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Old 06-16-2014, 09:21 PM   #1
tcjensen1
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Default Wrx is depressing

So we bought a car that I thought would be great for sliding round in the dirt at a RallyCross, but during the first event, all the stupid thing did was smash hard against the jump stop the whole time, including on the straights. It sounded like a sledgehammer hitting the car. I have no desire to leave stock class, and have no desire to spend money on coilovers to rallycross a car - an event that is supposed to favor soft suspension. The WRX is so soft it candle even handle that. Heck, the stock suspension can't even handle the bumpy country road behind my house. What the crap? Anyone have any ideas on how to stop this without exiting stock class rallycross? I'm at a loss and really disappointed in this car. This was supposed to be the "leave stock and enjoy" car, but it's a piece of crap. (Yes I still like much about it, but it's about worthless without heavy modification)
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Old 06-16-2014, 09:23 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by tcjensen1 View Post
So we bought a car that I thought would be great for sliding round in the dirt at a RallyCross, but during the first event, all the stupid thing did was smash hard against the jump stop the whole time, including on the straights. It sounded like a sledgehammer hitting the car. I have no desire to leave stock class, and have no desire to spend money on coilovers to rallycross a car - an event that is supposed to favor soft suspension. The WRX is so soft it candle even handle that. Heck, the stock suspension can't even handle the bumpy country road behind my house. What the crap? Anyone have any ideas on how to stop this without exiting stock class rallycross? I'm at a loss and really disappointed in this car. This was supposed to be the "leave stock and enjoy" car, but it's a piece of crap. (Yes I still like much about it, but it's about worthless without heavy modification)
"Bump stops" (Iphone corrective text, lol. I didn't jump the car)
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Old 06-16-2014, 09:29 PM   #3
Soobiecabra
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Fill out your profile, we have no idea what generation of car you are talking about.
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Old 06-16-2014, 09:32 PM   #4
tcjensen1
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Will do. In meantime, it's a 2014 WRX 5-door
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Old 06-16-2014, 10:35 PM   #5
ALOKIN
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Sell it and get an evo
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Old 06-17-2014, 01:59 AM   #6
tcjensen1
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I'm really hoping the original shocks are bad or something, but I'm not sure I can get subaru to take them off and test them. Anyone else with an '08-'14 experience the same often slamming into bumpstops?
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Old 06-17-2014, 04:02 AM   #7
14stu
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If you truly were riding the bump stops "even on the straights" them you must have blown out your shocks (probably from being overly zealous with a stock street car during your rally cross).

The bump stops are there to keep you from damaging the suspension after it had completed all its intended travel, but if you got something hard enough (high enough specific impulse) you can damage the suspension anyway.

The stock wrx suspension was not designed to be competitive in any type of Motorsport, it was designed for street use and the occasional light hoonage.

In the motorsports world there is a term you need to become familiar with: "pay to play." If you want your car to feel at home on the track or at the rally stage you have to invest in it, you have to sacrifice some on road behavior and comfort, and you have to invest the time and energy it takes to learn what is required of yourself and your vehicle to compete.

Talk to Brianne Corn, or one of the other experienced rally cross competitors and really listen to what they have to say. Only someone who is physically there with you and is knowledgeable of the sport will really be able to help you (over the internet we are all just guessing). Hopefully you will be able to learn from your experience and grow as a driver and enthusiast, maybe in a few months you will be able to look back and be amused by how much you and your perspective has changed.

-Sam
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Old 06-17-2014, 10:22 AM   #8
atomicfire
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Repeat after me:

The WRX/STi you buy at the dealership is NOT a rally car. It is a STREET car.
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:24 PM   #9
tcjensen1
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Appreciate the feedback. I'm not new to driving or competing. I have an s2000 that I autocross and track. This was my first rallycross however. I enjoy low-traction situations and the car control they require, so rallycross was appealing. But my experience with a truly stock car makes me wonder if anyone is running truly stock cars by the tight letter if the scca rallycross laws ... Or ... There hopefully is something wrong with my car. Or ... The newer ones are just that much softer and can't handle it. I should have let someone else drive it while u was there so people don't think I'm crazy, lol. I'll have Cobb and subaru comb through it, but I saw nothing wrong with it myself unfortunately. And, it was bottoming out like this on certain bumps on the street, so it wasn't anything I did at rallycross. It's just that soft I'm afraid. But again, how is anyone truly stock? Or ... Are they just loving with these awful sounds and feelings?
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:32 PM   #10
scoobyou
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My 2011 Is sweet I love the ride .I don't feel it bottom in out on ruff road pot holes.but if I was going to rally I would bought a 2004-2005 sti?
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Old 06-17-2014, 04:29 PM   #11
tcjensen1
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I checked around the internet and forums and others are complaining of the same. For example, 2012's and 2013's bottoming out too easily. It's sad. I understand "pay to play" all too well unfortunately. But when "stock" categories exist for something like rallycross, you wouldn't think that the SUBARU WRX would be the one that can't take it, while cats the ford fiesta are not bottoming out. (And I don't mean "grounding" out with the body slamming the ground, although it wanted to do that too, I just prevented it by giving it way up in the dips and timing the braking/throttle to keep the end lifted that needs to lifted at the right moment)
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Old 06-17-2014, 04:43 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 14stu View Post
If you truly were riding the bump stops "even on the straights" them you must have blown out your shocks (probably from being overly zealous with a stock street car during your rally cross). The bump stops are there to keep you from damaging the suspension after it had completed all its intended travel, but if you got something hard enough (high enough specific impulse) you can damage the suspension anyway. The stock wrx suspension was not designed to be competitive in any type of Motorsport, it was designed for street use and the occasional light hoonage. In the motorsports world there is a term you need to become familiar with: "pay to play." If you want your car to feel at home on the track or at the rally stage you have to invest in it, you have to sacrifice some on road behavior and comfort, and you have to invest the time and energy it takes to learn what is required of yourself and your vehicle to compete. Talk to Brianne Corn, or one of the other experienced rally cross competitors and really listen to what they have to say. Only someone who is physically there with you and is knowledgeable of the sport will really be able to help you (over the internet we are all just guessing). Hopefully you will be able to learn from your experience and grow as a driver and enthusiast, maybe in a few months you will be able to look back and be amused by how much you and your perspective has changed. -Sam
It could be possible that a shock (or more than one) got blown at the one autocross the car has done, or on a pothole on the street, or maybe we blew another at the one rallycross (1/2 of one) too. I don't know. I would think there would leaks or evidence of leaks.

Question on the rules. What kind of damper would this be? Is there anything other than OEM that fits this description for a 2014 wrx? It's says no revalving, so why the allowance of an "aftermarket" damper? Anybody have an example of the necessity of the language on the 2nd part of this rule? It doesn't mean I can run Bilstein's and stay in stock class, does it?

"unmodified, mass-produced aftermarket replacement units intended by the manufacturer for the specific year, make and model used."

... Per the written rule below:

6.2.C.13 VEHICLE CLASSIFICATION – Rally Stock Category
Shocks/dampers may be replaced with unmodified OEM or unmodified, mass- produced aftermarket replacement units intended by the manufacturer for the specific year, make and model used. Rebuilds are allowed but only if the shock/damper is rebuilt to its original specifications (i.e. no re-valving). The stock spring must be used as it was on the OEM unit. The spring perch must be factory welded to the damper or use the exact attachment method and position as OEM. Adjustable dampers are only allowed if the OEM unit was adjustable and must retain the same number of adjustments or fewer as OEM. Remote reservoir shocks are only allowed if they are exact OEM units.
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Old 06-17-2014, 05:39 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by ALOKIN View Post
Sell it and get an evo
This /\
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Old 06-17-2014, 05:46 PM   #14
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This /\
Then complain about how harsh it is in daily driving
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Old 06-17-2014, 06:50 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcjensen1 View Post
Question on the rules. What kind of damper would this be? Is there anything other than OEM that fits this description for a 2014 wrx? It's says no revalving, so why the allowance of an "aftermarket" damper? Anybody have an example of the necessity of the language on the 2nd part of this rule? It doesn't mean I can run Bilstein's and stay in stock class, does it?

"unmodified, mass-produced aftermarket replacement units intended by the manufacturer for the specific year, make and model used."

... Per the written rule below:

6.2.C.13 VEHICLE CLASSIFICATION – Rally Stock Category
Shocks/dampers may be replaced with unmodified OEM or unmodified, mass- produced aftermarket replacement units intended by the manufacturer for the specific year, make and model used. Rebuilds are allowed but only if the shock/damper is rebuilt to its original specifications (i.e. no re-valving). The stock spring must be used as it was on the OEM unit. The spring perch must be factory welded to the damper or use the exact attachment method and position as OEM. Adjustable dampers are only allowed if the OEM unit was adjustable and must retain the same number of adjustments or fewer as OEM. Remote reservoir shocks are only allowed if they are exact OEM units.
You have to use an OEM damper. You can have an existing on rebuilt to OEM specs, but not changed (i.e., no Feal revalve or adding adjustability). Unlike AX, you can't slap on any damper that doesn't change ride height or add adjustability.
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Old 06-17-2014, 08:54 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by SGC2CIC View Post
This /\
I would love an evo (dogs can't jump in the back tho, so it got eliminated), or an sti (I was all for it). The wrx, however, I bought for my wife, and she chose it over the sti for a compliant ride on the street. It was supposed to be a win-win, however, as my research on the forums has shown that softer springs are better for rallycross anyway. I'm not here complaining because the stock wrx can't keep up with my s2000 at MSR or ECR. I accept that. I'm here complaining because my AWD Subaru can't take drive in the dirt without dying. I am hoping that we can find blown shocks.
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Old 06-17-2014, 08:55 PM   #17
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Then complain about how harsh it is in daily driving
I daily drive my s2000 on 600 lb springs.
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Old 06-17-2014, 09:26 PM   #18
trxdam
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I daily drove my acura tl with 550lb springs. Though I noticed my a/c vents moved over bumps.
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Old 06-18-2014, 02:11 AM   #19
tcjensen1
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Originally Posted by trxdam View Post
I daily drove my acura tl with 550lb springs. Though I noticed my a/c vents moved over bumps.
Definitely all about the shock quality the higher you go in spring rate. And apparently .. The lower as well
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Old 06-20-2014, 01:40 AM   #20
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It rode decent for a 3400lb car. Didn't bottom out and wasn't slammed. It was probably because I did have the dampening turned 6 out from full hard...... I ran the back 2 clicks softer. It made that car want to dance in the corners Wish I had a video of that run when I did that 4 wheel drift coming out of the slalom into a decreasing radius turn.
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Old 06-20-2014, 06:59 PM   #21
SWP is Sexy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicfire View Post
Repeat after me:

The WRX/STi you buy at the dealership is NOT a rally car. It is a STREET car.
THIS.
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Old 06-21-2014, 01:46 AM   #22
tcjensen1
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THIS.
It's also not as capable in the dirt as a stock ford fiesta also in stock form ... Which is just sad.
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Old 06-21-2014, 02:14 AM   #23
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If you think you have a blown shock take it to AST or Vorshlag (both in Plano) and they will tell you for sure. If the socks are shot then you can try a warranty claim (you lost any legitimate claim when you went racing but your dealer might cover it anyway some of them are cool like that) out you can replace them. If you have to replace them you can take the opportunity to upgrade them and solve your problem.

Unfortunately, I suspect that the real problem does not lie with the vehicle. The single biggest performance factor is also the hardest to fix: the nut behind the wheel.
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Old 06-21-2014, 05:27 PM   #24
tcjensen1
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Appreciate the advice. The nut behind the wheel can always get faster and become a better driver, but I've been autocrossing for quite some time, won my class last time out, and run with the advanced groups at MSR. Last time I co-drove with an instructor from MSR, I beat him by 5 seconds on a 60 second autocross course - in the same car. And though it must not have been a super-competitive event, I could have won S4 easily in the car had I not cared about it, lol. I'm not trying to brag, I still have a long way to go. I'm just telling you that this is legit bottoming out and a terrible feeling though the car. Though there are many faster than me, I know how to drive decent enough to recognize a major shortfall in a car,and will happily co-drive with anyone in anyone's car to see how far off their time I am. I love doing that - driver to driver competition in the same car. I've also found threads now that confirm the stock wrx bottoms out on the even slightly rough rallycrosses. - this coming from a longtime successful rallycrosser. I don't think there is anything wrong with the car either, and Terry isn't going to want to dissemble the struts for free to tell me that. I will tell you this- if other people aren't bottoming out their stock 2014 wrx suspension at rallycrosses, they aren't driving well enough. I was on the bumpstops a LOT at the first autocross I drove the car in as well - and that was with the OEM dunlop tires.
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Old 06-21-2014, 05:41 PM   #25
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Appreciate the advice. The nut behind the wheel can always get faster and become a better driver, but I've been autocrossing for quite some time, won my class last time out, and run with the advanced groups at MSR. Last time I co-drove with an instructor from MSR, I beat him by 5 seconds on a 60 second autocross course - in the same car. And though it must not have been a super-competitive event, I could have won S4 easily in the car had I not cared about it, lol. I'm not trying to brag, I still have a long way to go. I'm just telling you that this is legit bottoming out and a terrible feeling though the car. Though there are many faster than me, I know how to drive decent enough to recognize a major shortfall in a car,and will happily co-drive with anyone in anyone's car to see how far off their time I am. I love doing that - driver to driver competition in the same car. I've also found threads now that confirm the stock wrx bottoms out on the even slightly rough rallycrosses. - this coming from a longtime successful rallycrosser. I don't think there is anything wrong with the car either, and Terry isn't going to want to dissemble the struts for free to tell me that. I will tell you this- if other people aren't bottoming out their stock 2014 wrx suspension at rallycrosses, they aren't driving well enough. I was on the bumpstops a LOT at the first autocross I drove the car in as well - and that was with the OEM dunlop tires.
... And if you have an sti, probably none of these problems apply, so don't expect to feel the same thing.
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