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Old 04-23-2013, 03:09 PM   #26
Rodwrx23
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I am indeed on the stock VF39. I highly doubt the dump tube is too restrictive. I ran this setup on my bugeye with an APS Sr40 and had zero issues.
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Old 04-23-2013, 08:42 PM   #27
Buzzed Trucks
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I just took the car out on a quick cruise. I punched third pretty hard (not quite full throttle) and my boost gauge went straight to 22psi. So much for thinking I got it to max at 20 last night. So now I'm even more confused.

Why else could I be overboosting? Springs are 16psi. Do my Killer B headers really flow that much air? Could the high flow of the headers also be pushing the wastegate open early? It's only opening a tiny bit to where I can hear it, but I don't notice it affecting the spool.
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Old 04-23-2013, 08:51 PM   #28
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what rpms were you at when you punched it (but not punched it?)?
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Old 04-23-2013, 08:53 PM   #29
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who did the fabrication on the up pipe to wastegate flange? is it possibly obstructed somehow?
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Old 04-23-2013, 09:15 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m1r4g3 View Post
what rpms were you at when you punched it (but not punched it?)?
It was right around 4k.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorDucK View Post
who did the fabrication on the up pipe to wastegate flange? is it possibly obstructed somehow?
I sent it back to Killer B to do the fab work. The only obstruction that I can think of is the "sharper" bend in the dump tube.

Up pipe looks like this (not actual picture of mine):


Dump tube looks like this (not actual picture of mine):
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:23 PM   #31
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never mind, I didn't realize you had already posted a picture! looks great!

I had images of maybe a "friend" and some shoddy fabrication
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:24 PM   #32
06wrx420
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have you set ur WGDC to 0. then see if it still over boost? if so the spring in ur waste gate is to much. I had the 1 bar 14.50psi spring set up in my waste gate which is the same as urs and I was still over boosting. I went down to the 11.60 psi spring and am boosting great. I have a 06 wrx with mods as follows
[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif']cobb ap
lightwight flywheel
cobb lightwight pully
cobb 3 port bcs
vf39
cobb heat shield
sti tmic
cobb sri with post maf silicone hose and cobb air box
amr 3in hard turbo inlet
PnP intake manifold
TGV deletes
Phenolic spacers 8 mill
Grimmspeed PnP stock exhaust manifold with hi flow crosspipe ceramic coated wrapped
Grimmspeed Upipe 38mm ewg
Tial 38mm MV-S
invidia bellmouth downpipe
cobb cat back with a cutout in it.
secondary air pump delete
samco hoses
kartboy short throw kit
1100FIC
gauges I have boost, AEM wideband, oil psi[/font]

hope that helps you out

edit seen you have a mbc its got to be to much spring pressure in the wastegate you want ur spring pressure to be about half of ur target boost pressure.

Last edited by 06wrx420; 04-23-2013 at 10:31 PM.
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:33 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06wrx420 View Post
have you set ur WGDC to 0. then see if it still over boost? if so the spring in ur waste gate is to much. I had the 1 bar 14.50psi spring set up in my waste gate which is the same as urs and I was still over boosting. I went down to the 11.60 psi spring and am boosting great. I have a 06 wrx with mods as follows
[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif']cobb ap
lightwight flywheel
cobb lightwight pully
cobb 3 port bcs
vf39
cobb heat shield
sti tmic
cobb sri with post maf silicone hose and cobb air box
amr 3in hard turbo inlet
PnP intake manifold
TGV deletes
Phenolic spacers 8 mill
Grimmspeed PnP stock exhaust manifold with hi flow crosspipe ceramic coated wrapped
Grimmspeed Upipe 38mm ewg
Tial 38mm MV-S
invidia bellmouth downpipe
cobb cat back with a cutout in it.
secondary air pump delete
samco hoses
kartboy short throw kit
gauges I have boost, AEM wideband, oil psi[/font]

hope that helps you out

edit seen you have a mbc its got to be to much spring pressure in the wastegate you want ur spring pressure to be about half of ur target boost pressure
I plan on dropping the spring pressure down. Are you still overboosting on the 11.60 spring but able to reach your desired peak boost? When I spoke to Tial, they told me since I am running a 16 psi spring and hitting X amount of boost, then take X amount of boost minus 16 psi, and then subtract that number from 16 and that is desired spring pressure. Basically if I'm hitting 22 psi on a 16 psi spring, I should be running a 10 psi spring. I will still be boosting over the spring pressure, but it won't be over boosting as much. Bad news is that I initially ran a 10 psi spring combo and was still hitting 20+psi.
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:45 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzed Trucks View Post
I plan on dropping the spring pressure down. Are you still overboosting on the 11.60 spring but able to reach your desired peak boost? When I spoke to Tial, they told me since I am running a 16 psi spring and hitting X amount of boost, then take X amount of boost minus 16 psi, and then subtract that number from 16 and that is desired spring pressure. Basically if I'm hitting 22 psi on a 16 psi spring, I should be running a 10 psi spring. I will still be boosting over the spring pressure, but it won't be over boosting as much. Bad news is that I initially ran a 10 psi spring combo and was still hitting 20+psi.


yes I am under my target boost with this spring set up using the cobb 3 port bcs to get me back up to 19 psi target boost.. And now that i am really thinking about it I may have even went down to the 0.7 bar spring pressure.
here is a good list of spring pressures
http://www.rallysportdirect.com/Tial...-w-All-Springs

edit. yes I am forsure at the 0.7 bar
it is easier to get the boost to come up then go down
if you were running the 10lbs spring then why did you go up in spring pressure?
Half of ur target boost is only close its not a perfect calculation

Last edited by 06wrx420; 04-23-2013 at 10:52 PM.
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Old 04-23-2013, 10:58 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06wrx420 View Post
yes I am under my target boost with this spring set up using the cobb 3 port bcs to get me back up to 19 psi target boost.. And now that i am really thinking about it I may have even went down to the 0.7 bar spring pressure.
here is a good list of spring pressures
http://www.rallysportdirect.com/Tial...-w-All-Springs

edit. yes I am forsure at the 0.7 bar
it is easier to get the boost to come up then go down
if you were running the 10lbs spring then why did you go up in spring pressure?
Half of ur target boost is only close its not a perfect calculation
I went from 10 psi springs to 16 psi springs to see if it would fix the issue of the wastegate opening early. At both 10psi springs and 16psi springs, the wastegate opens early, and still overboosts to 20+psi.
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:06 PM   #36
06wrx420
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzed Trucks View Post
I went from 10 psi springs to 16 psi springs to see if it would fix the issue of the wastegate opening early. At both 10psi springs and 16psi springs, the wastegate opens early, and still overboosts to 20+psi.
My wastegate starts opening at around 9 to 10 psi. that should be right. note if the wastegate is not opening, it is not going to dump access boost pressure to control boost so u dont over boost.
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:11 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06wrx420 View Post
My wastegate starts opening at around 9 to 10 psi. that should be right. note if the wastegate is not opening, it is not going to dump access boost pressure to control boost so u dont over boost.
1. Wastegate opens at about 5psi (only cracks open). Car still spools
2. Wastegate allows for overboost 20+psi
3. Numbers 1 and 2 happen on both the 10psi spring and 16psi spring.

Not trying to be a dick, but I've said this multiple times. Maybe I need to be clearer.
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:19 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzed Trucks View Post
1. Wastegate opens at about 5psi (only cracks open). Car still spools
2. Wastegate allows for overboost 20+psi
3. Numbers 1 and 2 happen on both the 10psi spring and 16psi spring.

Not trying to be a dick, but I've said this multiple times. Maybe I need to be clearer.
It has to be to much sping pressure in the wastegate. With ur headers you could just be flowing that much air. I would lower down to the 0.6 or even the 0.5 bar springs. It has to be that. there is not much to these things.
no worries I just wana help out.
edit are u using the grimmspeed wastegate block off bracket?
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:24 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06wrx420 View Post
It has to be to much sping pressure in the wastegate. With ur headers you could just be flowing that much air. I would lower down to the 0.6 or even the 0.5 bar springs. It has to be that. there is not much to these things.
no worries I just wana help out.
I'm definitely going to drop the spring pressure down to see if that helps the overboost. Hopefully it doesn't allow it to crack open more around the 5psi range, because then it will affect my spooling more than it already it is.

When I take it off the car, I'm also going to check it with a bike pump (or other pressure pump) to see what's going on. If it really is opening the whole way at 16 psi, then I guess the wastegate can't flow enough air.

I appreciate the help!

EDIT: I am using the Cobb Wastegate Bracket
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:29 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzed Trucks View Post
I'm definitely going to drop the spring pressure down to see if that helps the overboost. Hopefully it doesn't allow it to crack open more around the 5psi range, because then it will affect my spooling more than it already it is.

When I take it off the car, I'm also going to check it with a bike pump (or other pressure pump) to see what's going on. If it really is opening the whole way at 16 psi, then I guess the wastegate can't flow enough air.

I appreciate the help!
For the record there is no way its not flowing enough air.. most of the time they use 38 on big turbo application vs the 44.
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:29 PM   #41
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Just get a tune trust me. I had an over boost problem in my 2.0 and it cost me a rod bearing which I bought a 2.5 to replace it. Come to find out it was a bad boost controller is what caused mine
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:35 PM   #42
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Just get a tune trust me. I had an over boost problem in my 2.0 and it cost me a rod bearing which I bought a 2.5 to replace it. Come to find out it was a bad boost controller is what caused mine
I'm not even using a boost controller at the moment. Even though adjusting the tune is unnecessary due to it being all mechanical, I still adjusting my WGDC tables and set them to 0. My afr's are still okay, I've been closely monitoring them.
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:39 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Buzzed Trucks View Post
I'm not even using a boost controller at the moment. Even though adjusting the tune is unnecessary due to it being all mechanical, I still adjusting my WGDC tables and set them to 0. My afr's are still okay, I've been closely monitoring them.

If you are needing a tuner this is who I use. His name is Stephen clark. Out of boulder CO. He does Etunes. great guy super helpful and great customer service http://www.iaperformance.com/ one of the cheapest, most important and best mods for the money

do you have a wideband?
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Old 04-23-2013, 11:44 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06wrx420 View Post
If you are needing a tuner this is who I use. His name is Stephen clark. Out of boulder CO. He does Etunes. great guy super helpful and great customer service http://www.iaperformance.com/ one of the cheapest, most important and best mods for the money

do you have a wideband?
I do have a wideband. I have a tuner, but the little stuff I can do myself. I've had him, Tial, and other say that tune definitely shouldn't influence an EWG running only on spring pressure.
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Old 04-24-2013, 07:06 AM   #45
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Best thing at this point is gonna be to take the waategate off check and make sure it opens fully with a pump and check that the uppipe or dumptube doesn't have something blocking the opening internally. Not a permanent solution but if you think your dump tube might be bent too sharp you could run it around the block without it and see if it still overboosts. Just be away of which way it points and what might potentially melt
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Old 04-24-2013, 07:12 AM   #46
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are the springs in sideways/not in line or possibly bound up somehow?
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Old 04-24-2013, 08:36 AM   #47
xluben
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There is so much bad advice or simply not reading in this thread. You're doing all the right things by testing it on spring pressure. It is obviously not a tune issue. Don't listen to these people giving you bad info.

I would continue to check for mechanical issues (vacuum lines, EWG diaphragm defects, fire ring installed, EWG opening all the way, blockage in the uppipe/EWG/dump tube, leaking plugs in the EWG, etc, etc).

Do you have another EWG you can swap on?
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Old 04-24-2013, 09:57 AM   #48
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There is so much bad advice or simply not reading in this thread. You're doing all the right things by testing it on spring pressure. It is obviously not a tune issue. Don't listen to these people giving you bad info.

I would continue to check for mechanical issues (vacuum lines, EWG diaphragm defects, fire ring installed, EWG opening all the way, blockage in the uppipe/EWG/dump tube, leaking plugs in the EWG, etc, etc).

Do you have another EWG you can swap on?
I will be removing it again this weekend to test it. Specifically when the spring opens. I don't know anyone else that has one, so I will be ordering a new one to see if theres a difference in performance. I can't really afford to have my car down for over a week just so I can send the current one back to Tial.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:01 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzed Trucks View Post
I just took the car out on a quick cruise. I punched third pretty hard (not quite full throttle) and my boost gauge went straight to 22psi. So much for thinking I got it to max at 20 last night. So now I'm even more confused.

Why else could I be overboosting? Springs are 16psi. Do my Killer B headers really flow that much air? Could the high flow of the headers also be pushing the wastegate open early? It's only opening a tiny bit to where I can hear it, but I don't notice it affecting the spool.
I doubt the headers have anything to do with it. My problem was identical with Cusco UEL headers and Invidia Race EL headers whoch flow much more than the former.

I've personally pretty much given up on the problem and have decided to permanently run 21psi straight off the wastegate. Uppipe is brand new, springs are brand new, diaphragm is brand new, fire ring is brand new, vacuum lines are brand new, car is still an a**hole.
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Old 04-24-2013, 07:42 PM   #50
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So speaking theoretically:

I take the wastegate off, check it with a bike pump or regulated air compressor. If I find out it doesn't open the whole way like it should, then I know it's a wastegate issue. I will then try the new one I bought to see if theres a difference. If there is no difference, then what?

If it does open the whole way like it should, then what? As long as my vacuum lines are good (I'm 99% sure they are), then does that mean it can't flow enough air? I know it sounds ridiculous, but where do I go from there?

EDIT: Should I be running the restrictor pill? How does the restrictor pill affect the boost?

Last edited by Buzzed Trucks; 04-24-2013 at 08:04 PM.
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