Grounding mod actually works

WRXtreme02 · 10-13-2002, 04:13 PM

Well, I only was able to ground 2 points, the strut tower and the point on the manifold, didn’t have enough wire to do the others. But just from that I noticed a huge difference. Before the mod, I was getting hesitation between 2,000 and 3,000 RPMs, now it’s almost completely smoothed out. And on my voltmeter, it’s staying constant at 13.7-13.9 volts. Where before it would drop to like 13.1-13.3 volts. And now with the lights and AC on, it stays around 13.5 volts, where before the mod it would drop down to like 12.8. So yes, this does work, and would recommend it to all. The Subaru grounding system really blows.

WRXVII · 10-13-2002, 04:22 PM

It will last for about two weeks then go back to normal.....

lil'redwagon · 10-13-2002, 04:32 PM

really? what have you experienced?

CirrusWRX · 10-13-2002, 07:52 PM

hahah - ECU reset, perhaps? Dunno, but that's probably what WRXVII is alluding to. Somebody did a REAL test once tho, w/o an ECU reset, and claims it worked for them too.

I'd say from my reading it's about 50/50 -- some people are thrilled, others believe it's snake oil.

Rich10 · 10-13-2002, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by WRXtreme02
Well, I only was able to ground 2 points, the strut tower and the point on the manifold, didn’t have enough wire to do the others. But just from that I noticed a huge difference. Before the mod, I was getting hesitation between 2,000 and 3,000 RPMs, now it’s almost completely smoothed out. And on my voltmeter, it’s staying constant at 13.7-13.9 volts. Where before it would drop to like 13.1-13.3 volts. And now with the lights and AC on, it stays around 13.5 volts, where before the mod it would drop down to like 12.8. So yes, this does work, and would recommend it to all. The Subaru grounding system really blows.

What mods (if any) do you have?

WRXtreme02 · 10-13-2002, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rich10

What mods (if any) do you have?

Turbo XS Unichip, Stage 2
AEM CAI
Vishnu Up-pipe
Godspeed Downpipe
Tanabe Catback
Blitz SBC-iD

bamfwrx · 10-14-2002, 02:21 AM

snake oil

at least you didn't buy one of those kits

i had a hard time beliving that this would work but some thread convinced me to try it( i allready had all the wire and ends) but all i did was add a little extra weight

KIMUTAKU · 10-14-2002, 03:24 AM

really?
i heard this was a pretty good mod...

i was thinking about buying the splitfire grounding thingy or some other brands...

damnit...now i have to think it over...

CirrusWRX · 10-14-2002, 03:39 AM

Well, whatever you do, I would think a safe statement would be: DO NOT SPEND A LOT OF MONEY ON THIS!!!! It's not necessary to purchase an $80.00 "earthing" kit -- go buy some decent wire and connectors for $10.00 and it'll be just as good!! Those kits are ridiculously priced (in my opinion) in an attempt to take advantage of people who don't know any better!!

DiMensionX · 10-14-2002, 04:04 AM

I can officially say this grounding mod stuff is JUNK. It is the Unichip closed/open loop transition you are feeling. I pulled the Unichip, popped in the UTEC, and it's as smooth as silk. Ask anyone at the Subaru Challenge in Jacksonville and I think they might agree after running my car.

Shawn

sajohnson · 10-14-2002, 04:07 AM

The grounding mod worked for me.

I agree with CirrusWRX though--just use appropriate wire (I used 12 guage with THHN insulation), proper size ring terminals, and some conductive/anti-corrosive paste. There is no need for a "kit".

I also cleaned up the stock grounding points at the same time. I found at least one that had the terminal positioned over painted sheet metal.

shirokuma · 10-14-2002, 06:49 AM

The Grounding "Mod" is junk or not depending on whether your car is grounded well or not.

Let's start with the simple fact that the car has a grounding wire system in place - it's attached to the manifold. Now, before the current WRX, or in Japan, before the Legacy Rev. D, there was roughly 1/4 the amount of wiring used in grounding the car's systems as there is now. Between the outbreak of the grounding mod in Japan and the current Subaru models, Subaru themselves decided to upgrade the wiring.

Because of this upgrade by the factory, the results of the grounding modification on a new Subaru are minor in comparison of the grounding on older Subaru's. There's 3 different revisions of Legacy B4 twin turbo's that we've got on hand, and the results of the mod between the A and B revision compared to the D revision vary wildly. It has a large effect on the A and B revision models, very little on the D (no C available for testing).

If the grounding modification *does* have a large effect, it's because the factory system isn't doing it's job, and that can be from a variety of causes - old age is always a major factor. A poor connection at one point in the system may or may not effect things. The grounding mod will help this point, but you could probably do away with the grounding mod by simply cleaning up all your current grounding connections and making sure they are properly tightened down. Of course, there's a lot of wires under there..

The reason it's could be snake oil for some people is simple - it is, for their cars. It's not a 100% guaranteed-to-work modification, since it's simply helping an already present system that may actually be doing it's job, especially with the new WRX's and other Subaru's with their beefed-up factory systems.

And the point isn't that you are gaining something over any other stock WRX with this modification - if they are just fine from the factory, you are simply bringing your car up to within standard operating parameters.

OTOH, if you own a older GC8 WRX or STi, twin-turbo Legacy, Lancer Evolution and such, it may have major benefits mainly because of the age of these vehicles. Of course, the major benefit is to bring it up to spec output, but when you've got an older car, that's good enough!

Cheers,

Paul Hansen

T-WRX · 10-14-2002, 08:00 AM

Informative, logical, non-confrontational, and well written.

Nice post, Paul.

WRXtreme02 · 10-14-2002, 09:04 AM

Well, if this is snake oil, then explain the difference in voltage? For some that say this mod was junk, was your car running fine before the mod? then what difference did you expect to feel? This is in no way a HP add mod.

Oh well

For some it will work, and some it won't....

Good luck to all...

Frank

DuoMaxwell · 10-14-2002, 09:41 AM

I own a 94 WRX GC8 you think it would be better to clean up the grounds or just do a build it yourself ground kit and redo it? I refuse to pay used $50 and new up to $120 do earth this thing. Just wondering I have heard it works and it doesnt work so much my head spins. From what I gather I should just wire brush the grounds and put some anticorrosive chemical on the terminals.

DuoMaxwell · 10-14-2002, 10:09 AM

I will have to check it out man when I can catch you around.

old_duwel · 10-14-2002, 10:11 AM

my grounding wire kit cost me $10

Jumper Cables
Electrical wiring kit

CirrusWRX · 10-14-2002, 12:58 PM

shirokuma - EXCELLENT post! That is probably the one that best sums up what I have read.

Unless you take the time (like some people have ACTUALLY DONE on this forum) and your little volt meter and SEE what state your current grounds are, and THEN try the grounding mod, and SEE if there is a difference, doing this is going to be a subjective thing. If it works for you, by golly, DO IT! Let's put it this way, buy the cheap wires and connectors, get them in cool colors, so at least it dresses up the engine bay a little bit, and it most CERTAINLY can't hurt anything - doesn't weigh enough to be a concern, won't "cause problems" with other things, is easy to do, etc...

Like I said, just DO NOT spend the money on those $80+ earthing kits - THAT would be dumb!!

shadowcat · 10-14-2002, 01:08 PM

okay, I nominate shirokuma's post to be a sticky. It was VERY well written, informative, non-judgemental, un-opinionated, and more useful than some of the other "grounding mod" posts that have littered this board.

shadowcat

shirokuma · 10-14-2002, 10:17 PM

Thanks everybody. I always feel a certain responsibility to post on this. I and the rest of the apexjapan.com crew didn't discover this modification - the Legacy B4 club in Japan did - but we may have inadvertantly been the ones to first promote it to i-club.

We've spent a lot of time researching it, at least in our own humble and not terribly proficient way. Club Legacy magazine in Japan covered it extensively and I've used their information as a base to do our own hands-on experimentation.

We think we've narrowed down the start to this all, also. It looks like an audiophile discovered the side effects of grounding when he or she was upgrading the wiring and grounding on their audio system in their Legacy B4. When the B4 came out, one of the most noteworthy features (besides the twin-turbo, of course

) was a $500 MacIntosh audio system option - a very decent setup, specially done from the factory with extra sound deadening for even better effect. When it came out, quite a few audiophiles jumped on that, and then decided to clean up the sounds system even more. The rest, as they say, is history.

But that was on the early revisions of the Legacy, and since either the C or D revision, Subaru beefed up the grounding on their own (well, there was some input from outside sources that got them to look into it). We noticed when we first test drove the GD-series "New Age" STi that they had upgraded the grounding on that vehicle. I haven't seen an American GD WRX turbo personally, but I've got more than a strong notion that it has the upgraded wiring also, given the time of it's introduction, and since nobody has complained about a real lumpy idle (A and B revision Legacy B4 has the most lumpy idle pre-wiring mod).

Cheers,

Paul Hansen

CirrusWRX · 10-15-2002, 12:16 AM

Bump - push for adding shirokuma's post to the FAQ!!!

GravelRash · 10-15-2002, 01:30 AM

I agree that Paul's synopsis is excellent. A friend whose a EE (and long time car nut, and audiophile) had a couple of things to say when I asked him about it...
a - Proper grounding is one of the easiest things to lose track of or overlook in electrical design

b - The mod my "work" even if there's no visible or easily measurable difference, e.g., the voltage diff mentioned above.
c - The 2 ground points at the front corners of the WRX intake manifold are cases in point: the driver's side grounds the individual spark plug coils; the passenger side grounds the shielding for several of the engine sensors (I forget which; it's easily tracked through the factory wiring manual.)

If the coils aren't sufficiently grounded you can obviously get erratic or weak spark. If the sensor shielding isn't properly grounded you could get a variety of subtle effects, depeding on the amount of interference available and its characterisitics Unless you were looking at these specific points, with the right instrumentation, you'd never "see" the beneficial effect.

d - Don't daisy chain the added grounds. E.g., don't run a new wire from the passenger side manifold ground to the driver's side, and then tie that to the body ground by the battery. Run individual wires from each of the manifold grounds to the body ground.

e - Another thread on this topic mentioned that someone has measured a lot of noise being fed back into the ground system from the alternator. While this might not make it out of the engine system enough to affect audio, it could easily affect such sensitive areas as the shielding mentioned above.

Grounding the case of the alternator is easy, and certainly won't hurt. (I took out one of the long case bolts and put a ring terminal under the head of it.)

f - Regular #10 automotive primary wire should be entirely sufficient...and it's readily available and relatively cheap.

I soldered all my terminals after crimping them (and added solder to the factory ground lugs also), and used a dielectric paste (Loctite) also from the auto parts store.

As many have noted, this is probably a situation for which the "ymmv" phrase was invented

SPeeDSiN · 10-15-2002, 01:44 AM

Why ground the struts?
I think I am going to do the grounding mod tomorrow (sp) but I am definately not going to ground the struts!

sajohnson · 10-15-2002, 03:48 AM

Excellent post. Your friend sounds like he knows his stuff.

ScreaminFast · 10-15-2002, 10:19 AM

GravelRash-

Nice post.....I too am a EE and I agree with everything he said there. I am just confused as to what do ground again? Should separate wires be run from the neg. terminal of the battery to various places around the engine bay?

10-14-2002, 09:41 AM	#15
DuoMaxwell Scooby Specialist Member#: 24565 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Misawa Japan Vehicle: 1994 WRX 2.2L EJ20G Black	Grounding???? I own a 94 WRX GC8 you think it would be better to clean up the grounds or just do a build it yourself ground kit and redo it? I refuse to pay used $50 and new up to $120 do earth this thing. Just wondering I have heard it works and it doesnt work so much my head spins. From what I gather I should just wire brush the grounds and put some anticorrosive chemical on the terminals.

10-14-2002, 10:09 AM	#16
DuoMaxwell Scooby Specialist Member#: 24565 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Misawa Japan Vehicle: 1994 WRX 2.2L EJ20G Black	On the look out. I will have to check it out man when I can catch you around.

10-15-2002, 03:48 AM	#24
sajohnson Scooby Specialist Member#: 6140 Join Date: Apr 2001 Chapter/Region: MAIC Location: Middletown, MD, USA Vehicle: 2002 WRX 5MT Sedan WR Blue. Cobb Stage 2	GravelRash Excellent post. Your friend sounds like he knows his stuff.

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10-13-2002, 04:13 PM	#1
WRXtreme02 Scooby Specialist Member#: 12680 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL Vehicle: 2006 VW GLI APR Stg2	Grounding mod actually works Well, I only was able to ground 2 points, the strut tower and the point on the manifold, didn’t have enough wire to do the others. But just from that I noticed a huge difference. Before the mod, I was getting hesitation between 2,000 and 3,000 RPMs, now it’s almost completely smoothed out. And on my voltmeter, it’s staying constant at 13.7-13.9 volts. Where before it would drop to like 13.1-13.3 volts. And now with the lights and AC on, it stays around 13.5 volts, where before the mod it would drop down to like 12.8. So yes, this does work, and would recommend it to all. The Subaru grounding system really blows.

10-13-2002, 04:22 PM	#2
WRXVII Scooby Specialist Member#: 15854 Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Upstate NY Vehicle: 2002 WRX VF34'd...	It will last for about two weeks then go back to normal.....

10-13-2002, 04:32 PM	#3
lil'redwagon Scooby Specialist Member#: 10854 Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Silverlake, CA. Vehicle: 2002 WRX Sedan still lil' and red	really? what have you experienced?

10-13-2002, 07:52 PM	#4
CirrusWRX Scooby Guru Member#: 17439 Join Date: Apr 2002 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: NYC Vehicle: 2002 x2 Silver WRX Sedan, White WRX Wagon	hahah - ECU reset, perhaps? Dunno, but that's probably what WRXVII is alluding to. Somebody did a REAL test once tho, w/o an ECU reset, and claims it worked for them too. I'd say from my reading it's about 50/50 -- some people are thrilled, others believe it's snake oil.

10-14-2002, 02:21 AM	#7
bamfwrx Scooby Newbie Member#: 23498 Join Date: Aug 2002 Chapter/Region: South East Location: playing in traffic Vehicle: my02 GDB clone 95 escort rally car	snake oil at least you didn't buy one of those kits i had a hard time beliving that this would work but some thread convinced me to try it( i allready had all the wire and ends) but all i did was add a little extra weight

10-14-2002, 03:24 AM	#8
KIMUTAKU Scooby Specialist Member#: 19776 Join Date: Jun 2002 Chapter/Region: VIC Location: Vancouver, Canada Vehicle: 2002 GDA Stage3 AW Ninja Lime Green	really? i heard this was a pretty good mod... i was thinking about buying the splitfire grounding thingy or some other brands... damnit...now i have to think it over...

10-14-2002, 03:39 AM	#9
CirrusWRX Scooby Guru Member#: 17439 Join Date: Apr 2002 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: NYC Vehicle: 2002 x2 Silver WRX Sedan, White WRX Wagon	Well, whatever you do, I would think a safe statement would be: DO NOT SPEND A LOT OF MONEY ON THIS!!!! It's not necessary to purchase an $80.00 "earthing" kit -- go buy some decent wire and connectors for $10.00 and it'll be just as good!! Those kits are ridiculously priced (in my opinion) in an attempt to take advantage of people who don't know any better!!

10-14-2002, 04:04 AM	#10
DiMensionX Scooby Newbie Member#: 23517 Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Atlanta, GA (Alpharetta) Vehicle: 2002 WRX Silver	I can officially say this grounding mod stuff is JUNK. It is the Unichip closed/open loop transition you are feeling. I pulled the Unichip, popped in the UTEC, and it's as smooth as silk. Ask anyone at the Subaru Challenge in Jacksonville and I think they might agree after running my car. Shawn

10-14-2002, 04:07 AM	#11
sajohnson Scooby Specialist Member#: 6140 Join Date: Apr 2001 Chapter/Region: MAIC Location: Middletown, MD, USA Vehicle: 2002 WRX 5MT Sedan WR Blue. Cobb Stage 2	The grounding mod worked for me. I agree with CirrusWRX though--just use appropriate wire (I used 12 guage with THHN insulation), proper size ring terminals, and some conductive/anti-corrosive paste. There is no need for a "kit". I also cleaned up the stock grounding points at the same time. I found at least one that had the terminal positioned over painted sheet metal.

10-14-2002, 06:49 AM	#12
shirokuma Scooby Specialist Member#: 5489 Join Date: Apr 2001 Chapter/Region: NWIC Location: The Empire of Seattle Vehicle: 1995 Eurotrash 4.0 Oxfordgrud	The Grounding "Mod" is junk or not depending on whether your car is grounded well or not. Let's start with the simple fact that the car has a grounding wire system in place - it's attached to the manifold. Now, before the current WRX, or in Japan, before the Legacy Rev. D, there was roughly 1/4 the amount of wiring used in grounding the car's systems as there is now. Between the outbreak of the grounding mod in Japan and the current Subaru models, Subaru themselves decided to upgrade the wiring. Because of this upgrade by the factory, the results of the grounding modification on a new Subaru are minor in comparison of the grounding on older Subaru's. There's 3 different revisions of Legacy B4 twin turbo's that we've got on hand, and the results of the mod between the A and B revision compared to the D revision vary wildly. It has a large effect on the A and B revision models, very little on the D (no C available for testing). If the grounding modification does have a large effect, it's because the factory system isn't doing it's job, and that can be from a variety of causes - old age is always a major factor. A poor connection at one point in the system may or may not effect things. The grounding mod will help this point, but you could probably do away with the grounding mod by simply cleaning up all your current grounding connections and making sure they are properly tightened down. Of course, there's a lot of wires under there.. The reason it's could be snake oil for some people is simple - it is, for their cars. It's not a 100% guaranteed-to-work modification, since it's simply helping an already present system that may actually be doing it's job, especially with the new WRX's and other Subaru's with their beefed-up factory systems. And the point isn't that you are gaining something over any other stock WRX with this modification - if they are just fine from the factory, you are simply bringing your car up to within standard operating parameters. OTOH, if you own a older GC8 WRX or STi, twin-turbo Legacy, Lancer Evolution and such, it may have major benefits mainly because of the age of these vehicles. Of course, the major benefit is to bring it up to spec output, but when you've got an older car, that's good enough! Cheers, Paul Hansen

10-14-2002, 08:00 AM	#13
T-WRX Scooby Guru Member#: 2468 Join Date: Sep 2000 Chapter/Region: South East Location: Jacksonville, FL JMS#15 Vehicle: 05 STi Aspen White 08 OBXT Satin Pearl White	Informative, logical, non-confrontational, and well written. Nice post, Paul.

10-14-2002, 09:04 AM	#14
WRXtreme02 Scooby Specialist Member#: 12680 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL Vehicle: 2006 VW GLI APR Stg2	Well, if this is snake oil, then explain the difference in voltage? For some that say this mod was junk, was your car running fine before the mod? then what difference did you expect to feel? This is in no way a HP add mod. Oh well For some it will work, and some it won't.... Good luck to all... Frank

10-14-2002, 12:58 PM	#18
CirrusWRX Scooby Guru Member#: 17439 Join Date: Apr 2002 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: NYC Vehicle: 2002 x2 Silver WRX Sedan, White WRX Wagon	shirokuma - EXCELLENT post! That is probably the one that best sums up what I have read. Unless you take the time (like some people have ACTUALLY DONE on this forum) and your little volt meter and SEE what state your current grounds are, and THEN try the grounding mod, and SEE if there is a difference, doing this is going to be a subjective thing. If it works for you, by golly, DO IT! Let's put it this way, buy the cheap wires and connectors, get them in cool colors, so at least it dresses up the engine bay a little bit, and it most CERTAINLY can't hurt anything - doesn't weigh enough to be a concern, won't "cause problems" with other things, is easy to do, etc... Like I said, just DO NOT spend the money on those $80+ earthing kits - THAT would be dumb!!

10-14-2002, 01:08 PM	#19
shadowcat Scooby Newbie Member#: 14176 Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bay Area Vehicle: 2002 WRX bugeye! Midnight Black Pearl	okay, I nominate shirokuma's post to be a sticky. It was VERY well written, informative, non-judgemental, un-opinionated, and more useful than some of the other "grounding mod" posts that have littered this board. shadowcat

10-14-2002, 10:17 PM	#20
shirokuma Scooby Specialist Member#: 5489 Join Date: Apr 2001 Chapter/Region: NWIC Location: The Empire of Seattle Vehicle: 1995 Eurotrash 4.0 Oxfordgrud	Thanks everybody. I always feel a certain responsibility to post on this. I and the rest of the apexjapan.com crew didn't discover this modification - the Legacy B4 club in Japan did - but we may have inadvertantly been the ones to first promote it to i-club. We've spent a lot of time researching it, at least in our own humble and not terribly proficient way. Club Legacy magazine in Japan covered it extensively and I've used their information as a base to do our own hands-on experimentation. We think we've narrowed down the start to this all, also. It looks like an audiophile discovered the side effects of grounding when he or she was upgrading the wiring and grounding on their audio system in their Legacy B4. When the B4 came out, one of the most noteworthy features (besides the twin-turbo, of course ) was a $500 MacIntosh audio system option - a very decent setup, specially done from the factory with extra sound deadening for even better effect. When it came out, quite a few audiophiles jumped on that, and then decided to clean up the sounds system even more. The rest, as they say, is history. But that was on the early revisions of the Legacy, and since either the C or D revision, Subaru beefed up the grounding on their own (well, there was some input from outside sources that got them to look into it). We noticed when we first test drove the GD-series "New Age" STi that they had upgraded the grounding on that vehicle. I haven't seen an American GD WRX turbo personally, but I've got more than a strong notion that it has the upgraded wiring also, given the time of it's introduction, and since nobody has complained about a real lumpy idle (A and B revision Legacy B4 has the most lumpy idle pre-wiring mod). Cheers, Paul Hansen

10-15-2002, 12:16 AM	#21
CirrusWRX Scooby Guru Member#: 17439 Join Date: Apr 2002 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: NYC Vehicle: 2002 x2 Silver WRX Sedan, White WRX Wagon	Bump - push for adding shirokuma's post to the FAQ!!!

10-15-2002, 01:30 AM	#22
GravelRash Scooby Specialist Member#: 16318 Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Kenmore, WA Vehicle: 2002 WRX wagon Grime over Sedona Red	I agree that Paul's synopsis is excellent. A friend whose a EE (and long time car nut, and audiophile) had a couple of things to say when I asked him about it... a - Proper grounding is one of the easiest things to lose track of or overlook in electrical design b - The mod my "work" even if there's no visible or easily measurable difference, e.g., the voltage diff mentioned above. c - The 2 ground points at the front corners of the WRX intake manifold are cases in point: the driver's side grounds the individual spark plug coils; the passenger side grounds the shielding for several of the engine sensors (I forget which; it's easily tracked through the factory wiring manual.) If the coils aren't sufficiently grounded you can obviously get erratic or weak spark. If the sensor shielding isn't properly grounded you could get a variety of subtle effects, depeding on the amount of interference available and its characterisitics Unless you were looking at these specific points, with the right instrumentation, you'd never "see" the beneficial effect. d - Don't daisy chain the added grounds. E.g., don't run a new wire from the passenger side manifold ground to the driver's side, and then tie that to the body ground by the battery. Run individual wires from each of the manifold grounds to the body ground. e - Another thread on this topic mentioned that someone has measured a lot of noise being fed back into the ground system from the alternator. While this might not make it out of the engine system enough to affect audio, it could easily affect such sensitive areas as the shielding mentioned above. Grounding the case of the alternator is easy, and certainly won't hurt. (I took out one of the long case bolts and put a ring terminal under the head of it.) f - Regular #10 automotive primary wire should be entirely sufficient...and it's readily available and relatively cheap. I soldered all my terminals after crimping them (and added solder to the factory ground lugs also), and used a dielectric paste (Loctite) also from the auto parts store. As many have noted, this is probably a situation for which the "ymmv" phrase was invented

10-15-2002, 01:44 AM	#23
SPeeDSiN Scooby Specialist Member#: 4667 Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Asheville, NC Vehicle: 2002 WRX Black (well kinda)	Why ground the struts? I think I am going to do the grounding mod tomorrow (sp) but I am definately not going to ground the struts!

10-15-2002, 10:19 AM	#25
ScreaminFast Scooby Specialist Member#: 24399 Join Date: Sep 2002 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: Webster, NY Vehicle: 2003 A. White WRX 2006 Yamaha "Raven" R6	GravelRash- Nice post.....I too am a EE and I agree with everything he said there. I am just confused as to what do ground again? Should separate wires be run from the neg. terminal of the battery to various places around the engine bay?