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Old 11-02-2002, 02:13 PM   #1
tnbd
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Default Wrx 5sp grief (1st, 2nd, rev, 5th) - advice? (longish)

Yeah this is another one of these threads. I am hoping to solve these issues without wasting more time (the dealers or mine) or money (mine or SOAs). It seems another brain would be useful tackling this issue.

I really like my WRX. It is a great car. Except for the gearbox.
There have been little mechanical gremlins in the gearbox for the last 10 -15k miles (the car has around 45k).

The car:
Except for summer 17" tires the car is stock. It has not been autoxed, dragged, or tracked. ( I did a snow driving school but that was at speeds of 30). I do not drop the clutch etc. My dealer (they rock) has done a clutch and trany repair under warranty and has seen no signs of mis-use.

History:
My dealer has been working with me to solve the problem. This is good.
The car has had issues with intermittent grinding going into 1st and reverse from neutral when the car was stopped. Reverse would also bind a lot when it did not grind. Since the car had standard early WRX clutch shudder and deceleration noises the dealer replaced the clutch. They tought it might be a bad bearing. This made the grind worse but they were able to reproduce it for the first time. Neither the tech or the service manager could make sense of why the gears were grinding. They called SOA and next replaced 1st and syncro as well as reverse. The gears they replaced all looked good to the eye. There were no signs that I had been doing anything improper. The grind when shifting from neutral has not appeared since. This is good.


Current (edited 11/5):
I still am having issues.
Reverse still binds alot - this happened before the repair. I can go into gear from stopped at neutral ~30% of the time. The rest of the time it binds right as I start to move the shift lever back. Started grinding.

5th just started binding after the repair. If I am stopped in neutral 70% of the time I can not get into 5th. The lever moves 1/2 way up and binds. No grinding just a bind. I have had no issues when moving. (I am not sure why I would want to go into 5th from neutral but it is a symptom possibly of what is going on in 5th.)

When the tranny is warm I oft have issue shifting into 1st at low speed (5 or so) with out double clutching. 1st binds. First binds a bit more then it did before the repair.

(added 11/05)
1st does not always release the gear smoothly. it is sometimes grabby.
(/add)

Second has started binding after the repair. If I try to go from 3rd to 2nd at 20 -> 30mph the lever will sometimes bind. When I then double clutch I get in with out issue. (added 11/05) the syncros def. don't always. (/add)

(added 11/06)
4th and 3rd bound from neutral for the first time tonight.
(/add)

Any useful thoughts as to what might be going on?


Thanks all
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Last edited by tnbd; 11-07-2002 at 02:54 PM.
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Old 11-02-2002, 02:27 PM   #2
Ver.III
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Reverse has no syncro so it will not always go in when you come to a stop. Normally, putting it into another gear (1st) and then reverse would solve it.

It could be possible that the shift fork rod detents could be intermittenly sticking. The detents are arranged in a way that it prevents you shifting 2 forks and selecting 2 gears at one time. There are 3 springs and metal check balls that can be accessed from outside the gearbox, but it sounds like it coud be internal.
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Old 11-02-2002, 05:42 PM   #3
tnbd
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Agreed on reverse.

Time to get the service manuals I think.
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Old 11-03-2002, 04:35 AM   #4
Shinji N
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advice? Don't buy a subaru with a 5mt.


I'm starting to think that the binding might be from transmission case flexing or something along that line. I started leaving my hand on the shifter while driving and noticed that the stick really moves around when I'm accelerating/decelerating.
I took it up to 3000 in third then took my foot off the gas; felt the tranny flex. I then let the car decelerate and clutched in and tried to shift into second without double clutching at around 25mph. No go.

Next I started accelerating in third gear to about 3000. Then instead of clutching in and shifting into fourth I clutched in and shifted it into second (without letting the car decelerate) as if I had been trying to go into fourth. It went in smooth as silk and this was at 40+mph!
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Old 11-03-2002, 04:43 AM   #5
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i've had the reverse problem.. i just take my foot off the clutch and put it back in... goes into reverse everytime.. as for 1st and 2nd... usually (and this is me and my car and my experience might be diff from person to person or car to car) but my 1st goes in after i put it in 2nd then first 99% of the time for me.. if i go straight from 3rd to first it wont engage (for me), but when i put it in second (with clutch engaged) then put it to 1st, it goes in..

of course i have an 03 and i hear they changed the tranny so... eh just saying from personal exp. with my car... hope this helps and if not....... i tried
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Old 11-03-2002, 11:11 AM   #6
tnbd
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Shinji N-
On other gearboxes, I understand it is long term bad for the syncros to leave a hand on the shifter while driving. Dunno about the 5mt.
The shifter moves back and forth on most (all? I do not remember the BMW or the Audi) manuals I have driven. Some one else may be able to explain why.
I really doubt (hope) my issues are not due to flexing as I am shifting from neutral with the engine idling ~500rpm. The system would have a realy light load.

ThaTaint -
Your gearbox is working better then mine - but mine has been in a steady decline the last 10-15k miles. If I do the foot off/neutral thing it takes 4 or so tries to get into reverse.

5th and reverse should share some parts in common. They have the same symptoms - 5th should not bind.
I expect ver.III is on the right track with the shift fork rod detents. (thanks ver.III). On mon I need to track down the service manuals.
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Old 11-03-2002, 03:47 PM   #7
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yeah its true.. you got about 36k more miles on your car than me so it could be wear on the gearbox sad to hear your problems man hope all goes well
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Old 11-05-2002, 11:33 AM   #8
dbarnblatt
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Default Trasmission movement

The shifter in most cars will move around because it is attached to the transmission, which is attached to the engine. The engine/transmission is attached to the chassis with mounts that contain a firm rubber (to prevent engine noise and vibration to enter the cabin) The mounts flex and the whole engine/transmission move under the inertia generated by the engine.
Next time you have the hood open have a friend rev the engine and you will see the engine/transmission rock back and forth. Since this movement also absorbs a slight amount of power you can install firmer mounts made by STi and the like to prevent the engine/transmission from moving and transfer that loss directly to the wheels.

Solution the transmission problem:
Have the dealer replace the transmission with a new one. VW and Audi do this sort of service all the time. They save in labor (not having to rebuild it) They try to diagnose the problem and if it is found to be internal they swap it. Then they send the old tranny back to VWoA and have them rebuild it and offer it as a factory rebuild to their network of dealers or independant shops. Very efficient. If there is something wrong and the dealer has been messing with it over and over... have them replace it. It is a lemon.


Quote:
Originally posted by Shinji N
advice? Don't buy a subaru with a 5mt.


I'm starting to think that the binding might be from transmission case flexing or something along that line. I started leaving my hand on the shifter while driving and noticed that the stick really moves around when I'm accelerating/decelerating.
I took it up to 3000 in third then took my foot off the gas; felt the tranny flex. I then let the car decelerate and clutched in and tried to shift into second without double clutching at around 25mph. No go.

Next I started accelerating in third gear to about 3000. Then instead of clutching in and shifting into fourth I clutched in and shifted it into second (without letting the car decelerate) as if I had been trying to go into fourth. It went in smooth as silk and this was at 40+mph!

Last edited by dbarnblatt; 11-05-2002 at 11:41 AM.
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Old 11-05-2002, 10:03 PM   #9
tnbd
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Dbarnblatt-

I have not had a chance yet to talk with the dealer this week, but hope to in the next few days. They have a few more shots at doing what they will to fix it before I start making demands. Reverse ground on me today on a stopped neutral -> rev shift, so chances are good that it is not the gears proper. I need to get the service manuals when I have a chance and try to figure out what is happening. There is def something wrong with 5th/rev.

Have a good one
tndb
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Old 11-08-2002, 11:03 AM   #10
tnbd
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Talked with the Service manager on wed and he gave SOA technical a ring. On wed eve he was waiting for more informaiton from SOA. The problems are getting worse since then. The Sevice Manager at the dealer is out for a while and the service advisors had no notes of what was going on. I gave SOA customer service a ring. They are going to try to find what is going on. Hopefully this will hit some sort of resolution soon.
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Old 11-10-2002, 09:32 PM   #11
WRXBob
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I have the 1st and reverse problem + clutch shudder. They replaced bunch of internal part and shifter assembly. Now it shifts like a dream, no grind in reverse and first and no grind when shifted quickly from rolling stop. They also fix the clutch shudder on 3rd attemp. After the second clutch set, they called me, yes they called me for a 3rd set. And it has been very good so far.
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Old 12-10-2002, 09:53 PM   #12
tnbd
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My tranny was finally replaced.

The Good:
The syncros now work. Most of the notchyness is gone and I have yet to have a grind. I can shift into first and second from a stopped neutral with out a bind.

The Bad:
5th, 4th and reverse still bind from a stopped neutral.

The Ugly:
My credit card bill -Factory service manuals are on order.

Any usefull thoughts?
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