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Old 06-13-2014, 10:14 AM   #1
banyan
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News Ford Lowering Fuel Economy Estimates For 6 Vehicles

(Reuters) - Ford Motor Co (F.N) said on Thursday it was lowering the fuel economy ratings on six of its models, including a number of hybrids, and would reimburse owners for the difference.

The No. 2 U.S. automaker said the ratings would be cut on its 2013 and 2014 model year hybrid and plug-in hybrid vehicles as well as most 2014 Fiesta cars. It was the second time Ford cut fuel ratings for the C-Max hybrid in under a year.

"We apologize to our customers and will provide goodwill payments to affected owners," Ford CEO Alan Mulally said in a statement. "We also are taking steps to improve our processes and prevent issues like this from happening again."

The restatement of mileage estimates is nothing new in the auto industry.
Last August, Ford - which has touted its superior fuel efficiency in the past - cut the ratings for the C-Max hybrid by up to 7 miles per gallon following complaints from consumers and experts that the model's actual mileage fell short of claims.

In 2012, an investigation by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency showed that both Hyundai Motor Co (005380.KS) and its affiliate Kia Motors Corp (000270.KS) overstated fuel economy by at least a mile per gallon. The South Korean carmakers last December agreed to pay $395 million to settle lawsuits related to the matter.

"Ford isn't the first manufacturer to admit that it was optimistic in its EPA fuel economy ratings, and it might not be the last," said Jack R. Nerad, editorial director at Kelley Blue Book's KBB.com.
"The broad implications of this might spur EPA to be more restrictive in how its fuel economy rules and ratings are administered," he added. "This will gain attention in Congress as well."

In the latest case, Ford said it identified an error through internal testing and notified the U.S. environmental regulator. No adjustments on other vehicles are planned after review of the entire lineup, the company said.
The EPA said it conducted independent tests to confirm Ford's results and ordered the company to correct fuel economy labels on the cars within 15 days.

Ford estimated about 200,000 of the affected vehicles had been sold or leased in the United States, and affected owners would receive a "goodwill payment" of up to $1,050 for the estimated difference in fuel costs. Cars in dealer lots will be relabeled with new window stickers reflecting the corrected estimates.

Owners outside the country will be contacted by the automaker.
The largest change is for Ford's Lincoln MKZ hybrid, which saw its combined city and highway fuel economy value reduced by 7 miles per gallon. Other affected models include four versions of the Fiesta, the hybrid and Energi versions of the Fusion, and the C-Max hybrid and Energi.
Ford shares were off 2.3 percent at $16.51 in late New York trading.


http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...0EN2AK20140612
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Old 06-13-2014, 05:17 PM   #2
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I wonder if Toyota is planning to sue Ford for all of those ads claiming the C-Max gets better mileage than the Prius V. In truth, the C-Max is smaller and gets worse economy.

(even when MotorTrend tested them two years ago, the Prius V managed 38.7 mpg while their C-Max only managed 37.3 mpg).

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Old 06-16-2014, 11:09 AM   #3
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They should have done this a long time ago back when KIA/Hyundai was sued and lost. I think they are trying to get ahead of a media crapstorm like GM is going through right now. people in the hybrid community have known the ford numbers were overrated, and the toyota numbers are underrated.
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Old 06-16-2014, 01:28 PM   #4
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The Prius numbers are exactly what I experienced. Dunno why they would underrate the V...
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Old 06-16-2014, 02:20 PM   #5
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Ford has never gotten ear what they claim. Have found Ford mileage claims to be dookied up for many years now.I have always been suspicious that they used some tricks or fuel additives in testing. Just ask any ecoboost F150 owner.
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Old 06-16-2014, 02:54 PM   #6
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The Prius numbers are exactly what I experienced. Dunno why they would underrate the V...
My daily driver is a 2011 prius. I'm getting about 2-4mpg on average more than the stated 51/48. That's hand calculated at the pump. My best was 56mpg over 400 miles, but i actually had to drive conservatively to get that.
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Old 06-16-2014, 04:58 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by gggplaya View Post
My daily driver is a 2011 prius. I'm getting about 2-4mpg on average more than the stated 51/48. That's hand calculated at the pump. My best was 56mpg over 400 miles, but i actually had to drive conservatively to get that.
Please stay right in right lane. Thankyou
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Old 06-16-2014, 05:23 PM   #8
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Please stay right in right lane. Thankyou
My commute is mostly highway, it's an hour long. I typically do about 70-75mph the whole time, speed limit is 65mph. There are some people going faster than that, but usually i'm passing people.
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Old 06-16-2014, 05:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gggplaya View Post

My commute is mostly highway, it's an hour long. I typically do about 70-75mph the whole time, speed limit is 65mph. There are some people going faster than that, but usually i'm passing people.
No no, you're a Prius driver, so you obviously must always drive slow and impede traffic. While getting an abortion every Sunday after visiting the farmers market.
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Old 06-16-2014, 05:33 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Masterauto View Post
Ford has never gotten ear what they claim. Have found Ford mileage claims to be dookied up for many years now.I have always been suspicious that they used some tricks or fuel additives in testing. Just ask any ecoboost F150 owner.
I have gotten exactly what my car is rated as. 17/26 Its not hard to get crappy numbers though.
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Old 06-16-2014, 05:38 PM   #11
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Actually i'm not a libtard, i own firearms including an AR15, i'm pro life and a christian. I shop at a normal grocery store like everyone else. I also voted for Romney on the last election, our currently leader has no clue what's he's doing, nor does the next potential woman they want to rise to the throne.

The prius literally pays for iteself with the fuel i save. It was a smart economical investment because my subaru is paid off, i didn't want to put tons of miles on it(i normally drive upwards of 4 hours a day). So i bought a used prius, which ends up being only $80 per month after the fuel i save in comparison to the subaru which averages 25mpg on the same commute, which i have and still love as my winter and occasional weekend vehicle. I don't care about being green, but i can't ignore the dollar signs.

I literally was dead set on buying a used $3000-$5000 car outright, but when i crunched the numbers in an excel sheet and giving all vehicle an expected lifespan of 200,000-250,000 miles which is when i usually get rid of cars. I would have bought 2 of the cheaper $3000-$5000 cars in the time i own my 2011. The cheaper cars would always be crappy, they get worse fuel mileage so financially everything nearly evened out in a 6 year period. The cost difference was negligible in the end, so i went for the newer nicer car.
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Old 06-16-2014, 06:23 PM   #12
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My daily driver is a 2011 prius. I'm getting about 2-4mpg on average more than the stated 51/48. That's hand calculated at the pump. My best was 56mpg over 400 miles, but i actually had to drive conservatively to get that.
Do you mean 500 miles? I would get (this means ALL THE TIME) 450 miles on 9 gallons. Every fill up. Didn't matter how I drove. I also had an '11 III.
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Old 06-16-2014, 06:30 PM   #13
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Do you mean 500 miles? I would get (this means ALL THE TIME) 450 miles on 9 gallons. Every fill up. Didn't matter how I drove. I also had an '11 III.
No, I typically fill up at about 400-450 miles, I don't wait for low fuel to come on. This particular fill up was at about about 403 miles. What I meant was, the hand calculated average was calculated over 400 miles. Anyone can drive a car 5 miles very conservatively and get 80mpg. Its hard to do that over 400 miles in the real world. So the 56mpg average is more representative.
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Old 06-16-2014, 06:47 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by gggplaya View Post
Actually i'm not a libtard, i own firearms including an AR15, i'm pro life and a christian. I shop at a normal grocery store like everyone else. I also voted for Romney on the last election, our currently leader has no clue what's he's doing, nor does the next potential woman they want to rise to the throne.
How wonderfully revealing and irrelevant.
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Old 06-16-2014, 06:59 PM   #15
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Please stay right in right lane. Thankyou

Every prius I've ever seen was in the left lane doing 90 with an Obama sticker. Oh the ironing of that.

The Cmax is a massive steaming pile of crap. I hate dealing with those things at work.
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Old 06-16-2014, 07:01 PM   #16
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9 gallons would be the magic number. 450 miles on the trip. Could never seem to break that.
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Old 06-16-2014, 07:04 PM   #17
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I always choked up the real work difference to Ford's not being totally underpowered like Toyota prius, but I guess they had shenanigans too...
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Old 06-17-2014, 09:38 AM   #18
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How wonderfully revealing and irrelevant.
It was a response to Balatanz's comment on a stereotypical prius driver.
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Old 06-17-2014, 09:40 AM   #19
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I always choked up the real work difference to Ford's not being totally underpowered like Toyota prius, but I guess they had shenanigans too...
The 2010+ Prius moved up from a 1.5L gas engine up to a 1.8L gas engine. I wouldn't have bought one if it felt underpowered. It makes an equivalent 130hp, but given the 3000lbs curb weight, it's adequate power. Doesn't feel slow.
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Old 06-17-2014, 09:47 AM   #20
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9 gallons would be the magic number. 450 miles on the trip. Could never seem to break that.
It has an 11.9 gallon tank, you should be able to go past 500 miles no problem. The low fuel light just tends to come on with about 2.5 gallons left. The calibration on yours may be off a little, but generally you can go about another 100 miles after the computer says 0 miles left. I usually just fill up at 400 miles because it's just convienient for me to do so with my routine.

Warning, don't run a hybrid out of fuel. It's a real pain in the arse to get started again because it's not like a traditional car where you can just crank and crank until fuel starts to come through the injectors. Since the ECU starts the engine, it won't crank long enough for that to happen.
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Old 06-17-2014, 02:37 PM   #21
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lol, I came close once. That's why my wife and I just filled up around 450 miles on the trip, which would coincide with right around 9 gallons. I'm driving a brand new Corolla with CVT and it feels just as quick as my Prius did. Adequate and great mileage. These are not rocket boosters. Typically 9-10 gallons @ $4.20/gallon = ~$42.00 good for 450-500 miles for the Prius. The Corolla is typically 12 gallons @ 4.20/gallon = $50.00 for 400 miles. I'm saving $ over my Prius with this Corolla because the lease on the Corolla is dirt cheap compared to my Prius. Plus it has standard LED HID and a ton of other features the Prius doesn't come with until you hit higher trims. I dunno why anybody would get a Prius over a Corolla, unless you need the rear shelf and the hybrid badge and more range. Driving dynamics of the two are both garbage. lol This post just turned into a longwinded review. Sorry, guys. :-/
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:52 PM   #22
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Is there a Ford engine that meets or exceeds their claims? I know the Ecoboost V6 doesn't and my 2012 5.0L Mustang never came close to their city/highway claims.
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Old 06-17-2014, 07:40 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by gggplaya View Post
It was a response to Balatanz's comment on a stereotypical prius driver.
He was being facetious.

But as an AR15-owning, Christian conservative, it's not surprising that you didn't pick up on that.
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Old 06-18-2014, 03:43 AM   #24
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He was being facetious.

But as an AR15-owning, Christian conservative, it's not surprising that you didn't pick up on that.
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:16 AM   #25
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Is there a Ford engine that meets or exceeds their claims? I know the Ecoboost V6 doesn't and my 2012 5.0L Mustang never came close to their city/highway claims.
The EB3.5 is rated at 17mpg combined and there are people getting that on fuelly. The main thing about all of their EB engines are that if you use it (boost), you loose it (MPG) and it's easy to get into boost.

The Mustang results on fuelly are mostly similar, all over the place with a noticeable bell curve. The website will let you filter by engine type and, while everyone's commute is different, you can usually see what the overall average is for a statistically relevant sample size. Take a look and see if your findings jive with your opinion.
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