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Old 10-25-2002, 02:08 PM   #1
micah
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Default Wellstone dead in plane crash

Check the news sites.
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Old 10-25-2002, 02:08 PM   #2
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Yeah that sucks. He and his whole family. On their way to a funeral!! How sad is that.
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Old 10-25-2002, 02:10 PM   #3
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Most people won't know who he is..... He was a Senator from Minnesota, flying to go to a friends' funeral. Also killed were his family and 5 others.

http://www.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/...inn/index.html
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Old 10-25-2002, 02:17 PM   #4
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i use to work/fly on planes when i was in the military and have flown in some nasty weather i wouldnt have gone up in (not my decision). how many crashes do you hear about only miles from the airport it took off from?? why do people take these risks?
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Old 10-25-2002, 02:39 PM   #5
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It's a sad loss. I'm sorry to hear of this. If it makes it any better, the family went together instead of just the kids being killed or just the partents being killed.

--KC
(He voted against Bush's request to be able to go to war against Iraq.
Quote:
The close Minnesota race is one of several around the nation that are considered key to control of the Senate, now dominated by Democrats by a one-vote margin.
Liberal to the end, Wellstone cast his vote earlier this month against legislation to authorize the use of force in Iraq virtually the only Democrat in a competitive race to go against President Bush on the issue.
Whadda ya think was going to happen?

And for the other conspracy theorists...
Quote:
In February, Wellstone divulged that he had been diagnosed with multiple sclerosis. He said he had been told by doctors he probably had had the disease for 15 years.
)
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Old 10-25-2002, 03:09 PM   #6
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I'm damn happy he is out of the race...allthough it is a shame it had to be under such sad conditions.
Grant - no respect for that hippie as a politition
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Old 10-25-2002, 03:53 PM   #7
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Well, I'm glad to see that the death of a man and his wife could bring
Quote:
Originally posted by scaryfastskier
happy
ness to someone. Gotta love republicans
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Old 10-25-2002, 03:55 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by micah
Well, I'm glad to see that the death of a man and his wife could bring

[happy]ness to someone. Gotta love republicans
dude, who said I was happy anyone was hurt, much less dead! I'm merely happy he won't be representing my state any longer.
Grant - not necessarly a republican

BTW: his whole family is not dead...he is "survived by two sons"
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Old 10-25-2002, 04:40 PM   #9
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Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally posted by scaryfastskier
I'm damn happy he is out of the race...allthough it is a shame it had to be under such sad conditions.
Grant - no respect for that hippie as a politition
Wow

you're one messed up individual
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Old 10-25-2002, 05:25 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by scaryfastskier
I'm damn happy he is out of the race...allthough it is a shame it had to be under such sad conditions.
Grant - no respect for that hippie as a politition
That's bang out of order.

Paul Wellstone commanded a great deal of respect from even his most bitter opponents. He held to his principles no matter how small of a minority it put him in. He was passionate about what he did and I think he was remarkably in tune with the people of Minnesota (who include more than just pampered conservative suburbanites). His brand of populism is rare today when most politicians craft everything they say with an eye towards their own reelections.

We in Minnesota will be fortunate if his successor is even half as capable as he was.

He will be missed.
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Old 10-25-2002, 05:50 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zola Rex
That's bang out of order.
never heard that expression....anyway.

Quote:
He held to his principles no matter how small of a minority it put him in. He was passionate about what he did
quite commendable qualities and I hope his replacement has them. My problem with him is that his principles do not align with my own...hence voting against him. (just as you would, presumably, vote for him).

Quote:
I think he was remarkably in tune with the people of Minnesota (who include more than just pampered conservative suburbanites)
I disagree that he was "in tune" to the public's wants/needs for the most part. (That statement is obviously subject to debate and entirly unprovable for either of us though) Hatred for him as a politition is much farther spread than "pampered conservative suburbanites". I happen to prolly be one of those, but many people I know that are against him are not in that catagory. I think most people with a handle on economics and politics would side against him. (in no way a slam on you individually)

Quote:
We in Minnesota will be fortunate if his successor is even half as capable as he was.
indeed we will be...however, i doubt it will be much of a challange.

Quote:
He will be missed
very much so as a person. as a politition however, i wouldn't agree.

Best wishes to his remaining family members,
Grant
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Old 10-25-2002, 06:27 PM   #12
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God bless all involved...

As an A&P mechanic, any aircraft incident or accident is in my fears.
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Old 10-25-2002, 06:33 PM   #13
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I love how the media is making this guy into something he never was now that he's dead.

I keep hearing the talking heads refer to him as "larger than life", "a truly wonderful person", "a great asset to our country", etc, etc.... An odd description of someone with a "progressive liberal" (i.e. socialist) tag. I swear, if Hitler were around to die again, the media would make him into a saint. Im not comparing the senator to Hitler by any means - just making an example of media sensationalizism.
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:04 PM   #14
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Why is it that right wing conservatives are convinced that no "progressive liberal" could possibly be an asset to our country?

Do you really think that the United States is synonymous with the Republican Party? That only right wing conservatives represent the ideals of "America"?

Why is it that you think that a nation founded on the concept that dissenting opinions in politics foster stability through compromise... should have anything other than dissenting opinions?

I say keep the balance of power. Combative ideologies are good for the country as long as neither side gains full control. Full control leads to the abuse of power.
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:12 PM   #15
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wellstone is a man who should be respected...he was a politician who was actually honest and stuck to his guns...i rarely agreed with his opinions, but as a person he was a good man

i think i heard mondale may run in his place and jesse will fulfill the remainder of wellstone's term (not positive of either of these)
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:41 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Porter
Why is it that right wing conservatives are convinced that no "progressive liberal" could possibly be an asset to our country?

Do you really think that the United States is synonymous with the Republican Party? That only right wing conservatives represent the ideals of "America"?

Why is it that you think that a nation founded on the concept that dissenting opinions in politics foster stability through compromise... should have anything other than dissenting opinions?

I say keep the balance of power. Combative ideologies are good for the country as long as neither side gains full control. Full control leads to the abuse of power.
You're arguing against a point i never made.

Please show me where i said "only right wing conservatives represent the ideals of america".

Please show me where i said "i think we should ban dissenting opionions". (big rolleyes for that one )

Please show me where i even said I'M a god damn republican.

Before you go off on your righteous crusade against anyone who dissents with you, maybe you should take a breath and re-read my post - this time making sure you understand it.
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:41 PM   #17
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Quote:
"Well, I'm glad to see that the death of a man and his wife could bring

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by scaryfastskier
happy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


ness to someone. Gotta love republicans"
Whew, talk about showing your true inclinations about Republicans micah. Try again big guy. When Rush went deaf for a while, you would have thought that it was ice cream and orgasms for some of liberal aquaintences. I do not associate myself with any person that takes joy in the suffering of others.

Quote:
"Paul Wellstone commanded a great deal of respect from even his most bitter opponents."
The media might be saying that today, they were not saying that yesterday.

Look, I think most conservatives have the ability to see this in two ways.

1) Paul Wellstone the man seemed to be a decent human being, who cared about his family. No person takes joy in the death of another, regardless of their political beliefs. I am truly sorry for his family.

2) Paul Wellstone the politician was bad news for this country IMHO. I have wanted him out for years. I did not think of him as particularly principled, more like reflexively liberal. I never heard him make a logical argument for his stances. However, I would have preferred to have seem sent into private practice by the voters of his state.

It is easy to separate the two.
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:47 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by micah
Well, I'm glad to see that the death of a man and his wife could bring

ness to someone. Gotta love republicans
Republicans are what make the world go round, then the demicrats come in and ridddddde the wave....Pathetic.
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:57 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by DannyGT


Republicans are what make the world go round, then the demicrats come in and ridddddde the wave....Pathetic.
at least Democrats can spell
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Old 10-25-2002, 09:29 PM   #20
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Default The Real Problem

The real problem here is not Democrat or Republican.

The problem is check and balance.

When the President and Congress are Republican, having a Democratic Senate is good for the country. It checks the Republicans so they can't do whatever they want. It's an important part of representative democracy.

Think about it. Whether you support Bush or not, do we really want Bush to be allowed to do whatever he chooses? His leanings are quite extreme in many areas and don't represent the majority of Americans.

Countries that don't have well balanced two party systems are SCREWED up.

Pray for some partisan balance in our government. It benefits us all!
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Old 10-25-2002, 09:34 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Porter
Why is it that you think that a nation founded on the concept that dissenting opinions in politics foster stability through compromise... should have anything other than dissenting opinions?

I say keep the balance of power. Combative ideologies are good for the country as long as neither side gains full control. Full control leads to the abuse of power.
Porter. I agree with you 100%. You state your position very eloquently.
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Old 10-25-2002, 09:50 PM   #22
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Default Re: The Real Problem

Quote:
Originally posted by kurichan
His leanings are quite extreme in many areas and don't represent the majority of Americans.
are you sure most of his views don't represent the majority? he has a 68% approval rating average after 7 quarters in office...he is still on track for a 70% yearly average
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Old 10-25-2002, 10:02 PM   #23
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Here's a good read:

http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/pnoonan/

That coming from a former republican speech writer.
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Old 10-25-2002, 10:15 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Monolith

You're arguing against a point i never made.

Please show me where i said "only right wing conservatives represent the ideals of america".

Please show me where i said "i think we should ban dissenting opionions". (big rolleyes for that one )

Please show me where i even said I'M a god damn republican.

Before you go off on your righteous crusade against anyone who dissents with you, maybe you should take a breath and re-read my post - this time making sure you understand it.
Let's try this again.

You said:

Quote:
I keep hearing the talking heads refer to him as "larger than life", "a truly wonderful person", "a great asset to our country", etc, etc.... An odd description of someone with a "progressive liberal" (i.e. socialist) tag.
I.e. that anyone who is an "asset to our country" could not possibly be a "progressive liberal."

Your statement was very clear. No progressive liberal could possibly be "larger than life", "a truly wonderful person", or "a great asset to our country." In fact you went so far as to say that progressive liberals are socialists.

What are you going to call them next? Commie scum? I'm envisioning the ghost of McCarthy with his arm around your shoulders.


This is all funny to me.. I'm a militant moderate.
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Old 10-26-2002, 02:57 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by scaryfastskier
quite commendable qualities and I hope his replacement has them. My problem with him is that his principles do not align with my own...hence voting against him. (just as you would, presumably, vote for him).
Saying you don't agree with his political stances is one thing. Fine. But saying you are "happy" that he won't be in the race on the day he died is just absolutely despicable. In my opinion.

Also, I never voted for Paul Wellstone. Nor did I say that I would have voted for him. He's much, much farther left than I am.

Quote:
I disagree that he was "in tune" to the public's wants/needs for the most part. (That statement is obviously subject to debate and entirly unprovable for either of us though) Hatred for him as a politition is much farther spread than "pampered conservative suburbanites". I happen to prolly be one of those, but many people I know that are against him are not in that catagory. I think most people with a handle on economics and politics would side against him. (in no way a slam on you individually)
I don't really even know what that last sentence is supposed to mean. Though not an economist by trade, I think I'm well-versed enough to get by. Ditto for politics. Although I can't possibly know this for sure, if you're from Minnetonka, there's a high degree of probability that you fall into the category I would label "pampered conservative suburbanites". Hell, one of them is my best friend so it's not like I think they are terrible people. Just facts.

Quote:
indeed we will be...however, i doubt it will be much of a challange.
Taking potshots at a man who died today. That's just awful. Republican or Democrat, that's awful.

BTW, it's spelled politician.

Last edited by Zola; 10-26-2002 at 03:04 AM.
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