Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Monday July 14, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Engine Management & Tuning

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-30-2002, 01:54 AM   #1
kaos200
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 2692
Join Date: Oct 2000
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: SoCal
Default Nice Widebands for tuning

Im going to order a wideband sensor for tuning, and Ive found one, but want to see what people are using? Anything nice and accurate for less than $300?
post whatever you've found though cheap or not and your opinion so people can find this thread in a search.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
kaos200 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 03:05 AM   #2
ScoobieSnaX
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 10844
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: location, location...
Vehicle:
2004 Acura TL Navi
Pearl

Default

I have an FJO unit purchased from Manitoba, Canada for ~$1200CAD. At this price it came with the PC conectivity kit which gives me the ability to connect my Palm or Laptop.

The quality of the unit is top notch. The best in the business IMO.

Where did you find one? The cheapest setup out there I think is the DIY kit. Anything under $300 would most likely be a narrow-band sensor (such as Greddy/HKS/etc).

ScoobieSnaX
ScoobieSnaX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 04:03 PM   #3
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by ScoobieSnaX
The quality of the unit is top notch. The best in the business IMO.
This is a gross exaggeration. The best A/F meters in the business are produced by Horiba and ETAS and cost several thousand dollars.

If you can find a source for it, the HKS A/F-Knock Amp appears to be an excellent tuning tool. Not only does it utilize the same wideband A/F sensor used by the FJO meter, but it also provides an amplified signal from the WRX's knock sensor that you monitor with headphones. It was discussed, briefly, in this thread:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=210933
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 04:39 PM   #4
D_REX
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 8945
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Houston, TX
Vehicle:
MY02 WRX
Blue

Default

The FJO unit came highly reccomended to me by a well respected tuner on this board. While it's not the best thing out there it's a good unit w/ decent logging capabilities.

I also looked at the Lambda Boy product. It's basically the same as the Tech Edge / DIY product, but assembled and tested with a sensor. I was recently tipped off to some sensors at a good price for the DIY so I ordered 2 of those today. I think I'm just going to order a kit from Tech Edge and do the assembly myself. It'll end up a pretty cheap, but relatively functional WB O2.
D_REX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 05:41 PM   #5
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by D_REX
The FJO unit came highly reccomended to me by a well respected tuner on this board. While it's not the best thing out there it's a good unit w/ decent logging capabilities.

I also looked at the Lambda Boy product. It's basically the same as the Tech Edge / DIY product, but assembled and tested with a sensor. I was recently tipped off to some sensors at a good price for the DIY so I ordered 2 of those today. I think I'm just going to order a kit from Tech Edge and do the assembly myself. It'll end up a pretty cheap, but relatively functional WB O2.
I was responding to the "best in the business" claim for the FJO and was too terse in my previous post. There is no doubt that the FJO meter is far superior to any meter that relies on a switching 0-1V O2 sensor. I was merely noting that other lab-grade wideband meters are far superior to the FJO if you need precise/known accuracy.

When I first stumbled on the LamdaBoy product a few months ago I, too, thought it was another DIY project knockoff. However, his website now indicates that his product is a digital-based design, instead of the analogue design developed by the DIY project. So the LambdaBoy product might be based on something similar to that described on this page: http://members.iinet.net.au/~metapro...I/DDL/DDL.html. In any event, I don't like the LambdaBoy "display." For more info, see http://www.lambdaboy.com.

TechEdge, which is in Australia, also offers a pre-assembled and tested meter. Make sure you have the sensor in hand, though, before you order it. There's nothing more frustrating than having the meter sitting on your desk, ready to go, and not being able to buy the correct sensor at a reasonable price. For more info on TechEdge, see http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/default.htm.
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 05:53 PM   #6
D_REX
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 8945
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Houston, TX
Vehicle:
MY02 WRX
Blue

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Jon [in CT]
I was responding to the "best in the business" claim for the FJO and was too terse in my previous post. There is no doubt that the FJO meter is far superior to any meter that relies on a switching 0-1V O2 sensor. I was merely noting that other lab-grade wideband meters are far superior to the FJO if you need precise/known accuracy.

When I first stumbled on the LamdaBoy product a few months ago I, too, thought it was another DIY project knockoff. However, his website now indicates that his product is a digital-based design, instead of the analogue design developed by the DIY project. So the LambdaBoy product might be based on something similar to that described on this page: http://members.iinet.net.au/~metapro...I/DDL/DDL.html. In any event, I don't like the LambdaBoy "display." For more info, see http://www.lambdaboy.com.

TechEdge, which is in Australia, also offers a pre-assembled and tested meter. Make sure you have the sensor in hand, though, before you order it. There's nothing more frustrating than having the meter sitting on your desk, ready to go, and not being able to buy the correct sensor at a reasonable price. For more info on TechEdge, see http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/default.htm.
I know your on the mailing list, I've seen you post. I ordered today from PartsBin as did lots of other people apparently. I should have sensors (I ordered 2 just in case) in hand by next Wed. I've already got a bung welded into my up pipe. now i just need to order and build the kit
D_REX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 06:14 PM   #7
rlavalle
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 18384
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Seattle 'burb (Kirkland)
Vehicle:
2004 STi: 580 AWHP
Java Black Pearl

Default

What price are you guys getting for the sensor through The Parts Bin?

I saw $139 from NAPA.

Thanks,
Russ
rlavalle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 06:57 PM   #8
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default

Given the recent near-total unavailability, I would pounce on any sensor priced under $150.
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 08:06 PM   #9
Midwayman
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 1997
Join Date: Jul 2000
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Des Plaines, IL
Vehicle:
2006 Acura TL 6spd
STMGM6 alumni

Default

I want a way to squeeze the voltage down from 0-4v to 0-1v. The link sets its a/f targets based on voltage, so it would be easy to fool it into using a w/b if this was possible.
Midwayman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 08:10 PM   #10
Midwayman
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 1997
Join Date: Jul 2000
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Des Plaines, IL
Vehicle:
2006 Acura TL 6spd
STMGM6 alumni

Talking

And a few link of interest

http://www.tragacs.com/wbo2.html
http://gadgetseller.com/gauges/
http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/default.htm
http://www.speedshop.org/detail.asp?PRODUCT_ID=NEDT-005
http://www.lambdaboy.com/

edit... check it out a DIY controler for like $25 in parts. (still needs sensor and connectors, etc. Should come in under $200 all said and done)
http://www.diy-efi.org/diy_efi/projects/diy_wb/

Last edited by Midwayman; 10-30-2002 at 08:26 PM.
Midwayman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2002, 11:08 PM   #11
yebokmj
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 2213
Join Date: Aug 2000
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raymond, NH USA
Vehicle:
1995 Impreza w/EJ257
Brilliant Red

Default Greddy A/F

I am using a Greddy A/F it's supposedly a wide band 02 sensor and heated. It gives you a reading in anologe and makes tuning quite easy. It's around the 300 mark not sure exactly where. It's the one on the left in the picture.
Joshua
yebokmj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2002, 02:43 PM   #12
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default Re: Greddy A/F

Quote:
Originally posted by yebokmj
I am using a Greddy A/F it's supposedly a wide band 02 sensor and heated. It gives you a reading in anologe and makes tuning quite easy.
I've read that Greddy doesn't recommend their A/F meter for tuning:
http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm/archive.../msg00813.html
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2002, 02:56 PM   #13
yebokmj
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 2213
Join Date: Aug 2000
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raymond, NH USA
Vehicle:
1995 Impreza w/EJ257
Brilliant Red

Default True but

The reason they suggest that is because it's not nessacerly calibrated 100% perfect. You can recalibrate it if need be after comparing it to a quality one like those used at dynos. I still use if for tuning but in combination with EGT. I would never want to rely on imput from one gague. My EGT is mounted with my boost on the A Pillar.
yebokmj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2002, 09:29 PM   #14
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default Re: True but

Quote:
Originally posted by yebokmj
You can recalibrate it if need be after comparing it to a quality one like those used at dynos.
Can you explain exactly how you recalibrate your Greddy? It was my impression that the Greddy had exactly two calibrations, the default 9:1 and the 11:1. I think that Greddy is, in essence, asking you to specify which air/fuel ratio corresponds to a particular sensor voltage in the rich region. As you can clearly see from this graph, a switching 0-1V O2 sensor's voltage is HIGHLY dependent on EGT in the rich region. BTW, this graph's X-axis depicts lambda values. To convert lambda to A/F ratio, multiply by the fuel's stoichiometric A/F ratio.
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2002, 09:35 PM   #15
yebokmj
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 2213
Join Date: Aug 2000
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raymond, NH USA
Vehicle:
1995 Impreza w/EJ257
Brilliant Red

Default Mulitlple

I'm not sure how to calibrate it but it says you can in the directions and I don't have them in front of me it's something on the control box not the gauge. I also believe it has 4 setting for what your refering to.
Joshua
yebokmj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2002, 10:09 PM   #16
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default Re: Mulitlple

Quote:
Originally posted by yebokmj
I'm not sure how to calibrate it but it says you can in the directions and I don't have them in front of me it's something on the control box not the gauge. I also believe it has 4 setting for what your refering to.
What a coincidence. My graph, above, has four EGT profiles. Please let us know more when you find the directions.
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2002, 11:27 PM   #17
nmyeti
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4980
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Albuquerque, NM USA
Default Re: Greddy A/F

Quote:
Originally posted by yebokmj
I am using a Greddy A/F it's supposedly a wide band 02 sensor and heated. It gives you a reading in anologe and makes tuning quite easy. It's around the 300 mark not sure exactly where. It's the one on the left in the picture.
Joshua
Joshua,
Just a word of warning; one of our customers came in to the shop with a Greddy A/F meter that was at best 2 full A/F points rich in most conditions. At worst it was totally worthless.

I'd stay far away from one of these!

-Nathan
nmyeti is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2002, 01:14 AM   #18
yebokmj
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 2213
Join Date: Aug 2000
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raymond, NH USA
Vehicle:
1995 Impreza w/EJ257
Brilliant Red

Default Thanks

Okay well as I mentioned I do have an EGT which is what many people tune by alone. I have been using this same gauge for well over a year in combination with EGT with great success on two NA Turboed Impreza engines. I am aware it's not 100% but if you compare it using a scan tool to the readings coming off a factory sensor as I have done, I found it's dead on. Not only that but the gauge does have a warm up feature where it flashes it's lights untill it's up to proper operating temperature. This makes sure your aware that it's not giving a proper reading. I deffinatly would like to get the calibration of it checked though and I do plan to at a dyno day. I would deffinatly go with this over an autometer setup or those other blinking light setups. Thanks for the imput though.
Joshua
yebokmj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2002, 08:54 PM   #19
roberto arano
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 28311
Join Date: Oct 2002
Default Egortech/egormeter wideband Gar Willis

Any one heard the Egormeter, by EGORTECH?

It's a wideband, I talked to the company and may buy one,but I can't find anyone who actually OWNS one.
roberto arano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2002, 09:09 PM   #20
Jon [in CT]
*** Banned ***
 
Member#: 2992
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Connecticut, USA
Vehicle:
02 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default Re: Egortech/egormeter wideband Gar Willis

Quote:
Originally posted by roberto arano
Any one heard the Egormeter, by EGORTECH?

It's a wideband, I talked to the company and may buy one,but I can't find anyone who actually OWNS one.
Roberto, thanks for the post. It prompted me to search around the internet for traces of Garfield Willis, the guy behind EGOR. He dropped out of sight a couple of years ago promising that he would soon be supplying affordable wideband A/F meters. And then nothing, until your post prompted me to search again. And now he has a new website, url=http://www.egortech.com, which doesn't seem to have been updated for quite a while.

First of all, you should read an i-Clup post I submitted because of research prompted by Roberto's post: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=269143.

My search has led to these posts, which mostly denigrate the current DIY-WB controller and its developers, but nonetheless, offer food for thought:
http://www.diy-efi.org/mhonarchive/efi332/msg00052.html
http://www.diy-efi.org/mhonarchive/efi332/msg00060.html

And people in i-Club thought I was caustic.
Jon [in CT] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2002, 11:55 PM   #21
Ryan23
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 15116
Join Date: Feb 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Newburg, MD
Vehicle:
2000 Ver6 STi Type-R
EJ257/GT35R

Default Re: Re: Greddy A/F

Quote:
Originally posted by nmyeti


Joshua,
Just a word of warning; one of our customers came in to the shop with a Greddy A/F meter that was at best 2 full A/F points rich in most conditions. At worst it was totally worthless.

I'd stay far away from one of these!

-Nathan
/Nods. Yep, mine was off and no, it's not a wideband. If you want a real wideband expect to pay for it

Ryan
Ryan23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2002, 06:33 PM   #22
downshift1
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 15607
Join Date: Feb 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Somewhere out there
Vehicle:
I'm not the type
to make angry

Default

I can get FJO wideband setups for pretty cheap (I'm not a vendor, just passing along a good deal ) if anyone is interested PM me.

-Dylan
downshift1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Nice mellow driving tunes thread.......not!!! jason t Vancouver Impreza Club Forum -- VIC 10 12-06-2009 03:49 AM
wideband O2 sensor AFTER a cat acceptable for tuning? rex n effect Engine Management & Tuning 11 12-12-2005 04:52 PM
exhaust leak and wideband O2 tuning. Kwyjibo Engine Management & Tuning 1 12-31-2003 03:33 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.