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Old 10-24-2002, 05:07 PM   #1
AaronBBrown
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Default Mobil One vs. other synthetics

I've been using Mobil 1 since day one...However, it's a pain, because I have to set up an appointment and leave my car with a mechanic with the oil to get it put in. Valveoline has a quick-change place down the road from me and provides a full synthetic.

Are all synthetics created equal or should I stick with Mobil One. More specificially...how is the valveoline synthetic?
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Old 10-24-2002, 05:10 PM   #2
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I'd change the oil myself, I dont trust those places...
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Old 10-24-2002, 05:16 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by djerickd
I'd change the oil myself, I dont trust those places...
That's great...do you have an answer to my question about the quality of the oil itself?

Changing the oil myself isn't really an option. I don't have the space, time, or interest in freezing my butt off.
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Old 10-24-2002, 05:53 PM   #4
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Ahhh I forgot you live in a cold climate, forget that!! I'd think the Valvoline would be suitable for everyday winter driving conditons.

Then in summer do it yourself with Mobil 1
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Old 10-24-2002, 09:15 PM   #5
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You need to do a search. There have been many posts about this.
All synthetics are NOT equal. Some are not even synthetic from what enthusiasts would think.

The other issue is the amount of additive carrier stock (forgot the tech term). All oils contain some dino juice, even the most synth synthetic. Some can contain 25% dino.

Mobil is arguably one of the top 3, while valvoline is not.
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Old 10-24-2002, 10:20 PM   #6
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Best for summer: 20-50w
Best for Winter: 10-30w

It was my stupidity to use 20-50w during last winter
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Old 10-24-2002, 10:23 PM   #7
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how about 15w-40 year round, depending on where you live!
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:43 AM   #8
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Quote:
20-50w
There is absolutely no reason to use this oil in the WRX.
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Old 10-25-2002, 09:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by ciper
You need to do a search. There have been many posts about this.
You do a search on "synthetic oil" and wade through all the crap. All I am interested in was a simple answer to a simple question. Is valvoline a decent synthetic?
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Old 10-25-2002, 02:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
You do a search on "synthetic oil" and wade through all the crap. All I am interested in was a simple answer to a simple question. Is valvoline a decent synthetic?
Aaron, I think just about any "synthetic" will be superior to just about any "dino" oil for the aspects you probably care about, like stability at high temps, fluidity at low temps, etc.
However, getting the oil changed at a "quicky" place also means they are changing your oil filter and dealing with the drain plug. The quality of the oil filter can make an enormous difference in the oil pressure produced, and thus in the amount of oil actually reaching the lubricated parts; having enough oil reach them matters more than the quality of the oil that reaches them. Finally, incorrect replacement of the drain plug (e.g. without its disposable crush washer) can lead to oil leaks, and in the case of one poor WRX owner on this forum, to loss of all oil and a trashed engine.
Having lived in Cambridge/Somerville for 10 years, I can appreciate the convenience of getting the oil change done at Valvoline (who seem decent for such places). Therefore, I would suggest getting the valvoline synthetic 5w30, BUT bring your own oil filter (Subaru OEM or better yet Purolator PureOne premium filter for ~$5: PL14460, not L14460) and OEM crush washer for the drain plug and give it to them to install (and don't expect any discount).
After you've driven a few miles, look underneath to make sure they put in the new filter and drain plug without any leaks.
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Old 10-26-2002, 05:40 PM   #11
iwantawrxsti
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amsoil synthetic oil is the best out there hands down
first company ever to create synthetic oil
go on google and do a search u will find a wealth of knowledge about it
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Old 10-27-2002, 08:00 AM   #12
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Quote:
first company ever to create synthetic oil
LOL!
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Old 10-28-2002, 03:31 AM   #13
iwantawrxsti
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Quote:
Originally posted by SteveS
LOL!
uhhh ok
why don't u look up some info on amsoil and then u'll see im the one laughing at u oh believer of the "3000 mile oil change"



u'll find out that amsoil was the first company to ever create the full synthetic oil and the first in alot of other stuff also
amsoil website

and another informative site:


click here
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Old 10-28-2002, 09:25 AM   #14
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uhm.... those two websites you provided are Amsoil or resellers of Amsoil.
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Old 10-28-2002, 12:34 PM   #15
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I love playing "Devil's Advocate" and I also can be a real tightwad. Frankly, as our cars are sent from the factory with no recomendations for synthetic oil, I am quite sure that ANY synthetic will WAY exceed the requirements of our cars. If you want to debate which synthetic is the absolute best, fine. But if you want to run a synthetic for the improved lubrication, flow, and other qualities, then almost any of them is going to do the job.

Now if you've got a modified engine, especially one running higher boost and/or revs, then the best oil may be needed. On a stock engine, I believe any quality oil, or synthetic is going to keep it running for a long time.

Having said that, I've been using dino oil (Castrol 10-30) but I'm thinking of switching to Havoline Synthetic which at $2.80 or so a quart might be nearly justified. I really doubt there will ever be a lubrication failure related problem with the engine, but for an extra $8-10 every 4-5 months, I suppose it's not a bad idea.

My $.02 worth. Money back if it's wrong - all 2 cents!
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Old 10-28-2002, 12:44 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Alan
I love playing "Devil's Advocate" and I also can be a real tightwad. Frankly, as our cars are sent from the factory with no recomendations for synthetic oil, I am quite sure that ANY synthetic will WAY exceed the requirements of our cars.
A very good point and the type of perspective I was looking for from someone on the board! My car is not modded, nor will it probably ever be...the car is fast enough for me and my money is better spent on SCUBA equipment. Since I just got another speeding ticket, I am likely to be slowing down anyhow. I got 28 mpg yesterday on a 320 mile trip!!! I guess slow has its benefits.
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Old 10-28-2002, 03:47 PM   #17
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iwantawrxsti: he is laughing at you because of your comments about amsoil being the creator of synthetic oils.

Personally I think amsoil is sort of like being a scientologist. Those who believe in it are very strong followers while everyone else looks at them as a little messed up.

My own feeling is that synthetic oils are probably the best thing you can do for your car (with the propper change schedule). The increase in price for Amsoil doesnt warrant the supposed beneifts, so I use Mobil 1 that costs me aprox 3 dollars a quart.

Alan: If you really are a tightwad you would research and realize that synth can cost LESS than standard oil..... it does for me at least.
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Old 10-28-2002, 04:01 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by ciper

Alan: If you really are a tightwad you would research and realize that synth can cost LESS than standard oil..... it does for me at least.
You show me how using any full synthetic will be cheaper than dino oil. I change my oil every 4 months - I don't drive that much. I get Castrol or Valvoline at $.69 to $.89 a quart after rebates and sales. Using a $4-5 filter, I figure under $10 an oil change. That's $30 a year. So unless you're one of those who lets their oil stay for a whole year, and just changes the filter, it is a little cheaper to use dino oil.

That said, I just now am draining the 20W-50 I had in for the Taste of Subaru track day and am putting in the Halvoline full synthetic 10-30 for the "winter".
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Old 10-28-2002, 07:02 PM   #19
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AMSOIL Trademarked "First in Synthetics"
Here's another interesting tid-bit. Albert J. Amatuzio, President and CEO of AMSOIL, Inc., announced a while back that the phrase "First in Synthetics" is now part of the AMSOIL registered trademark. No other oil manufacturer can claim to be first.
Mr. Amatuzio told an interesting story as to how this came about. AMSOIL applied to have this statement registered and was told that they must prove to the trademark officials, by documentation, that AMSOIL Synthetic Oil was first, historically. However, they also said that by claiming to be first, AMSOIL was insinuating they were the best (or #1/first) from a quality or performance standpoint.

So AMSOIL had to convince them that they had the best product to also claim to be first. AMSOIL proceeded to present comparison documentation and test results backing up the claim that AMSOIL was also the best. YES! THE TRADEMARK OFFICIALS ACCEPTED THE DOCUMENTATION to allow AMSOIL to use "first" in their trademark.

But the process was not through. The procedure now required the government to notify all the other oil manufacturers that would be impacted by this decision, so they would have input before this decision would be official. They were notified in writing and given 90 days to object, comment or respond. The ninety days elapsed without a peep!

AMSOIL not only convinced the trademark office that AMSOIL Synthetic Oil was first historically, but also convinced them that AMSOIL is the first in quality, and no other competitor objected!
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Old 10-28-2002, 08:45 PM   #20
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Alan: That makes sense, I drive about 40,000 miles a year so my oil changes are frequent. I can design a change interval that will balance the additional cost of synth.
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Old 10-29-2002, 09:07 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by iwantawrxsti
AMSOIL Trademarked "First in Synthetics"
Here's another interesting tid-bit. Albert J. Amatuzio, President and CEO of AMSOIL, Inc., announced a while back that the phrase "First in Synthetics" is now part of the AMSOIL registered trademark. No other oil manufacturer can claim to be first.
Mr. Amatuzio told an interesting story as to how this came about. AMSOIL applied to have this statement registered and was told that they must prove to the trademark officials, by documentation, that AMSOIL Synthetic Oil was first, historically. However, they also said that by claiming to be first, AMSOIL was insinuating they were the best (or #1/first) from a quality or performance standpoint.

So AMSOIL had to convince them that they had the best product to also claim to be first. AMSOIL proceeded to present comparison documentation and test results backing up the claim that AMSOIL was also the best. YES! THE TRADEMARK OFFICIALS ACCEPTED THE DOCUMENTATION to allow AMSOIL to use "first" in their trademark.

But the process was not through. The procedure now required the government to notify all the other oil manufacturers that would be impacted by this decision, so they would have input before this decision would be official. They were notified in writing and given 90 days to object, comment or respond. The ninety days elapsed without a peep!

AMSOIL not only convinced the trademark office that AMSOIL Synthetic Oil was first historically, but also convinced them that AMSOIL is the first in quality, and no other competitor objected!
WOW! Thats gotta say something about how good this stuff is!
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Old 10-29-2002, 10:48 AM   #22
Jon Bogert
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iwantawrxsti, did you join the i-Club just to promote Amsoil? I know there is a fee for vendors here, but I'm not sure if that fee applies to shills, too. You might want to contact Nick or Alex about that.
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Old 10-29-2002, 06:55 PM   #23
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Please explain the reason why someone would spend $20K plus on a car and then go out of their way to spend no more than $30 a year on oil. Surely the investment in the car is worth protecting?

The best oil bar none is Motul 300V Synthetic. It is high on esters and has next to no additives. This prevents coking (the most lethal effect of cheap oils) as well as protection from wear, particularly when first starting. If its good enough for the Subaru rally team and is re-badged and recommended by STI, its good enough for me. Second choice would be Mobil 1 racing.

Motul is expensive and may not suit the cheapskates amongst you (around $50 here in the UK to fill an STI) but it makes Amsoil look like cooking oil.

Ken
UK
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Old 10-29-2002, 07:37 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by KenG
Please explain the reason why someone would spend $20K plus on a car and then go out of their way to spend no more than $30 a year on oil. Surely the investment in the car is worth protecting?
First of all, the car is ONLY a $23K car - not a $200,000 Ferrarri. If I wanted the expense of maintaining an all out perfrmance car, then I'd have bought one. The WRX is a nice machine, but it's not bleeding edge overstressed technology. That's why Subaru is able to give a 60,000 mile engine warranty, and only finds it necessary to recommend normal non-synthetic oil.

Secondly, there's absolutely no proof that using an oil better than required will result in any real advantage in real life. Sure, the engine "might" have a little less wear - maybe. But if the engine is designed for 200,000 miles which I believe to be the case, do I really care if by using some expensive product I can make it last 300,000 miles. As I'll be selling the car long before it gets to 80,000 miles it just really does not matter.

And if using only the best oil is really needed, then WHAT is needed for those folks who have modified and much more highly stressed engines? Oil changes with NASA spec pure liquid molydenum, refined to a 0-50W oil by elderly wizard PhD's in a secret Iraqi underground laboratory, done only on nights with a full moon??

Frankly, if I cared to maximize the engine life, I am quite sure that proper care, proper warm up, and less stressed driving would be more beneficial than any lubricant that meets the Subaru requirements. But this is just a car - albeit one I like a lot - not a collectible, vintage or exotic vehicle.

Rant off.. sorry.
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Old 10-29-2002, 09:48 PM   #25
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i'm not a promoter nor a dealer... just another consumer wanting to get most of the money he spends... and im sure u guys do also
just wanted to share the knowledge with u guys thats all
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