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Old 01-25-2014, 03:00 PM   #76
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
What is the benefit of Chevy bearings?
they're wider. That means more surface area. They are slightly smaller in diameter, that means lower bearing speed.

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Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
at what whp/wtq are people having issues with subaru ACL or King bearings?

well that's a silly question, Juan. All of them?

Granted, some builders have had much better luck than others, the Subaru bearing is still one of the smallest bearings of any engine that makes our kind of HP. Anything you can do to increase bearing surface area and slow bearing speed is a good thing. SR20, 4G63, B16-K24 etc etc all have better bearings.
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Old 01-25-2014, 03:51 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
they're wider. That means more surface area. They are slightly smaller in diameter, that means lower bearing speed.




well that's a silly question, Juan. All of them?

Granted, some builders have had much better luck than others, the Subaru bearing is still one of the smallest bearings of any engine that makes our kind of HP. Anything you can do to increase bearing surface area and slow bearing speed is a good thing. SR20, 4G63, B16-K24 etc etc all have better bearings.
I knew they had a smaller surface are compared to other engines but I wasn't aware that people were having issues unless the bearing clearances were not appropriate or the tune was crap.

It seems to me most people with high power and properly build engine have more issues with head gasket and cracked cylinder liners than bearing issues.......

I guess I am one of the lucky ones with no bearing issues, so far....
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Old 01-25-2014, 04:18 PM   #78
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Didn't you JUST spin a bearing in a engine a few months ago?

Have you seen a lot of 1000whp Subarus running around? Not really. Cylinders, head gaskets, bearings and wrist pin bushings are some of the reasons why. Subaru engine geometry is the rest.

OP is doing sleeves. So cylinders won't be cracking.
OP is doing larger studs. I don't know how big, but I'm sure he's going big. That'll help with gaskets.
OP is doing larger bearings and wrist pins.
OP is doing longer rods to help with the geometry.

I think he's got most things covered.
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Old 01-25-2014, 05:09 PM   #79
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Interesting. Epic sounding actually. In for results and best of luck x1000. On and upwards!!!!
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Old 01-25-2014, 05:11 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
Didn't you JUST spin a bearing in a engine a few months ago?

Have you seen a lot of 1000whp Subarus running around? Not really. Cylinders, head gaskets, bearings and wrist pin bushings are some of the reasons why. Subaru engine geometry is the rest.

OP is doing sleeves. So cylinders won't be cracking.
OP is doing larger studs. I don't know how big, but I'm sure he's going big. That'll help with gaskets.
OP is doing larger bearings and wrist pins.
OP is doing longer rods to help with the geometry.

I think he's got most things covered.
Nope never... It was burn valve from a bad valve job...valves had 60K miles. The engine that I have right now was built by Crystal; its been in the car for two years now with the 6466 turbo.

Anyway, I was asking a serious question. Dom I hope you get tune the car was well. I can't wait to see what it will make.

GL
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Old 01-25-2014, 05:43 PM   #81
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Cosi crank is toast - micro-fractures in multiple places in addition to the scuffing, flat spot, and counterweight hits. Doing this with an OEM crank this time around. I will probably need to bring engine speed down a bit, if for no other reason than I bet these rods are going to be hefty. Probably only rev it to 8300-8500 (perhaps even only 8k, I have to do some thinking/reading/talking).
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Old 02-10-2014, 01:08 AM   #82
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Fobia is building me another setup this time going low mount and I have been reading through a lot of peoples builds he has made headers for, hopefully you get it up and running again and can get some joy out of it, curious though why go for a larger displacement with a worse rod to stroke ratio and a larger heavier piston and rod combo?? Not saying I have the best combo by any means but I run a jdm ver 8 207 that I spun to 9500 for over a year, and 12k mix never had an issue pulled it apart to build up the heads and everything is still in great shape this all while making 500hp the whole time, I kind of agree with the whole KISS saying don't go crazy and mix so many drastic parts. But that's just me talking, I really would love to see your setup up and running again
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:05 PM   #83
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Fobia is building me another setup this time going low mount and I have been reading through a lot of peoples builds he has made headers for, hopefully you get it up and running again and can get some joy out of it, curious though why go for a larger displacement with a worse rod to stroke ratio and a larger heavier piston and rod combo?? Not saying I have the best combo by any means but I run a jdm ver 8 207 that I spun to 9500 for over a year, and 12k mix never had an issue pulled it apart to build up the heads and everything is still in great shape this all while making 500hp the whole time, I kind of agree with the whole KISS saying don't go crazy and mix so many drastic parts. But that's just me talking, I really would love to see your setup up and running again
Basically, broader powerband, lower power density, less oiling headaches, less rpm related stress.

Rods and crank are done and shipping, just waiting on pistons at this point. Apparently JE lost my order up until like two weeks ago so I doubt that will be any time soon.
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Old 02-10-2014, 06:58 PM   #84
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Nice well make sure you post some pictures works like to see everything, how much wider are Chevy bearings??? What are they from? Old 350??? LS engine??
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Old 02-11-2014, 11:30 AM   #85
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Nice well make sure you post some pictures works like to see everything, how much wider are Chevy bearings??? What are they from? Old 350??? LS engine??
LS, if I remember correctly they are about 20mm wide instead of 16-16.5mm wide. The diameter is slightly smaller too.

I will post pictures when they arrive.
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:24 PM   #86
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I'm glad to see your re-build coming together Brian!

When do you think it will be running?

If you get it done in time and feel up to putting it to the test, you guys should bring it down to Branson with us in April.

http://www.streetcar-takeover.com/#!...p-sign-up/cemu
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:18 PM   #87
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I'm glad to see your re-build coming together Brian!

When do you think it will be running?

If you get it done in time and feel up to putting it to the test, you guys should bring it down to Branson with us in April.

http://www.streetcar-takeover.com/#!...p-sign-up/cemu
We will see how it goes, but I might be up for a trip. I am hesitant to think it will be running full steam by then though. I don't even have pistons as yet.

Here are a couple pictures of the rods compared to a couple others:


The 2nd from bottom is my new ones and the bottom one are the old Saenz rods.


K1 top, Pauters middle, Saenz bottom.
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:20 PM   #88
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Also, no that isn't the crank I will be using, just was on the counter where I decided to take pictures. I didn't bother with pictures of the crank, but I might later. You can tell it has been worked on but looks really good to me.
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:21 PM   #89
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the Saenz rods are the ones you were pushing to 1khp?
that is pretty wild for an H beam design rod.

Typically aren't H beam rods designed for lower HP limitations?
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:28 PM   #90
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the Saenz rods are the ones you were pushing to 1khp?
that is pretty wild for an H beam design rod.

Typically aren't H beam rods designed for lower HP limitations?
They are rated to 1200 hp, yeah so it was those. I only really made it to just under 700 wheel though.

I've been through all the talks about how you can't really rate a rod on just horsepower... but yeah.
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:31 PM   #91
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They are rated to 1200 hp, yeah so it was those. I only really made it to just under 700 wheel though.

I've been through all the talks about how you can't really rate a rod on just horsepower... but yeah.
for sure its hard to rate a rod to a HP limit, its all about pressure.
its hard to say at X hp X psi of pressure will be on any given rod.

either way, I had never heard of an H beam rated at that high of a number.
I found that interesting.

I feel you will have better luck with the pauters holding.
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:35 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by jnorth85 View Post
for sure its hard to rate a rod to a HP limit, its all about pressure.
its hard to say at X hp X psi of pressure will be on any given rod.

either way, I had never heard of an H beam rated at that high of a number.
I found that interesting.

I feel you will have better luck with the pauters holding.
I hope so, and there is a bit of a (though not as drastic as I was expecting, not sure what I really expected however) weight difference. I will have to weigh them to compare.
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:39 PM   #93
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for sure its hard to rate a rod to a HP limit, its all about pressure.
its hard to say at X hp X psi of pressure will be on any given rod.

either way, I had never heard of an H beam rated at that high of a number.
I found that interesting.

I feel you will have better luck with the pauters holding.

Those Pauters look beef.

About the 1k HP H-beams: As I said, Cosworth claimed well over 1k hp on those exact same rods (Saenze). People seem to think I'm lying so I found the email from Cosworth themselves:
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:39 PM   #94
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I hope so, and there is a bit of a (though not as drastic as I was expecting, not sure what I really expected however) weight difference. I will have to weigh them to compare.
sometimes weight is a good thing haha
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:44 PM   #95
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Way to many variables to say one does this one does that. I'll be using the Carrillo h beams with my new 72mm so we shall see if they are up to the task. The pauter design imo seems better than most. The turbo tuffs are stout though as well. All of them will tweak though with to much timing on e85 or trying to get away with too much lol. Happens a lot.!
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:44 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
Those Pauters look beef.

About the 1k HP H-beams: As I said, Cosworth claimed well over 1k hp on those exact same rods (Saenze). People seem to think I'm lying so I found the email from Cosworth themselves:
I am not trying to call you a liar or anything along those lines if it is coming across that way. It could have been a manufacturing defect, something about the torque curve, or something else altogether.

I have no way of knowing or figuring it out. All I know is it broke so the logical step is to find something stronger.
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Old 02-19-2014, 01:55 PM   #97
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Those Pauters look beef.

About the 1k HP H-beams: As I said, Cosworth claimed well over 1k hp on those exact same rods (Saenze). People seem to think I'm lying so I found the email from Cosworth themselves:
I hope I didnt come off as if I thought you were lying, I was very aware that you were just passing the info off you received from Cosworth.

I just found it interesting that an H beam design rod would be rated to hold that kind of power.

as Brian said, there are a number of variables that can lead to rod failure.
It really is difficult to assign a HP number to a rod because you never know what loads it will see at any given HP/Torque.
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Old 02-19-2014, 02:03 PM   #98
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I'm sorry, I don't feel you two were directly attacking me. I didn't mean for it to come off that way, but earlier (months ago) I was getting hammered pretty hard for making "false claims".

I'm pretty much over it. I still love you guys. I just wanted to get that proof out there so you didn't think I was intentionally misleading anyone.
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Old 02-19-2014, 02:20 PM   #99
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I think the H beams in general have gotten beaten up a it from a perception standpoint because of all the cheap, bad Chinese made product that has been out there and breaking. Carrillo's top shelf strongest rod for our EJ's is there Pro H-beam and you don't see them breaking that often, even though Cam just broke one last year but he hydro locked the motor with a stuck injector, so it was not the rods fault. To many variables as was stated earlier.

Best of luck on the new build Brian. Good on you for staying with it and progressing, I hope you set some new standards!

I like my build with the (strong-lite) Saenz Super H beams, Dom!!
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Old 02-19-2014, 05:43 PM   #100
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Also; the turbo I decided on is:

http://www.full-race.com/store/turbo...t-turbo-1.html

I originally was going to add nitrous to that turbo to break 1kwhp and try to have a usable powerband but the response out of the 67mm was far better than I expected and am willing to chew a bit more lag to hit that power on boost alone which this 72mm is definitely capable of (if everything else is).

I'll break it in and do some shake-down work on the 67mm then switch to the 72mm when it is time to go for it.
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