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Old 03-10-2013, 11:52 PM   #1
medfordhotrodguy
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Default Ver 1-2 STI into Legacy turbo, plug & play???

I just picked up a 93 leggy turbo wagon for $500 with a blown 4eat in it. I have a 92 leggy 5 speed wagon gathering dust to swap drivetrain from, but want more go! I've heard over the years that the STI EJ20G is plug & play into the EJ22T harness and ecu. Is it true? Only FACTS please. No IMHO crap. There's to much incorrect info in some of these threads.
Thanks in advance.
Jeff
Also might get the 5 speed STI tranny also, 4.11 I believe, is the leggy 4.11?
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Old 03-10-2013, 11:55 PM   #2
69subaru360
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It's not pug and play.

I own an EJ20G and have worked on legacy turbos many times.

Harness is different.
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Old 03-11-2013, 02:50 AM   #3
rob
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It isn't as difficult as you may think. I posted a description of what is needed to adapt an EJ20G ecu to the ej22t. There are exactly four ecu pins to change, the ignition signals out of the ECU needs to be converted to drive the wastespark setup (either by a little converter box that I make or by adding extra igniters), and you need to use the matching MAF/Injectors. There are quite a few ej22t guys running my ej20G chipped ECUs.

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=43959

-Rob
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:23 AM   #4
medfordhotrodguy
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Well hello to the legendary "Robtune" god. I was thinking of running the ej20g in the legacy, not just the ecu. I found a MY96 ej20g STI engine, trans, and ecu for a $1000 shipped. That's why my interest was peaked. I have heard stories of these dropping in very easy into these leggy turbos. I also like the double in whp by doing it. I would then get your 440 tune. This would be just a project to sell to the high schoolers around here. Couple of them might even help with the swap.
The problem is I can't get any concrete info on the swap. Just seems everybody is making it up as they go along.
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:35 AM   #5
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Oh, I misunderstood the question. You are asking about the motor dropping in, not the ecu. 69subaru360 is right, there are harness differences. I am not sure the legacy front harness will plug into the ej20g engine harness. I know the ignition wiring is different. I have never done such a swap, so I can't comment on just how much of a pain it would be. Sorry for the confusion.

-Rob
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Old 03-14-2013, 01:02 AM   #6
robertlxxii
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Kimo did an EJ20G swap on his 91' Legacy, take a look at his lengthy build thread.

http://bbs.legacycentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=40398

edit: Didn't realize you wanted to use the 22T ECU on the 20G, in that case. No, you cannot drop the 20G into the 22T harness and ECU. Doesn't line up.

Last edited by robertlxxii; 03-14-2013 at 01:46 AM.
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Old 03-14-2013, 01:01 PM   #7
Matt Monson
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Good thing I wandered by today since there's a bit of misinformed garbage being posted to this thread. Read this and feel free to PM me if you are left with any questions:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1278122

For the record the plugs and pinouts on a '93 EJ22T engine harness and the ECU are IDENTICAL to an Ej20G harness with the one exception that the EJ20G has extra wires for the COP versus the wasted spark originally used on the Ej22T. I used my Ej22T harness and wasted spark coil pack on my conversion, but have also done it the other way on other cars. Takes the addition of 8 wires IIRC for the ingitor and COP stuff.
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Old 03-14-2013, 01:16 PM   #8
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but honestly, you should opt for the G ecu because of the rom editing capacity- whether or not you do it yourself.
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:18 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Good thing I wandered by today since there's a bit of misinformed garbage being posted to this thread. Read this and feel free to PM me if you are left with any questions:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1278122

For the record the plugs and pinouts on a '93 EJ22T engine harness and the ECU are IDENTICAL to an Ej20G harness with the one exception that the EJ20G has extra wires for the COP versus the wasted spark originally used on the Ej22T. I used my Ej22T harness and wasted spark coil pack on my conversion, but have also done it the other way on other cars. Takes the addition of 8 wires IIRC for the ingitor and COP stuff.
Oh boy Matt, did you really say that? Garbage? For shame!

It is time that you sit back and learn something new. There are exactly 7 differences in the ECU harness beyond COP. This is taken from my post on legacy central that I linked above. Comments are made from the perspective of adding the EJ20G ECU to the stock EJ22T harness.

ECU RELATED CHANGES





----- DE-PIN FROM CONNECTOR ------

- Purge Control (F47-6 ; White-Blue) :: Remove from the ECU plug. Purge control does not exist on the JDM EJ20G ECU. This pin is used for the 5th injector control on the WRX RAs (although it not used on any stock ECU). I am not sure what the consequence will be of losing control of the purge system.

- California Pin (B56-11 ; Green-Black) :: Remove from the ECU plug. This pin is used for the JDM EJ20G accelerator pedal switch. It has no impact on the behavior of the EJ20G ECU.


----- DE-PIN AND MERGE WITH ANOTHER ------

- MAP ground (B48-5 ; Red) :: Merge with
B48-21. B48-5 is used for the stock JDM EJ20G cat efficiency EGT sensor. Not having an the stock EGT sensor has zero impact on how the ECU runs. The EJ20G harness combines the MAP sensor ground with all other sensor grounds at B48-21.

----- OTHER ECU DIFFERENCES THAT CAN BE IGNORED ------

- N/A (F47-4) :: Nothing to be done. On the EJ20G ECU, this is the Fan #2 control.
- N/A (F47-16) :: Nothing to be done. On the EJ20G ECU, this is the steering pressure switch input.
- N/A (F48-12) :: Nothing to be done. On the EJ20G ECU, this is for the EGT cat efficiency warning light.
- TPS shield (B58-7 ; Black) :: Nothing to be done. On the EJ20G ECU this pin is unpopulated in the connector. TPS shield it is located at B48-21, but B58-7 will work as well as both pins are connected inside the ECU.
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:49 PM   #10
Matt Monson
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Rob,
You should know better than to think my comments could possibly pertain to you. You Defintely know way more about these ecu gizmos than I ever will.

I still stand by my assertion that ej20g with ej22t ecu is basically plug n play.
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:55 PM   #11
69subaru360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Rob,
You should know better than to think my comments could possibly pertain to you. You Defintely know way more about these ecu gizmos than I ever will.

I still stand by my assertion that ej20g with ej22t ecu is basically plug n play.

It isn't. The engine harness to bulkhead plugs are different, way different. Besides the obvoius wasted vs. cop, the 22T used the cam and crank sensors with the long lead that went right to the bulkhead.

You, I, Rob and some of the others here could wire it up in a day and get it to work, but for a noob, forgetaboutit, they would be lost for a month.
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Old 03-14-2013, 08:58 PM   #12
rob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Rob,
You should know better than to think my comments could possibly pertain to you. You Defintely know way more about these ecu gizmos than I ever will.

I still stand by my assertion that ej20g with ej22t ecu is basically plug n play.
Well of course I know better I just couldn't help giving you a hard time.

It may be plug and play in the sense that it will run and seem to be fine. I am just correcting your false assertion that they are IDENTICAL. They are not (by 7 pins PLUS the 2 for the COP). At least the difference in MAP sensor ground would be reason enough to pay attention to detail here.

First beer is on you next time I visit FC. Haha.

-Rob
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Old 03-15-2013, 12:18 PM   #13
Matt Monson
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Originally Posted by 69subaru360 View Post
It isn't. The engine harness to bulkhead plugs are different, way different. Besides the obvoius wasted vs. cop, the 22T used the cam and crank sensors with the long lead that went right to the bulkhead.
There are two versions on the Ej22t. One is 2 squares and a rectangle, which is the same as EJ20G. The other is two squares and a circle. The squares are the same on both cars. The rectangle versus circles are the ground wires.

I don't consider the cam and crank sensors part of the intake manifold harness, they along with the knock sensor are separate.
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Old 03-15-2013, 12:58 PM   #14
69subaru360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
There are two versions on the Ej22t. One is 2 squares and a rectangle, which is the same as EJ20G. The other is two squares and a circle. The squares are the same on both cars. The rectangle versus circles are the ground wires.

I don't consider the cam and crank sensors part of the intake manifold harness, they along with the knock sensor are separate.
But neither EJ22T bulklhead harness will plug into an EJ20G engine harness and run. That was the original question in this thread.
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:02 PM   #15
Matt Monson
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I think we are getting lost in the minutae versus helping this guy with the path of least resistance.

Medfordhotrod,
If you want to put this Ej20G into your Legacy, I suggest you run it on the Ej22T ECU. If you do that, here is what needs to be done:

1.Install Ej20G longblock into car.
2.Remove both intake manifold wiring harnesses (requires unbolting manifolds from longblocks and you will want a new set of Ej25D manifold gaskets on hand to reinstall the Ej20G manifold.
3. Unwrap the plugs for the IAC and coolant temp sensor on ej22t harness. They are too short as they are wrapped right now because of slight relocations of the sensors on the Ej20G. Test fit to the manifold and then rewrap. Nothing needs to be cut, there is enough wire there once it is unwrapped.
4. Move ej22t cam and crank position sensors over to the Ej20G.
5. Install the Ej20G manifold and all of the associated plumbing including intercooler and air box. Use the Ej22t metal MAF and not the JECS MAF from the Ej20g.
6. Bolt everything else up and drive away.

There is no "wiring" in the traditional sense because you have just reused the Ej22t harness, and a couple of sensors. Everything else on the Ej20G engine is the same sensors and plugs. Run in this configuration, my car, with a TBE and no tune at all, put down what equates to 240bhp when dyno tested. Not bad for an ECU that isn't supposed to be matched to this particular engine. One with a Robtune on it probably would break 300bhp.

Oh, and buy a new coolant temp sensor. They are notorious for going bad on these JDM engines that have been sitting in a junkyard. For $20 you remove one big variable of why the car might not run when you go to fire it up for the first time.
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Old 03-15-2013, 01:21 PM   #16
69subaru360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
I think we are getting lost in the minutae versus helping this guy with the path of least resistance.

Medfordhotrod,
If you want to put this Ej20G into your Legacy, I suggest you run it on the Ej22T ECU. If you do that, here is what needs to be done:

1.Install Ej20G longblock into car.
2.Remove both intake manifold wiring harnesses (requires unbolting manifolds from longblocks and you will want a new set of Ej25D manifold gaskets on hand to reinstall the Ej20G manifold.
3. Unwrap the plugs for the IAC and coolant temp sensor on ej22t harness. They are too short as they are wrapped right now because of slight relocations of the sensors on the Ej20G. Test fit to the manifold and then rewrap. Nothing needs to be cut, there is enough wire there once it is unwrapped.
4. Move ej22t cam and crank position sensors over to the Ej20G.
5. Install the Ej20G manifold and all of the associated plumbing including intercooler and air box. Use the Ej22t metal MAF and not the JECS MAF from the Ej20g.
6. Bolt everything else up and drive away.

There is no "wiring" in the traditional sense because you have just reused the Ej22t harness, and a couple of sensors. Everything else on the Ej20G engine is the same sensors and plugs. Run in this configuration, my car, with a TBE and no tune at all, put down what equates to 240bhp when dyno tested. Not bad for an ECU that isn't supposed to be matched to this particular engine. One with a Robtune on it probably would break 300bhp.

Oh, and buy a new coolant temp sensor. They are notorious for going bad on these JDM engines that have been sitting in a junkyard. For $20 you remove one big variable of why the car might not run when you go to fire it up for the first time.
You didn't address the different ignition systems. It wouldn't run.

He could probably hang the EJ22T coil somewhere and get some EJ25D ignition wires for it, then it would run.
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Old 03-15-2013, 02:19 PM   #17
Matt Monson
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Sorry. You just plug in the wasted spark coil pack to the original Ej22t plug and zip tie it to the top of the manifold.
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Old 03-15-2013, 03:52 PM   #18
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Ya know rob, one of these days I will build my Gen 1 Legacy WRC tribute car and you will be getting a cry for help
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Old 03-15-2013, 05:00 PM   #19
Matt Monson
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Ya know rob, one of these days I will build my Gen 1 Legacy WRC tribute car and you will be getting a cry for help
I've been sitting on a rhd dash, steering rack and 1992 RS bulkhead harness for 5 years with plans to do the same thing.
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Old 03-15-2013, 07:09 PM   #20
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I've been sitting on a rhd dash, steering rack and 1992 RS bulkhead harness for 5 years with plans to do the same thing.
I would stay LHD
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Old 03-17-2013, 01:27 AM   #21
medfordhotrodguy
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Well thanks to everyone on here. I ended up getting a JDM Liberty EJ20G auto trans for $395/shipped. I throw it in last night with a new converter and fluid. Had to change the speed sensor as it plugged up different. Fired it up and took it for a drive. Shifted very nice. I drove it home from the shop (20 miles) and then stuck it to it. Engine pulled very good. Shifted good and quick @ 6k rpm.
I washed and vacuumed it out this morning, throw it on Craigslist and sold it for $2950. Made $1800 and the guy that bought was very happy to find it.

I am going to be picking up an OBD1 impreza sometime, then I'll swap with a ver. 6 or I'll pick up a 02 WRX shell and swap a ver. 9 into it. Still in the air on what to build. Also been throwing around the idea of taking the 02 WRX/ ver.9, cutting the floorpan, suspension out and putting it under my 68 Volvo amazon! Lots of work, but it takes me back to my scratch built hotrod days. Only time will tell what happens. Having a wife, kid, and a new house makes 1 think what's important to them.
Thanks again guys. It's nice to know there are still some good guys with true knowledge here, not just people who've seen to many movies!
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Old 03-18-2013, 01:31 PM   #22
Matt Monson
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I would stay LHD
That's not very interesting to me. This is a car that I will pretty much only take to the track and car shows. Just a toy really.
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