Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Sunday December 28, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Subaru Models > Legacy Forum

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-20-2002, 10:26 PM   #1
joemamad
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 27269
Join Date: Oct 2002
Angry DOHC 2.5 head gaskets!!!!!!!

Hate to reopen this can-o-worms

O.K. Ive got a '97 outback wagon with the infamous "phase one" block. This is my second engine in said car. My problems first stated a year ago when I replaced the clutch. We (My mechanic and I) pulled the engine to replace the clutch, it was an easy job, but ont the way home after about an hour it overheated. For the next month it would puke coolant and overheat regularly. Finally I went to a motor shop and bought a replacement. We put this motor in, also a "phase one". SHe ran fine until I needed to relace the front main seal (again!). Well on the way home overheating problem again. Now I drive this thing and it overheats all of the time. The problem comes and goes, I can drive it on the highway and the needle is all over the place. It gets hot when I stop, but if I get the RPMs up it will cool (I believe this is due to low coolant level and that the coolant gets pushed through the engine when the pump is pumping faster). Of course I called the dealer's mechanic and he says "I have'nt noticed a trend here" but after reading this forum it think it's B.S.

I'm hopeing this is only a head gasket problem, for I'll be pulling this engine for the third time. We'll be replaceing the head gaskets this time and we'll see. I've been dealing with this problem for months now and have become familiar with this behavior. I can drive around town with no problems,but drive for maor than 30 mins the problem happens. Almost every time the heat rises, it recedes but coolant pukes and the heat fluctuations only get worse.

I'm at the end of my rope. These engines run great when the work right. I only hope I can rectify these problems. Pretty soon I'll be a good Subaru mechanic!

If anyone has had expierence with these problems and wishes to reply I'd love to hear them. I've read through the legacy forum and the posts (HIHO I know you're out there) if anybody new has anything to add please do.

Joe in PA
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
joemamad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2002, 11:21 PM   #2
HIHO
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 7624
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Hopefully on a nice single track.
Vehicle:
BD5; family sedan
that just wooped your ass

Default

Yeah I'm here.

Sorry to hear about your problems. It sounds like the headgasket problem to me. I can't say for sure because I have never experienced the problem first hand. I now have 70,439 miles on my MY97 and it runs like a top. I am waiting for the problem to arise at any time. From what I have learned is the headgaskets going is often a sign of other problems. The water pump could be going out etc. For some reason the gasket is getting to hot and causing problems. But Subaru did redesign the gasket for a reason. When you do replace the gaskets I would replace the water pump at the same time. Also make sure you get the NEW gasket.
Good luck
HIHO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2002, 11:42 PM   #3
Patrick Olsen
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 120
Join Date: Jul 1999
Chapter/Region: AKIC
Location: Where the Navy sends me...
Vehicle:
1997 Legacy 2.5GT
QuickSilver Metallic

Default

It does sound like the classic head gasket problems. Check out this thread over in the Normally Aspirated Forum http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...ht=part+number - it has the new part numbers you need. My initial post is a bit out of date - scroll down until you see the picutres and that's where it talks about the new part number and my positive experience with them.

Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
Patrick Olsen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2002, 02:44 AM   #4
Subietonic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 12588
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Down by the sea
Vehicle:
Four Count 'em
GF5,BDA,BD5, BP5

Default

Sorry to hear about your engine problems. Agree with the presenting symptoms and your initial diagnosis that it's an unhealthy head gasket. In all of your swapping engines in/out, did you replace your thermostat? Could be sticking and causing the overheating. Also, don't know how many miles you have on which engine but did you also change out the water pump? And there is a specific process for draining and refilling the coolant. I can't recall the details but I'm sure someone on here knows where to find them. It's just that if you don't refill these engines correctly, you run the risk of trapping air someplace(s) in the water jacket which will lead to hot spots and coolant overflow (i.e., puking on you). Good luck with the HG replacement.

BTW - how long is it taking you to get the engine in and out of your Legacy?

Br, Dale
Subietonic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2002, 02:45 AM   #5
Jason
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 105
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Fremont, CA 94538
Vehicle:
2000 Legacy GT Ltd
WHT

Default

What kind of coolant you are using?? I hope it's not those red stuff GM uses.

Those long life stuff could react with the regular green coolant and form nasty tar that could block your coolant passage.

At highway speed, the water pump is not working as hard as it would on local street, thus the engine only overheats on highway instead of local.

I made this mistake on my 2K GT and 3~4 good flush of coolant took care the problem. Of course, it could be the famous gasket problem as well.
Jason is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2002, 09:23 PM   #6
joemamad
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 27269
Join Date: Oct 2002
Default Cooling system work

I have replaced the water pump, and tried about three different new themostats, the did not work. When I refill the radiator I do fill the upper hose first, then reattach and fill as normal (heat on, Bleeder open, etc.). It takes me about an hour and a half to get the motor on the shop floor, alittle mor to get it back in. Filled up the radiator again tonight after decending a long hill in town she heated up and wouldn't cool down. Always on that same hill... Will keep posted on re-build.

On a lighter note I constructed an adapter to fit a K&N extereme flow air filter on to her. I removed the air box and fabbed a plte to attach onto the MAF. The filter is one of those open-air jobs, 4"round filter. It made a noticeable in the low end and maybe some at the high end too. The red-line on these cars is so easy to bunce off of. These motors wind up niccely.

Maybe during this re-build I'll do cam-shafts, if I can find some trick ones.

Later!
joemamad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2002, 04:18 AM   #7
Subietonic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 12588
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Down by the sea
Vehicle:
Four Count 'em
GF5,BDA,BD5, BP5

Default Seems to be a coolant circulation problem

Just a thought, but the fact that you are getting an overheat condition while driving downhill makes me think that you do possibly have an air trap in the system somewhere and that condition gets exaggerated by the incline/decline of the engine block relative to horizontal. Your refill procedure sounds correct but I seem to recall something else about "inclining" the block (i.e., front up on ramps/jacked up in front) too. Does anyone else recall that part of the process or have the specific steps to take when draining, flushing, refilling the coolant system?

Br, Dale
Subietonic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2002, 10:46 AM   #8
MekoNY
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 8000
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: NY
Vehicle:
2005 Accord
Graphite

Default Not just the 97's......the 00's too.

My car has been at the dealership for 3 1/2 weeks now for an overheating problem. Before I brought it in, my car would overheat after idling for more than 5 minutes. For some reason the friggin cooling fans WERE NOT coming ON, so the engine would start to overheat according to the temp gauge. But if I turned ON the A/C, the fans would kick ON and drop the temp. gauge. So after flushing the coolant and changing the thermostat at the dealership, the problem persisted. This time, however, my car would NOT start.
So they asked me to leave the car and for 1 whole week none of the techs could get the car to start. So the ECT sensor was replaced, same problem. Finally they called in SOA and they said the harness running to the engine had been damaged by leaking coolant and supposedly that was the culprit. SO now this past weekend I stopped by and they said the head gasket needed to be replaced as a preventative measure and that's where it stands for now. I won't know anything definitive until tomorrow.
Can you guys believe that??? I really hope all my problems are addressed. After losing a tranny at 36,000 miles and now a head gasket at 63,000 miles, my faith in Subaru is completely gone. Not to mention everything else that went wrong (Thermo twice, rotors twice, ECT sensor, A/C condenser, headliner, hood re-paint) in the past 2 years The worst part is that I have to hear it from my brother and his 7 yr old Honda with original everything!!!
Thank god for the loaner from Subaru, otherwise I would be completely ape $hit right now. BTW-they're also going to cover all parts under warranty even though it's expired. SOA customer service rocks, I wish their cars did too.
MekoNY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2002, 11:17 AM   #9
HIHO
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 7624
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Hopefully on a nice single track.
Vehicle:
BD5; family sedan
that just wooped your ass

Default

MekoNY- I am glad to hear that SOA is taking care of you.

All car companies make a "BAD" car every once and a while. Ask my sister about her experiance with Honda. She was just unlucky and got a lemon. But both car companies are high up on the reliability scale. I love my Subaru.
HIHO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2002, 07:04 PM   #10
MekoNY
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 8000
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: NY
Vehicle:
2005 Accord
Graphite

Default Re: Not just the 97's......the 00's too.

Quote:
Originally posted by MekoNY
My car has been at the dealership for 3 1/2 weeks now for an overheating problem. Before I brought it in, my car would overheat after idling for more than 5 minutes. For some reason the friggin cooling fans WERE NOT coming ON, so the engine would start to overheat according to the temp gauge. But if I turned ON the A/C, the fans would kick ON and drop the temp. gauge. So after flushing the coolant and changing the thermostat at the dealership, the problem persisted. This time, however, my car would NOT start.
So they asked me to leave the car and for 1 whole week none of the techs could get the car to start. So the ECT sensor was replaced, same problem. Finally they called in SOA and they said the harness running to the engine had been damaged by leaking coolant and supposedly that was the culprit. SO now this past weekend I stopped by and they said the head gasket needed to be replaced as a preventative measure and that's where it stands for now. I won't know anything definitive until tomorrow.
Can you guys believe that??? I really hope all my problems are addressed. After losing a tranny at 36,000 miles and now a head gasket at 63,000 miles, my faith in Subaru is completely gone. Not to mention everything else that went wrong (Thermo twice, rotors twice, ECT sensor, A/C condenser, headliner, hood re-paint) in the past 2 years The worst part is that I have to hear it from my brother and his 7 yr old Honda with original everything!!!
Thank god for the loaner from Subaru, otherwise I would be completely ape $hit right now. BTW-they're also going to cover all parts under warranty even though it's expired. SOA customer service rocks, I wish their cars did too.
Update:
Removed gasket and saw that the head was cracked too!!!
Both on order.....the saga continues.
MekoNY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2002, 03:50 AM   #11
Subietonic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 12588
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Down by the sea
Vehicle:
Four Count 'em
GF5,BDA,BD5, BP5

Default

Dayam Meko! I'd let them fix it and find a way to part with that one quick, unless you have the 100K, $0 deductible warranty on it amd can afford to "wait" it out. Not putting down your ride, but a new tranny and a new head and gasket on a PHII, SOHC block (plus all that other stuff too) all within warranty? Sounds like a lemon to me. Incidently, are you the original owner? I could not imagine buying a new car and within a short amount of time, have it at the dealer for all those repairs. You've got the patience of Job my friend. Thankfully SOA is stepping up to the plate on this one. Good luck!!!!!


Joemamad - any word on your 97? Have you pulled the motor and figured out what is wrong with your's?

Br, Dale
Subietonic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2002, 03:57 AM   #12
Subietonic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 12588
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Down by the sea
Vehicle:
Four Count 'em
GF5,BDA,BD5, BP5

Default

Dayam! I'd let them fix it and find a way to part with that one quick, unless you have the 100K, $0 deductible warranty on it amd can afford to "wait" it out. Not putting down your ride, but a new tranny and a new head and gasket (plus all that other stuff too) all within warranty? Sounds like a lemon to me. Incidently, are you the original owner? I could not imagine buying a new car and within a short amount of time, have it at the dealer for all those repairs. You've got the patience of Job my friend. Thankfully SOA is stepping up to the plate on this one. Good luck!!!!!

Br, Dale
Subietonic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2002, 10:00 AM   #13
MekoNY
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 8000
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: NY
Vehicle:
2005 Accord
Graphite

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Subietonic
Dayam Meko! I'd let them fix it and find a way to part with that one quick, unless you have the 100K, $0 deductible warranty on it amd can afford to "wait" it out. Not putting down your ride, but a new tranny and a new head and gasket on a PHII, SOHC block (plus all that other stuff too) all within warranty? Sounds like a lemon to me. Incidently, are you the original owner? I could not imagine buying a new car and within a short amount of time, have it at the dealer for all those repairs. You've got the patience of Job my friend. Thankfully SOA is stepping up to the plate on this one. Good luck!!!!!


Joemamad - any word on your 97? Have you pulled the motor and figured out what is wrong with your's?

Br, Dale
Well I do think I got a lemon just cause everything that could go wrong HAS!!! I'm just crossing my fingers that I get my car back and it runs well enough to last me another year or so without any more major repairs. BTW-I am the original owner, got the car with 34 miles I beleive. That was back in Oct.99. I shoulda got the 99 Impreza leftover from that year. Brand new white 2.5RS.
Sometimes you can't predict these things.
MekoNY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2002, 06:36 PM   #14
Subietonic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 12588
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Down by the sea
Vehicle:
Four Count 'em
GF5,BDA,BD5, BP5

Default

You might want to check with your state's attorney or with a lemon law attorney - I know the mileage is high but I'm sure you've had it in for "repair" or "inspection" for the same problem at least three times within a year while it's been under new car warranty. You may be eligible for a buyback. Take a look at this Lemon Law Site and particularly this NY Lemon Law Site in your case. It's never too late to make it right and get out of what really sounds like a first class PITA. This way, if they do buy it back, then the words "Lemon Law Repurchase" will always be on the title for future buyers to see. Good luck!

Br, Dale

BTW - I am not a law suit happy kind of person... it's just that in your case there appears to be a really great case for lemon law buyback/consideration.
Subietonic is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2.5 head gasket bc_1981 Normally Aspirated Powertrain 56 09-14-2007 10:56 AM
95' 2.2 w/ 98' DOHC 2.5 heads? downshift1 Normally Aspirated Powertrain 6 04-20-2007 12:54 PM
2.5 head gasket replacement in car dude6033 Service & Maintenance 0 02-14-2007 07:02 PM
pic of 2.5 head gasket on 2.2 head JoshP Normally Aspirated Powertrain 9 06-24-2006 02:26 AM
2.5 head gasket blown? scuby22b Normally Aspirated Powertrain 6 09-01-2005 03:44 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:03 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.