPM for indexes?
Thanks,
Dustin
This would at least be better than what I am using now.
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:20 AM   #20
D_REX
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Quote:
Originally posted by nmyeti


Dustin,
The closed loop program that we were working with allowed the user to adjust the parameters of; gain up, gain down, dead zone time and a few other little things. What we found was that with all of those settings they varied quite a bit from car to car, and needed a lot of work to get them right.

-Nathan
www.turboxs.com
Are you guys using a full PID loop? Sounds like you gave access to the proportional gain parameter but not the others?

What is dead zone time?

I'm new to electronic boost control but not new to control systems, please bear with me.

Thanks,
Dustin
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:27 AM   #21
nmyeti
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Quote:
Originally posted by D_REX



As it stands now is the open loop boost map 2 dimensional using TPS and RPM for indexes?

Thanks,
Dustin
Dustin,
I missed this one... Yes it uses TPS and RPM. I've got to run as i have a dyno tune that just showed up. I'll get back to this thread soon though.

-Nathan
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:40 AM   #22
thejean
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Quote:
Originally posted by nmyeti


Dustin,
The closed loop program that we were working with allowed the user to adjust the parameters of; gain up, gain down, dead zone time and a few other little things. What we found was that with all of those settings they varied quite a bit from car to car, and needed a lot of work to get them right.

My only advice here is that if you are uncomfortable with a utec that has open loop control, then don't buy one. If you have an order already in the system please feel free to call and cancel it.

The utec WILL have closed loop control. We have already had it working, but we are unhappy releasing an unstable system that requires lots of tuning time from the average customer.

-Nathan
www.turboxs.com
Thanks for being up front about this. Please let us know how you make out with this minor issue.

JC
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:49 AM   #23
RiftsWRX
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FWIW guys, as stated, the boost control system works, and works good, but to be as feature rich as it is there is a lot of tweaking that your average consumer needed to handle. Personally.. I'm still using closed loop boost control on my software revision of the UTEC...

IT WORKS GREAT ON AN AUTOMATIC hehehe.. But don't fret... The beauty of UTEC is that it's a completely open ended modular platform. Meaning that a "feature" is just one software update away. My original TPS based board works like a tank, and it doesn't have knock correction, ECT/IAT fuel enrichment and timing control, or half the logging features, and I still made the times I did, with the power I did.

Don't sweat it guys... For those who think that they should wait in order to let the bugs work their way out... that's what people like Myself, Ryan, Nathan, Phil, and others have been doing for the last 3 months....

Ya'll won't get something (new feature or not) until it's cleared our desks.

Jorge (RiftsWRX)
www.ProjectWRX.com
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Old 09-24-2002, 10:58 AM   #24
D_REX
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I posted this in another thread, but this one seems to be getting more attention.

Quote:
Any chance portions of the UTEC code will be made open source? There are times when you don't want to wait until someone else thinks what you need is important enough to do. Many of us are more than capable of embedded programming. I know that no one wants to make their core IP available to the public, and I'm not sure how much of your code you consider unique enough to protect, but you can easily distribute those modules as precompiled hex files.

What language is the UTEC software written in? Are you using an off the shelf OS? Multithreaded?

Maybe instead of an open source model, you could let a few of your customers modify the source code, after signing an NDA, at no charge as long as the modifications are returned to TurboXS.

Just something I'd like to have access to.

Thanks,
Dustin
Jorge,
I'm not worried that features can't be implemented, just that I don't set the priorities, so something I want might be deemed low priority or completely unneccessary by others.

Plus it's be REALLY cool to be able to massage the logging portion of the code on a whim.


Thanks,
Dustin
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Old 09-24-2002, 04:56 PM   #25
D_REX
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^BUMP^

If you don't want to discuss this online PM or send me an email.

Thanks,
Dustin
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