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Old 04-11-2013, 12:17 AM   #1
brokenboy
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Default New ID850 injectors, uneven trims

I put ID850 injectors in my 2008 STi.

Before this, my trims were all zero, and under boost the target fueling was dead on with a wideband. So I'm pretty sure my MAF tuning is good.

Now with the ID850's, I can't get both the trims and the open loop to line up.

ID publishes the latentices for the injectors. If I put these in, I need a flow scaling of ~800cc/min to get nice even 0% trims. However, then under boost it runs about 10% rich. I'm only boosting the wastegate pressure of 13PSI for my turbo right now.

If I put in 885cc/min, which is what the injectors are rated at, I get perfect AFR's under boost, but my cruise trims are off up to 10% (the ECU is adding fuel under cruise).

The weird thing is that the trims add more fuel as my MAP goes to less vacuum, so I'd think a vacuum leak would need more fuel added at idle, not at near 0 vacuum. This could just be the latentcy being of a touch though.

I've checked for a vacuum leak, but I can check again..

Is there anything but a leak that could cause this issue? Am I missing anything but injector scaling and latentcies?
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:59 AM   #2
Bamofo
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TurboMike Tuned 2.35

Default

The problem is your thinking about it too much :-)

You can tune so many ways... Tune the injectors for 0 trim for ol target or in the middle. Put 850 start the car. If it says it's taking out 15 points just go to the maf table. Select all and press the minus button 10 times, restart and try again. When you get the idle set that way I t should be pretty close on the ol table.

Ol is just an additive that should hit the target afr in that table... Nothing to worry about if you have 10.5 and it hits 11.5.. The Ecuflash guys and romraider guys just made it target afr to make it easier for people to interpret.

Send me a pm if you have more questions.
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:03 AM   #3
the suicidal eggroll
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Default

Probably some non-linearity with those injectors, or some non-linearity with the stock injectors that was being compensated for with the MAF scaling that's now fighting the linearity of the IDs.

Yes, theoretically, you shouldn't need to touch the MAF scaling or load compensations when changing injectors, but 90% of the time you do.

Also make sure you've adjusted tip-in and per-cyl fueling compensations as well.
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Old 04-11-2013, 05:26 PM   #4
Bamofo
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Good catch. Per cylinder fueling tables first, then go through the quick steps I gave above and you should be set.
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Old 04-13-2013, 12:04 AM   #5
bswilmington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the suicidal eggroll View Post
Probably some non-linearity with those injectors, or some non-linearity with the stock injectors that was being compensated for with the MAF scaling that's now fighting the linearity of the IDs.

Yes, theoretically, you shouldn't need to touch the MAF scaling or load compensations when changing injectors, but 90% of the time you do.

Also make sure you've adjusted tip-in and per-cyl fueling compensations as well.
Since you mentioned it, what are you guys doing to per cylinder fueling?? Zeroing it out?

Last edited by bswilmington; 04-13-2013 at 02:10 AM.
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Old 04-13-2013, 12:50 PM   #6
the suicidal eggroll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bswilmington View Post
Since you mentioned it, what are you guys doing to per cylinder fueling?? Zeroing it out?
Re-scaling the x-axis so that the same compensations are being applied at the same fuel flow, rather than the same IDC.
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Old 04-14-2013, 01:47 AM   #7
TurboJunkie85
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Mulitply your Tip-ins by .54 the whole table. Also try 823.05CC/Min for your injector scale that's a 7% reduction off of your cruise. It should drop your +/- 3% cruise. if your having a hard time hitting the targets with the stuff above shown. Adjust the injector latency down further. Or to ID's Spec page which is
8V
2.280
10v
1.54
12v
1.14
14v
.91
16v
.73
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:09 PM   #8
TurboJunkie85
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Or the other thing to do is to rescale your MAF
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Old 04-16-2013, 08:03 AM   #9
endrswrd
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Yeah because it seems like you are only having issues at one end of the spectrum or the other, if tweaking latencies doesnt help you, then you may just need to push correction to the low end, and tweak the low end of your MAF scaling to get where you want to be. I say the low end, because you can usually get away with it on the low end without making a jagged MAF curve like you would if tweaking the top end sometimes. (You can feel the jagged curve in a pull if it is bad enough)
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