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Old 05-01-2011, 06:07 PM   #1
Nick Boxler
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Default Tuning to Fix E85 Cold Start Issues

So my WRX has 850cc injectors, running E85 with step colder plugs, and I had the car tuned, and it runs great, unless the car is cold, in which case it will have lots of trouble starting and running smoothly, which seems to be a common issue.

I found a thread that said it is advisable to bring all the cranking Fuel IPW values down to 0, and that should help. Right now those values range from 0 to -45. Also, from cylinder to cylinder there are a lot of differences in the cranking fuel injector pulse width, ranging between 7 to 145, and that same thread claimed that you should match the cylinders.

Can anybody tell me what would be safe to try? I do not have a wide-band or anything, so I can't look at my AFR. I know people who run E85 and have very little issues with cold starts. Thanks for the help.
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Old 05-01-2011, 07:39 PM   #2
Cefaln452
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E85 will never start as well as pump gas will in the cold. the fuel doesn't like to burn when its cold. I've seen people put tank warmers in and has helped...
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Old 05-02-2011, 12:01 AM   #3
Nick Boxler
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Originally Posted by Cefaln452 View Post
E85 will never start as well as pump gas will in the cold. the fuel doesn't like to burn when its cold. I've seen people put tank warmers in and has helped...
Yeah, I got a block heater, and that helps. But even when it is like 40-50 degrees, it still can't start very well. And I have seen people with E85 start their cold car in much colder weather.
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Old 05-06-2011, 11:34 PM   #4
WhiteBgeye02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Boxler View Post
Yeah, I got a block heater, and that helps. But even when it is like 40-50 degrees, it still can't start very well. And I have seen people with E85 start their cold car in much colder weather.

i think the above poster was talking about fuel cell heaters to keep the fuel warmer. block heater wont do much besides warming the oil that is sitting in it unless its a fancy one that heats the whole block or something.
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Old 05-07-2011, 03:35 PM   #5
Nick Boxler
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Originally Posted by WhiteBgeye02 View Post
i think the above poster was talking about fuel cell heaters to keep the fuel warmer. block heater wont do much besides warming the oil that is sitting in it unless its a fancy one that heats the whole block or something.
Ah dang... I think you're right. I just have the factory one that warms the cooling system.
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Old 05-09-2011, 05:39 PM   #6
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You need to add fuel....so you need to increase the IPW, not zero it.

Hilight your cranking tables below 32* (or at whatever temp your problems start) and multiply it by 20% (1.2)
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Old 05-10-2011, 03:41 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
You need to add fuel....so you need to increase the IPW, not zero it.

Hilight your cranking tables below 32* (or at whatever temp your problems start) and multiply it by 20% (1.2)
Ahh, ok. I shall try that when it gets cold again
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Old 05-16-2011, 09:08 PM   #8
thefoos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
You need to add fuel....so you need to increase the IPW, not zero it.

Hilight your cranking tables below 32* (or at whatever temp your problems start) and multiply it by 20% (1.2)
Best advice in this thread. Thats exactly what I did and I haven't had any trouble down to about 20*F over the years.
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:30 PM   #9
psmBoXer
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Let's say I was running E100. Would it be the same adjustment?
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:34 PM   #10
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the adjustment i gave isnt exact.....but the concept is the same....

the exact value necessary is gonna depend on your complete setup. just start with 20%...if that doesnt work...add more....if you go too far and the starting gets worse, then take some out. pretty simple.
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:43 PM   #11
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Cool. Thanks

Sent you a PM.
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:51 PM   #12
STIRyGuy86
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Been having the same problems, will have to give your fix a try!
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Old 06-01-2011, 03:00 PM   #13
ofspunk7
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I have an issue with this thread. I live in Minnesota, I ran E85 all winter. I teach snowboarding lessons on the weekend. I have had a handful of days where my car sat outside for 10+ hours in -10* or colder weather and had no start up issues. My car also sits outside during the week in a parking ramp while I am at work, no start up issues. I am thinking your issues are your tune. There are a few of us running E85 locally and everyone seems to be fine. A heater is not needed, just a better tune.
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Old 06-07-2011, 02:09 PM   #14
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I guess there is no miracle in tuning that will make a WRX with 8:4 compression start on pure ethanol without any gas ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
the adjustment i gave isnt exact.....but the concept is the same....

the exact value necessary is gonna depend on your complete setup. just start with 20%...if that doesnt work...add more....if you go too far and the starting gets worse, then take some out. pretty simple.
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:56 PM   #15
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I think I may be onto the right track with my cold start situation.

This is on a stock turbo 07 STi with ID 1000cc injectors and TGV deletes.

I made several maps with varying injector pulse width multipliers below coolant temps of 86F, ranging from +5-30% IPW.

I also added +20% to idle speed targets in every E85 test map below coolant temps of 140F.

So the maps I made look like this:
1.) +05% IPW < 86F / +20% idle speed <140F
2.) +10% IPW < 86F / +20% idle speed <140F
3.) +15% IPW < 86F / +20% idle speed <140F
4.) +20% IPW < 86F / +20% idle speed <140F
5.) +25% IPW < 86F / +20% idle speed <140F
6.) +30% IPW < 86F / +20% idle speed <140F

These changes were made to ''cranking IPW tables A-F'' and ''idle speed targets A-C''

That being said, I tried the +20% IPW map this morning (~55F ambient temp) and it only took 3 attempts to get the E85 to light off! Idle was high of course, but very solid and warmed up more quickly to operating temps without wandering.

I'm going to give the same map a try over the next few day and take it from there.

Hope this helps anyone else dealing with these issues, and any suggestions are welcome!
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