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Old 04-09-2001, 03:34 PM   #1
hondaconvert
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Question ground control coil overs

if you go to the links on i- club you will find a website called complete autosport. anyway, they offer to sell ground control coil overs for about $380. now, i have been searching for coilovers and they all seem a bit pricey for my funds. i was wondering if anyone has any info. on these coilovers or any feed back from individuals who have proably purchased them. everyone seems to favor leda, dms, progressive h&r...blah blah blah, it goes on and on. any feed back would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 04-09-2001, 03:37 PM   #2
bsquare
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Don't confuse kits to cobble together coilovers from normal struts and some new parts with prupose built coilovers like DMS, Tein, etc.

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Old 04-09-2001, 03:41 PM   #3
hondaconvert
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ok...technical feedback would be better
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Old 04-09-2001, 03:53 PM   #4
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I think what he meant to say was that the ground control "coilover" is so cheap because it isn't a true coilover, it is a coilover conversion. it mounts to your struts (KYB are a favorite, don't use the stock ones) and allows the ride height adjustability of a coilover. My friend has a coilover conversion o nhis civic... and personally i think it rides like crap. way too stiff, but the car is nice and low, and it is damn stable... he can slalom the bott's dots on the e-way at 100+ without loosing it. car doesn't lean at all. but the overall consensus is you get what you pay for, a set of ground controls and decent shocks is going to set you back about $700-$800, compare that to true coilovers at $1200-$2000 or more and you'll see what you're looking at... a cheap lookalike. I would strongly suggest against coilover conversions based upon my experience with that civic.
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Old 04-09-2001, 04:23 PM   #5
RidinLow
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Ok, I have to jump in here. I had GC coilovers on my RS & they were wonderful. They were incredibly stiff and were awesome at the track, but that was only because I speced them that way! You don't choose 300 lb/in 8" Eibach springs to cruise down the boulevard. I say if you want the adjustability of a coilover but don't need to rally the car off road, the GC's are definitely the way to go. Just make sure you pick the right spring rate and shocks. Ground Control only sells the conversion sleeves.
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Old 04-09-2001, 04:53 PM   #6
fatty mcgee
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just wanted to add my 2 cents. i had GC's and Koni's on my old civic and they kicked butt. they were extremely stiff and very similar to your friends' civic that you described... until i trimmed the bump stops! perhaps your friend is riding on the bump stops?
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Old 04-09-2001, 06:16 PM   #7
drftsub
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Ok I think most folks on this forum know I am a big fan of GC. ( Used to work there ) now, you can get the setup to work correctly for your needs if you set up the kit right, as far as Safir's friends civic it sounds as if it is one of 2 things , a) his car is just plain too low, the kit will let you lower the car past a functional point, you should know your car before you go that low. B) his shocks are crap, or his bumpstops arent cut. There is a possibility that they are not GC coilovers as well, there are alot of imatations in the honda market that suck.
That said, you can get a good ride ( if this is what you desire ) or great handling, or if you are willing to trade off a little bit you can get a good/decent ride and good handling. If you have a little extra cash you can go with double springs and have a great ride and great handling. GC can set you up with what you need, just call them and ask. I am curious to know what good true coilover you can get for 1200, that is pretty cheap for a coilover setup and may be very low end. I personally love GC stuff, I run it on my track car ,which is with GAB super R's and reaaly stiff rates and it rides firm but not bone jarring harsh. I have had it on about 6 street cars and my WRX will have it to.

Nate
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Old 04-09-2001, 06:39 PM   #8
hondaconvert
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i guess it all depends on what my intentions for the car are. im not going to rally any time soon since i live in nyc. maybe an auto x in the late future. most of all i want a car that handles great for a daily driver.(not that it doesn't already)coil overs sound good to me because i can always adjust the height as for progressive springs i would be aced out. after a big snowstorm and the tons of salt that devours the streets and creates craters on the road you would definately want to rais e the car for the winter. well , keep it coming. you be surprised how much one can learn from these forums. by the way no pun intended bsquare.
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Old 04-09-2001, 09:36 PM   #9
Tkacik
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Hey, my time to chime in here I have had the GC KYB setup on my car for about 3 months now and I love this setup, the ride is a bit harsh but very tolerable. Personally I like a very stiff setup so maybe that is why it dosent bother me much. Well worth the money.
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Old 04-10-2001, 01:40 PM   #10
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Yes, provide us with that information & we'll be happy to suggest spring types.
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Old 04-10-2001, 02:53 PM   #11
Chazzworth
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I would highly recommend GC coil-overs. If you tell the guys at GC what you want and what you expect you can get a good spring rate. Just tell them what you want and what you use your car for and you will be set. Just watch out for cheap Imitations
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Old 04-10-2001, 03:01 PM   #12
drftsub
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Rykenden,
Yes I know that the other thread has gotten to be quite out of hand, ( and to think I was just tryin to help ) anyway, just call GC up and tell them what you plan on doing with the car etc. Let them know you want to to a tender setup and such, they will hook you up correctly, also, if you happen to have alot of extra weight ( ie speakers etc ) make sure you let them know.
Nate
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Old 04-10-2001, 04:50 PM   #13
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The guys at GC are very, very nice and will get you exactly what you want for about $900, with AGX and their coilover sleeves.

These will be very nice for 99% of driving. The other 1% most people don't do anyway, don't sweat that.

I considered them, but i decided to be a purist and go for a "true" coilover setup. The stuff i'm getting is from TRi, it's new, it's basically TEIN, and i'm excited about it. It's also about $200 more than the GC for everything but the tops with 24-position adjustability, yada, yada, yada...think HA.

GC will do everything you want them to.
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Old 04-10-2001, 08:41 PM   #14
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ok. thanks for the tips everyone.
extra weight is one thing I would of never thought of.
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Old 04-11-2001, 12:54 AM   #15
Rykenden
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Nate:
I followed that other topic regarding coilovers, but uhhh... it's gotten quite messy.

anyways, I'm considering a GC/KYB setup because I need the adjustability for winter. What type of information should I provide to the folks at GC when I talk to them?

Driving habits/intentions, spring rates (I would like a tender/main setup), etc etc.?
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Old 04-11-2001, 05:58 AM   #16
rpone605
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I have the ground control/kyb agx setup on my car...the spring rates are 340f/300r the ride in the car is really stiff compared to stock but you don't get the banging and clunking noises like you get when you just do drop springs on stock shocks.

The handling of the car is awesome...almost no body roll but just enough so you can sling the car through turns. We took it out to an autocross and the car is super fast elimanted almost all the understeer with that setup and my 17's with kuhmo's on there.

Hope this helps.

Ryan
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Old 04-11-2001, 11:49 AM   #17
GarySheehan
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What's all this talk about a "true" coilover set-up? Most cars on the road today have "true" coilover suspensions. Which is a spring that is mounted on a shock or strut body.

Then you have an adjustable height coilover. These are one of two types: 1.) a threaded sleeve that slips onto ANY type of shock, whether it be an inexpensive AGX or a full on dedicated racing shock or 2.) a threaded shock body around an inexpensive shock internal all the way up to full on race internals.

Buyer beware, not all threaded shock body adjustable ride height coil-overs are superior quality or performance. Some suck, some are good, some are awesome. On the other hand, using a sleeve type adjustable perch, you can put together a cheapo suspension that isn't too sophisticated or, selecting the right components, a suspension to rival the best threaded shock body set-ups.

I think a threaded shock body may have slightly better heat dissipation (less metal around the oil) and could be lighter (depends on the shock body material of both applications). Some advantages of the sleeve application are they can be modified, moved to different shocks (even those that are threaded), use a standard spring diameter with a huge number of rates and lengths and are very easily replaced if damaged.

I guess I just get a little wierd when I hear folks using the term "true" coilover, which to me (opinion) implies that non-threaded shock bodies are inferior.

Gary
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Old 04-11-2001, 02:12 PM   #18
Joel Gat, 1.8L
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Hello,

Gary, whilst I'm somewhat in agreement with you on this, I think you downplayed one thing: "I think a threaded shock body may have slightly better heat dissipation". Shocks like the carrera shocks are threaded from top to bottom pretty much. With a standard length of shock, you've got 2x to 3x the surface area. The cooling is vastly superior...

But, to everyone else, how many of you are foaming or fading your shocks from overheating? If you are overheating, maybe contact your shock manufacturer and have them spec you a better shock oil (BTW, GC's Advanced Design is user serviceable and you could replace your oil yourself, pretty darn quickly).

But if you really are overheating your high quality shocks (by that, I mean anything from Konis to AGXs to whatever) then you should consider moving to an external reservoir full racing suspension - something like the $6500 DMS 60mm setup or similar Ohlins or the like. Aside from pro racecar drivers, I doubt many track junkies could successfully foam a simple set of Koni shocks even.

Joel
edit: BTW, in all the various rental cars I've raced, including the Sunfire I took rally-crossing, I don't think I came anywhere near overheating the shocks. I think you'd need an extended length race over a bumpy surface to foam even stock shocks.

So the only question is whether the shock provides the damping you want in compression and in rebound. Sleeve or no, if the damping is sufficient for your spring and your taste, it's good enough for you. For some budgets, that's non-height adjustble setups and for some, that's full racing $6500+ suspensions.

[This message has been edited by Joel Gat, 1.8L (edited April 11, 2001).]
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Old 04-12-2001, 12:02 AM   #19
drftsub
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Gary you are the man. I have to agree with your post 1000%, especially this part :

On the other hand, using a sleeve type adjustable perch, you can put together a cheapo suspension that isn't too sophisticated or, selecting the right components, a suspension to rival the best threaded shock body set-ups.

anywho, I just had to reply.

Nate

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