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Old 04-16-2013, 12:54 AM   #1
rymaggi
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Built motor 20g // 446whp

Default Input on 4032 Piston for 450whp

Figured changing the name of the thread and OP would be easier than creating a whole new thread, as we have been getting really good info thus far.

So far the motor has been pulled, undressed, and head sent to the machine shop.

Heads looks great, cylinders and pistons looks actually super good as well.

We're looking for input and experiences with Wossner / Mahle 4032 pistons, any input reguarding mileage used, power output achieved, and just overall how you liked them for better or worse.

The car

The car is going to be used 90% of the time as a DD and will see very little auto X / thunder hill runs. Our main goal is to achieve a reliable 400-450whp DD that can take the abuse when i decide to have a little fun.

Build
  • Refreshed heads, set to stock spec
  • Manley H-beam rods
  • Stock Crank
  • Stock Bearings
  • Killer B oil pick up
  • Blouch 20g-XT
  • ID1000's
  • Hallman RX MBC
  • K&N Typhoon Intake
  • Mishimoto x3 core radiator
  • Spearco TMIC
  • APS Equal Length Headers w/ Up-Pipe
  • Stock gaskets
  • Deleted/Gutted TGV's
  • Walboro 255 fuel pump
  • ARP Head studs
  • Gates Timing Belt & Water pump
  • Perrin Inlet
  • Catch can

Off the top of my head i believe for the most part, that covers the majority of the major items being used in this build.

As of right now, the last thing to be purchased is the pistons, which is why we're looking for some feedback on what people have thought about the 4032's for Wossner / Mahle and similar goals.

Car is also going to be seeing E85 99% of the time.

Misc
  • V7 Complete Drivetrain Swap
  • Sedan front end conversion
  • STI control arms
  • 22m F&R sway bars
  • Whiteline HD Endlinks
  • Whiteline ALK kit
  • Whiteline RCA kit
  • BC BR coilovers w/ Swift Springs
  • Exedy 1508HD Clutch Kit
  • AUX Air pump deletes
  • 17x9 +35 Enkei RPF1's
  • 245/40/17 Direzzi Z2's
  • Whiteline Steering rack bushings

For fun pictures






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Last edited by rymaggi; 01-31-2014 at 12:00 PM.
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Old 04-16-2013, 12:59 AM   #2
StIGC11
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It all comes down to the engine builder. I run CP pistons with no coating and they are quiet. Before I had wiesco's with coatings and they were much louder but the engine was built by someone else.... I would give MPS a call (maxwell power service) or getadomtune talk to Dom.
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Old 04-16-2013, 01:29 AM   #3
Flat 4 Motorsport
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Any forged piston will be a bit louder on cold start. PTW clearances play a role in how quite the motor ends up being. A piston with an offset is going to give you more side wall loading which will equate to a quiter piston. Subaru uses a offset stock bore piston in the OEM block but is cast therefore doesn't grow as much as a forged 2618 piston will.

Let me know if I can help you out at all.

I prefer Manley pistons for daily driver built motors. I run CPs in my cars but I drive like a jerk off, and my WRX isn't daily driven.
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Old 04-16-2013, 01:42 AM   #4
rymaggi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StIGC11 View Post
It all comes down to the engine builder. I run CP pistons with no coating and they are quiet. Before I had wiesco's with coatings and they were much louder but the engine was built by someone else.... I would give MPS a call (maxwell power service) or getadomtune talk to Dom.
I will defiantly reach out to them for some additional advice in which to choose.

I am leaning towards the CP drop in's.

My builder pretty much told me to do a little research as to which forged pistons will do the least expanding, as new pistons come out all the time and people are different results with X mixed with Y and used with Z etc.
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Old 04-16-2013, 01:44 AM   #5
rymaggi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flat 4 Motorsport View Post
Any forged piston will be a bit louder on cold start. PTW clearances play a role in how quite the motor ends up being. A piston with an offset is going to give you more side wall loading which will equate to a quiter piston. Subaru uses a offset stock bore piston in the OEM block but is cast therefore doesn't grow as much as a forged 2618 piston will.

Let me know if I can help you out at all.

I prefer Manley pistons for daily driver built motors. I run CPs in my cars but I drive like a jerk off, and my WRX isn't daily driven.
Yea, I defiantly understand that running forged pistons will be a little louder than normal. Just trying to tone it down as much as possible.

Question "A piston with an offset is going to give you more side wall loading which will equate to a quiter piston."

What do u mean by offset and side wall loading.
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Old 04-16-2013, 08:49 AM   #6
RemlapaN
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The wrist pin is offset in the piston a very very small amount (millimeters) so that as the crank rotates, the offset drives the piston into the cylinder wall.

This little bit of side-loading on the piston can help reduce how much it rattles in the bore.
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Old 04-16-2013, 12:08 PM   #7
Zackbo
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stock ftw
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Old 04-16-2013, 01:33 PM   #8
rymaggi
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stock ftw
Well, obviously.
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Old 04-16-2013, 05:27 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rymaggi View Post
Things i plan on buying for the refresh/rebuild
- H-Beam Forged Rods (Kinda 50/50)
- STI Nitrated Crank (50/50 Also)
- 11mm STI Oil Pump
I vote for a good set of H-beams (like Manley H-tuff) or resize the stock rods with ARP bolts as insurance.

I vote against replacing the crank - stock crank is plenty strong, no need to replace unless it is bad.

And I definitely vote against the 11mm oil pump unless you build for it since otherwise it will bypass too much oil, overheating it.

Just my $.02...
Kyle "BlackHole"
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Old 04-16-2013, 08:57 PM   #10
ROFLBOXER
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My builder recommended wisecos for a dd 20g build. Slightly lighter than others, and except for startup in freezing temps they've been nice and quiet.
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Old 04-16-2013, 10:19 PM   #11
Flat 4 Motorsport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROFLBOXER View Post
My builder recommended wisecos for a dd 20g build. Slightly lighter than others, and except for startup in freezing temps they've been nice and quiet.

not a fan of Wiseco's they have way too many failure on Subaru's that I've seen.

Too short of a skirt IMO

Here's a pic I stole from RexFTW (Brian) he had four cracked Wiseco's.




I have only seen ONCE, a cracked ringland on a CP piston and someone has it as a Subaru Shootout trophy.
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Old 04-16-2013, 11:34 PM   #12
rymaggi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackHole View Post

I vote for a good set of H-beams (like Manley H-tuff) or resize the stock rods with ARP bolts as insurance.

I vote against replacing the crank - stock crank is plenty strong, no need to replace unless it is bad.

And I definitely vote against the 11mm oil pump unless you build for it since otherwise it will bypass too much oil, overheating it.

Just my $.02...
Kyle "BlackHole"
Thanks for your info.

Tuner/builder did say the sticker would be just fine. I've just read through so many threads and everyone seems to be using them.

Same with oil pump.

I'm kinda leaning towards the CP's. seems from everything I have read they very reliable.
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Old 04-16-2013, 11:36 PM   #13
rymaggi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flat 4 Motorsport View Post

not a fan of Wiseco's they have way too many failure on Subaru's that I've seen.

Too short of a skirt IMO

Here's a pic I stole from RexFTW (Brian) he had four cracked Wiseco's.

I have only seen ONCE, a cracked ringland on a CP piston and someone has it as a Subaru Shootout trophy.
Thanks for that insight. I will defiantly stead clear of wiseco's.

I'm trying to keep my build basic/reliable without "cutting" corners with stuff that isn't necessary, but at the same time not cutting to many corners to only have it pop with 400whp running through it.
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Old 04-17-2013, 09:00 AM   #14
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IMO it really depends on the build, builder preferences, and application.

FWIW trying the new Manley pistons and new H-rods on our latest build. Had Swain Tech apply the skirt coating and ceramic top coating. Engine is sleeved, will see LOTS of (product development) dyno time with street and track time as well.

Will let you know how it turns out if/when she pops.

Previous engine had the older style Manley pistons and H-rods. Pistons came with the coating already on them from Manley. They were clack clack clack loud until she got really hot, which I'll take any day over the black death.
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Old 04-17-2013, 10:30 AM   #15
RexFTW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flat 4 Motorsport View Post
not a fan of Wiseco's they have way too many failure on Subaru's that I've seen.

Too short of a skirt IMO

Here's a pic I stole from RexFTW (Brian) he had four cracked Wiseco's.

I have only seen ONCE, a cracked ringland on a CP piston and someone has it as a Subaru Shootout trophy.
Thief! My photobucket!

But yeah, all four of my Wisecos on my 2.1 stroker cracked in the exact same spot on both sides of the piston.

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Old 04-17-2013, 02:46 PM   #16
rymaggi
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Will piston coating be any issue if I'm going to just hone the cylinders and use CP drop ins?
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Old 04-17-2013, 03:09 PM   #17
Flat 4 Motorsport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rymaggi View Post
Will piston coating be any issue if I'm going to just hone the cylinders and use CP drop ins?
Going to have to measure ptw still. I would wait to hone the cylinder until you have the piston coated.

I can usually have my coater add .002 when he goes on the thicker side.

Measuring is you friend.
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Old 04-17-2013, 05:32 PM   #18
rymaggi
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Originally Posted by Flat 4 Motorsport View Post

Going to have to measure ptw still. I would wait to hone the cylinder until you have the piston coated.

I can usually have my coater add .002 when he goes on the thicker side.

Measuring is you friend.
Gotcha. I was just gonna have CP do the coating when I order them. Or do you recommend a 3rd party doing it.
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Old 04-17-2013, 07:31 PM   #19
Flat 4 Motorsport
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Originally Posted by rymaggi View Post
Gotcha. I was just gonna have CP do the coating when I order them. Or do you recommend a 3rd party doing it.

3rd party, the screened on skirt coating is crap.

I wouldn't waste the $25 per piston or whatever it was.

PM me, and I can give you pricing for skirts and domes.

-Phil
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Old 04-18-2013, 12:37 PM   #20
gfx2043
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For 400whp in a DD that you want to go alot of miles before a rebuild go with 4032 psitons. 4032 was specificly designed for that type of application. Only problem is if you get addicted to power and want 500+ I would start to worry about the 4032 pistons.
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Old 04-18-2013, 03:19 PM   #21
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I have Mahle pistons and they work pretty fine. Not much piston slap.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:58 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flat 4 Motorsport View Post
3rd party, the screened on skirt coating is crap.

I wouldn't waste the $25 per piston or whatever it was.

PM me, and I can give you pricing for skirts and domes.

-Phil
Phil, what is the average turn around time? "ballpark"

Thanks,

Ian,
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Old 04-19-2013, 10:05 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by rexworx View Post
Phil, what is the average turn around time? "ballpark"

Thanks,

Ian,

depends how busy they are, I usually get my stuff back in a week, just all depends. It's been two weeks at times.

There's only one guy who sprays (the owner) he makes sure quality is number one.

They spend a lot of time on the prep work too. They tape off very evenly, on new stuff obviously it's easier on new parts put they still take their time on masking off the wrist pin holes, ringlands ect.

-Phil
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:16 PM   #24
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Ok thank you.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:23 PM   #25
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As everyone knowledgeable has already said, PTW clearance is what makes the slap. For reference, I have Manley pistons and rods in mine and it is decently quiet. Although it's been relatively warm in LA, it sounds stock.
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