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Old 02-28-2001, 09:30 PM   #1
Bob O
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Member#: 1502
Join Date: May 2000
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Felton, PA, USA
Vehicle:
2000 2.5RS & SV1kS
BRP

Question Performance Winter Tire Opinions Wanted

Hey all , i am just trolling for an opinion concerning my upcoming tire choices. I flatted one of my RE92 and I will not replace it with the same, so I figured that I would look into the winter stuff considering that I will be running a summer tire when it's warm. Since we don't get snow that often here on the border of PA/MD and I really haven't head any trouble with the re92's unless I was screwing around, I figured one of the winter performance tires would be right up my alley. Now to the opinion part, I have narrowed my search to the Dunlop Winter M2 Sport in 205/55 R16 for $95 and the Michelin Pilot Alpin in 205/50 R16 for $109. The problem is that I think I like the Dunlop better (just a gut feeling) but I can only get it in the 55 aspect size and I really wanted to go to 50. I will eventually lower the car with P1 bits . Those with p1 suspension or other, can you tell me if the stock size tire and wheel fits without any rubbing? From what I can determine it will fit, so I don't NEED the lower aspect ratio. For those that have changed aspect ratio, does it make a big differece in handling/looks? For those you who may have tried these tires, could you comment on the performace, snow and dry? Lastly, does going to the lower aspect ratio even make sense given that these are winter tires and I will have my fill of low profile rubber during the summer (205/45 17 on OZ p1's)?

thanks for your help
Bob
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Old 02-28-2001, 10:30 PM   #2
Miracle Worker
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Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Northampton PA
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2000 2.5 RS Sedona
Red (Chicken Katcher)

Post

Honestly, I looked at them both and I went with the Pirelli 210 Snowsports. Thats cause I wanted more performance. They handle great in the snow and don't fold or loose traction when it's dry. I'm not totally sure about the dunlops but the alpines are more geared toward snow.
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Old 03-01-2001, 10:21 AM   #3
craigc
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Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: San Carlos, CA, 94070
Post

I run the Dunlop Wintersport M2 in a 195/65 15's on OEM alloys. As you know, you're never going to get great performance for a winter tire, but the Wintersports are bearable of a dry tire. There is more understeer in turn in, fold slightly, but have fairly good grip. In snow, they're great. I would say they're dry performance is similar to the old RE 92
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Old 03-01-2001, 10:29 AM   #4
RidinLow
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Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: NJ
Vehicle:
1995 325i
Arctic Gray

Post

<table border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="2" width="505">
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Real World Road Ride Ratings</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass"><a href="../bridgestone/bs_lm22.jsp">Bridgestone

Blizzak LM-22</a></td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass"><a href="../dunlop/du_wintersportm2.jsp">Dunlop

Winter Sport M2</a></td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass"><a href="../pirelli/pi_snowsport.jsp">Pirelli

Winter 210 SnowSport</a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Ride Comfort</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.89</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">7.06</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.94</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Noise Comfort</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.59</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.87</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.01</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Handling</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.94</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.30</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">7.07</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Road Rating</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.81</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.74</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.67</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Ice Rink Drive Ratings</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">Ice</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">Ice</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">Ice</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Acceleration</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.44</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.39</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.14</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Braking</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.47</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.31</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.27</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Cornering</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.42</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.27</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.37</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Handling</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.32</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.17</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.24</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Track Rating</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.41</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.29</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.26</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Combined</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.01</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.91</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.86</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Ice Rink Drive Results</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">60 ft. Accel

(In Seconds)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">Cornering

(# Cones Hit)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">60 ft. Accel

(In Seconds)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">Cornering

(# Cones Hit)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">60 ft. Accel

(In Seconds)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">Cornering

(# Cones Hit)</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Averages</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">5.86</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">3.20</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">5.93</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">3.40</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">6.10</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">3.24</td>
</tr>
</table>

From the Tire Rack: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...perftest_2.htm
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Old 03-01-2001, 10:31 AM   #5
RidinLow
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Member#: 329
Join Date: Sep 1999
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: NJ
Vehicle:
1995 325i
Arctic Gray

Post

<table border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="2" width="505">
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Real World Road Ride Ratings</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass"><a href="../bridgestone/bs_lm22.jsp">Bridgestone

Blizzak LM-22</a></td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass"><a href="../dunlop/du_wintersportm2.jsp">Dunlop

Winter Sport M2</a></td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass"><a href="../pirelli/pi_snowsport.jsp">Pirelli

Winter 210 SnowSport</a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Ride Comfort</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.89</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">7.06</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.94</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Noise Comfort</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.59</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.87</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.01</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Handling</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.94</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.30</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">7.07</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Road Rating</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.81</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.74</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.67</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Ice Rink Drive Ratings</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">Ice</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">Ice</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">Ice</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Acceleration</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.44</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.39</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.14</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Braking</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.47</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.31</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.27</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Cornering</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.42</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.27</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.37</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Handling</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.32</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.17</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.24</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Track Rating</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.41</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.29</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.26</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Combined</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">6.01</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.91</td>
<td colspan="2" align="center" class="mainclass">5.86</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Ice Rink Drive Results</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">60 ft. Accel

(In Seconds)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">Cornering

(# Cones Hit)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">60 ft. Accel

(In Seconds)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">Cornering

(# Cones Hit)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">60 ft. Accel

(In Seconds)</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">Cornering

(# Cones Hit)</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="mainclass">Averages</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">5.86</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">3.20</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">5.93</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">3.40</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">6.10</td>
<td class="mainclass" align="center">3.24</td>
</tr>
</table>

From the Tire Rack: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...perftest_2.htm

Can anybody tell me how to get rid of that big-ass gap above the table???
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Old 03-01-2001, 02:44 PM   #6
cj917
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MY96 outback wagon

Post

i also run Dunlop WinterSport M2's, stock size 205/55-16 on stock rims

i agree with craigc that they are about the same on dry with (new) RE92's, but so much better on wet and slush... on snow, acceleration and braking is very good, but cornering is a bit off though (i.e. doesn't grip as well as i like them to) i think part of that might be because of its not-as-stiff sidewalls
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Old 03-01-2001, 03:27 PM   #7
OG
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Location: Centerport(L.I.),NY,USA
Vehicle:
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2000 Silverado

Thumbs up

I'll chime in for the Pilot Alpins. I've run 195-65-15's for two winters and and I have to say they are a bit better than the 205-55-16 RE92's on dry roads, and they make them look like slicks in anything else.
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Old 03-01-2001, 04:17 PM   #8
Jon Bogert
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09 GTR, 02 996 C4S
95 993 C4, 71 911, 04 STI

Question

Bob, did you consider the LM-22s? They're pretty darn good if you don't plan on driving through really deep snow.
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Old 03-01-2001, 04:29 PM   #9
Pilot
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Post

I'll just say I like the Pilot Alpins the best. If you want to know why do a search on my name. It should yeild oh say 100 posts on the subject of winter tires.

No I do not work for Michelin, I picked taht tag for another reason.
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Old 03-01-2001, 06:03 PM   #10
gavin
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Location: Portland, OR USA
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Post

I ran Toyo Observes all winter, and was really happy with them. Very livable in wet/dry, too - no hydroplaning.

Decent enough performance, and very quiet.
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Old 03-02-2001, 07:26 AM   #11
cwhalgren
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Location: Rockaway, NJ
Vehicle:
2007 WRB Sports XT

Question

Hmm... My first reaction is that it's only two more weeks till spring.

I think I would wait till next season to get winter tires since you already said that you don't get snow very often on the PA/MD boarder. -Just something for you to consider.
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Old 03-02-2001, 10:19 AM   #12
GTBGUY
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Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
'99 BGP Legacy GT
'98 QS Legacy L (auto)

Post

Try the Nokian Hakka NRW's they're rated as an All-Season tire for the wear properties, but they are a great winter tire (I'm using them on all my cars). They are H rated as well

www.nokiantyres.com
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Old 03-02-2001, 10:28 AM   #13
llonman
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Location: Hampstead, MD, USA
Vehicle:
97 Impreza OBS
Green

Post

I know that I will probably hear alot of flack about this. But why not run All-seasons in the winter. I too live NW of Baltimore and we have only seen 3 smowstorms here. With a good set of H rated All-seasons you should be fine. FWIW, I run Dunlop D60's in stock size 205/60/15 on my OBS during the winter. They are a good tire and if not for them being kinda wide they work well for the weather here and the traffic. When it snows here you can go over 15 MPH anyway due to traffic. I think the key is to replace the All-season tires when they start to lose a little tread depth.(20-35K) I will be getting a new set of D60's for the front this winter. I have heard the Nokia All-seasons are great in the snow.
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Old 03-02-2001, 07:58 PM   #14
blaster88
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1999 Suzuki Samurai
Blackish

Post

I have a Renault GTA that stinks in the snow on its 195/50/15's - I put Pirelli 210 Assimetricos on it, and it could actually get around in the snow.

But in the dry, it was weird.
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Old 03-02-2001, 08:09 PM   #15
Michael
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99 RS Turbo
Graphite Gray Pearl

Post

i got a set of the LM-22 on my car now...
and they are AWSOME !!!

michael
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Old 03-02-2001, 08:33 PM   #16
adhowe70
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1982 Reynard
Blue, Red, and White

Post

I'm a Blizzak fan. I spent my first weekend in the snow with my RS TSD rallying (500 miles of snow) and I didn't set a wheel wrong the whole time. I run the MZ-01's. They are fantastic on ice and packed snow. They are not very good in the deep stuff and are OK on bare pavement. The best part? These are studless!
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