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Old 03-27-2001, 01:22 PM   #1
spshultz
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Member#: 1415
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Anytown, USA
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2005 OBS 3.0R
'12 SantaFe

Question Second Creek questions

Does anyone know if Second Creek offers something like an "open to the public" day, where anyone with the desire and a helmet can race? What kind of safety equip do they require?

I could try auto-x'ing but I have a huge fear of running over every last cone. I was at only one event and it seemed very confusing as to which way you need to go around the cones.
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Old 03-27-2001, 01:26 PM   #2
bratmantlz
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Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: colorado springs colorado usa
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88 626 Turbo
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Smile

if they do have a open track day we should do a meet of somekind to have a bunch of subarus testing and tuning our cars! price would be a factor too. there is talk of getting to pmi for a tune and test day, on another board i am on.
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Old 03-27-2001, 01:29 PM   #3
Strepto
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Last season Wed. afternoons were open "test and tune" days. You are responsible for your own equipment!
As for being scared of hit ever single cone...on the track I'd be more affraid of hitting the tirewall or going off and snapping a suspension component.
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Old 03-27-2001, 02:02 PM   #4
El Kabong
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I'm with Ro, you have far more to fear on the track. And without a cage, you're toast if you roll that car...

Autocross is much more helpful for real world situations. So tuning your car at Second Creek will make your car good for Second Creek... having a car setup for the demands of autocrossing will make your car a better daily driver and you a better driver for daily situations.
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Old 03-27-2001, 07:04 PM   #5
JJTheSubeDriver
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Second Creek is open MON-SAT, weather permitting and as long as there isn't a race for test and tune. I wouldn't worry too much, just don't drive the car 10/10ths or over and you should be fine. It's alot of fun, but you have to be at least a SCCA member to run. It is like 60.00 for half a day (aprox 40-60 laps with 20 minute run- 20 minute rest pace.)

JJ


[This message has been edited by JJTheSubeDriver (edited March 27, 2001).]
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Old 03-28-2001, 07:19 AM   #6
Mike Jerry
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As per usual I will take this opportunity to counterpoint Eric's typically narrow view...

He makes the broad-brushed statement that tuning one's car for Second Creek only makes your car good for Second Creek. This is akin to stating that tuning your car for autox is only makes your car good for parking lots full of cones. Total rubbish.

Tuning your car and honing your skills for high-speed manuvering will make you and your car good for any such manuvering in the real world. Apparently Eric does not envision needing to make any sort of emergency manuver at freeway speeds. Which leads to my next point:

He also makes that statement that 'having a car setup for the demands of autocrossing will make your car a better daily driver and you a better driver for daily situations'. This is merely partial rubbish, unless you never drive more than 45-50 mph.

Unless you also include ProSolo (something that has not been mentioned to this point) in your autox season, you will have absolutely no idea how your car will perform or what its limits are at speeds greater than those acheived on the dinky, slow autox courses. And believe me, there is a big difference in auto dynamics between 50 mph and 70 or 80 or more.

If you want to be a true master of your automotive domain, you need to do BOTH. You should at least try both. Eric has tried both and has loved both the autox and the track (and although I have never seen him on the track I know for a fact that he is a very talented autox pilot). I have tried both and hated autox - and unfortunately (to my own detriment) have avoided autox since. I was an absolutely horrid autox driver, yet I am fairly competent on the track. This is what I mean about trying both. They are way different, and both very instructive in their own arenas.

The fact that I was really bad at autox means that that is where I should be spending most of my time. If I wasn't selling the RS Turbo I would be forcing myself to do just that.

So what is the moral of this endless diatribe, Mr. Shultz? Mostly to take a jab at Eric , but perhaps just a little, to point out that you should adobt a more even approach to your driving education than I have (or Eric's above message indicates that he has).

[Flame suit on]
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Old 03-28-2001, 08:10 AM   #7
El Kabong
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Hey!! I got Mike to post!! errr... I guess that's a good thing... wait-a-minute...

Yeah Mike, I agree with most of your points. There is quite a bit of tuning to be done that is useful on the track. But when are you ever cruising down the highway, KNOWING the next turn is coming up with no surface problems, no traffic, perfect line of sight, etc...

I'd guess that 90% of accidents happen at less than highway speeds... therefor my conclusion that auto-x is better for honing real world driving skills still holds true.

Actually, if you would have come out to the Bandimere event, they had a ridiculous "autocross" course, which involved nearly a 1/8 mile straight... I think Larry said he hit 70mph... So speed can no longer be an argument...

The other point I was trying to make before I was so rudely interrupted is that a race track uses a certain power band. There is no launch, there are totally different traction parameters that need to be dealt with. Braking skills are completely different.

So IF you had to choose one to increase your knowledge of your car on the street, and your driving skill, autocross would be best. Would you be missing out, sure. I learned a ton from running around Second Creek.

What I really think you all should do is sell your cars and spend some time on a motorcycle. You'll get a new appreciation for the term "paying attention". Every crack in the road, every patch of gravel, every dunce trying to turn left across your lane...
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Old 03-28-2001, 08:21 AM   #8
bratmantlz
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Thumbs up

yeah sportbikes rock!! fixin mine roads tell you more on a bike than a car.
Brian
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Old 03-29-2001, 12:25 AM   #9
Mike Jerry
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When I have spent 4 or 5 hours at Second Creek in the car I am exhausted from the mental effort required to concentrate intently on the course and all the constantly-changing inputs you receive from the car. I can't even imagine being on a bike for that long.

My head hurts just thinking about it.
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