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Old 06-14-2003, 06:23 PM   #1
kastle
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Default I've got the power!

Took my car to do some tuning today, over @ Dyno Comp in Scottsdale, AZ. They use a Dyno Dynamics unit. CT (AZscoobie) and I were tuning my RS-T. We needed to get some spots out of the AFR and I wanted to ensure that all the tuning I had done was clean.

So, before I started tuning it, it put out:
13psi w/91 octane gas
220whp @ 5700 RPM's
260ft torque @ 3900 RPM's


After we tuned the car:
15psi w/91 octane gas
250whp @ 5700 RPM's
275ft torque @ 4300 RPM's


And then we dropped in the good stuff (100 octane)
17psi w/100 octane gas
287whp @ 5700RPM's
309ft torque @ 4500RPMs



This last pic is a comparison of the first run and the best run..
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Last edited by kastle; 06-15-2003 at 02:22 AM.
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Old 06-14-2003, 06:29 PM   #2
AaronB
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Looks like my motor is going to good use
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Old 06-14-2003, 07:12 PM   #3
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Sounds cool but I want to see what a new Forester motor can do with some upgrades in the GM body car.

So what boost did you finally tune it to since you have to consider what gas your going to be running daily? Did you tune it with some margin of error for extremely hot days or did you go all out?
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Old 06-14-2003, 07:37 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by N/A
Sounds cool but I want to see what a new Forester motor can do with some upgrades in the GM body car.

So what boost did you finally tune it to since you have to consider what gas your going to be running daily? Did you tune it with some margin of error for extremely hot days or did you go all out?
We tuned it for 15psi and to handle the 105+ temps that we see here in PHX every day during the summer. That being said, I have it set @ 13 psi for daily driving, giving me some margin of safety. We did the runs @ 17psi with race gas to prove a point, pretty much...
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Old 06-14-2003, 08:24 PM   #5
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Sorry can't remember you details, have you done any internal work or anything?
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Old 06-15-2003, 01:36 AM   #6
kastle
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Built lowend (pistons and rods), FAT stage 2, tec-II, STi v4 tranny.
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Old 06-15-2003, 03:49 AM   #7
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Sweet! waiting for the 301 whp heheh...

with your torque tho how is the Ver4 tranny holding up... i need an upgrade too.. if your tranny goes (knock) what are you planning to do?
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Old 06-15-2003, 04:32 AM   #8
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What compression is your bottom end? And does that type of dyno tend to read high or low or about average?
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Old 06-15-2003, 08:40 AM   #9
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<sarcasm warning>
The sentences below contain content of extreme sarcasm, do not read if you have a weak mind.
</sarcasm warning>


I can see the torque curve on those graphs, the nice flat one, but where's the power curve? And what's the odd shaped curve?


Paul
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Old 06-15-2003, 04:18 PM   #10
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Quote:
with your torque tho how is the Ver4 tranny holding up... i need an upgrade too.. if your tranny goes (knock) what are you planning to do?
Version 4 is doing very well. Holds the power and has plenty of room. I attribute that to the AP Racing Group N clutch.


Quote:
What compression is your bottom end? And does that type of dyno tend to read high or low or about average?
It's a dyno dynamics, tends to read about 30-40 hp lower then a dyno pak or jet. Compression is 8.5:1
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Old 06-15-2003, 05:55 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by kastle
It's a dyno dynamics, tends to read about 30-40 hp lower then a dyno pak or jet. Compression is 8.5:1
Nice... what type of A/F ratio targets are you acheiving along the way? And what do the EGT's look like along a WOT run? I'm curious how optomized the tune is as the numbers do seem somewhat lower then expected.
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Old 06-15-2003, 06:42 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by 8Complex
Nice... what type of A/F ratio targets are you acheiving along the way? And what do the EGT's look like along a WOT run? I'm curious how optomized the tune is as the numbers do seem somewhat lower then expected.
AFR looked really good. AZScoobie tuned the AFR first then we did timing. If you want a tec2 datalog of a pull, I can send you one....

EGT's are kind of worthless, since the probe is in the collector. Saw as high as 800*, which is the highest I've seen other then a track day.
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Old 06-16-2003, 12:08 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by kastle
AFR looked really good. AZScoobie tuned the AFR first then we did timing. If you want a tec2 datalog of a pull, I can send you one....

EGT's are kind of worthless, since the probe is in the collector. Saw as high as 800*, which is the highest I've seen other then a track day.
Yeah, I'd love to take a look at a pull log. I'll PM you my email address in just a minute.

High 800's... well, 871C = 1500F. Which collector did you have the EGT probe in... between cylinders or the collector just before the uppipe?
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Old 06-16-2003, 01:33 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by 8Complex
Yeah, I'd love to take a look at a pull log. I'll PM you my email address in just a minute.

High 800's... well, 871C = 1500F. Which collector did you have the EGT probe in... between cylinders or the collector just before the uppipe?
Just before the uppipe
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Old 06-16-2003, 01:46 PM   #15
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nice work! wish I had those numbers, then again, wish I had the built up lower end.

Wiseco or J&E Pistons? Pauter rods I assume. Who did you get to do the bottom end, did you have to get the block bored at all, or was it an easy piston swap?

awesome numbers!
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Old 06-16-2003, 04:28 PM   #16
kastle
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Quote:
Originally posted by EJ25
nice work! wish I had those numbers, then again, wish I had the built up lower end.

Wiseco or J&E Pistons? Pauter rods I assume. Who did you get to do the bottom end, did you have to get the block bored at all, or was it an easy piston swap?

awesome numbers!
See Aaron's notes below, as it was his motor prior to going into my car last summer.

Last edited by kastle; 06-16-2003 at 06:29 PM.
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Old 06-16-2003, 05:57 PM   #17
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Wiseco pistons .020 overbore, Pauter rods. the potential problem with this setup is that when assembled the pistons stuck out of the deck a few thousanths, which caused interference with the head

Common root cause theory is the pistons are for a phase 1 EJ25 which has slightly different piston height compared to the phase 2 EJ25. I believe the rods are a hair shorter in the phase 1, so when the stage 1 pistons are combined with the phase 2 rods they are a hair too long
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Old 06-16-2003, 08:01 PM   #18
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So how did you fix the problem with the piston sticking of of the deck? Thicker head gasket?
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Old 06-16-2003, 08:12 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by AaronB
Common root cause theory is the pistons are for a phase 1 EJ25 which has slightly different piston height compared to the phase 2 EJ25. I believe the rods are a hair shorter in the phase 1, so when the stage 1 pistons are combined with the phase 2 rods they are a hair too long
Not a hair... almost 1/2mm. I assembled some p1 pistons into a p2 block once and was rather puzzled when I took a good look at it. Fortunately I only put one in instead of all 4.

I actually devised a way to mix & match parts to come up with a 2.3 de-stroker from stock components and be pretty damned close to right on. I think there was ~1mm of clearance between the deck and the top of the piston... I've considered running it before, but I have never had the money nor have been willing to possibly risk a turbo on it. *shrug*
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Old 06-17-2003, 12:20 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by 8Complex
Not a hair... almost 1/2mm. I assembled some p1 pistons into a p2 block once and was rather puzzled when I took a good look at it. Fortunately I only put one in instead of all 4.
You are smarter than the assembly shop I used during the first rebuild.

When I did it myself the second time, it was very obvious as soon as the head was pulled.

We tried a thinker copper gasket, but it didn't seal, as the motor was not o-ringed. We ended up sending the pistons out to a machine shop and having them milled down. This probably isn't the best solution, but it was the only solution that would get the motor running in a reasonable time frame. It had been down for 9 months at this time...

Keep in mind this all happened 2 years ago when internals for these cars were very hard to come by.
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Old 06-18-2003, 12:20 AM   #21
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I went through the same crap. I had to call JE and have the pistons re-machined to get them right. Now you can get the pistons any time to fit right the first time.

Kastle,

Could you email the three seperate bin files for your TEC 2 if you have all three. I want to compare my numbers with yours on timing and such. Especialy the timing and feul deliver. I have nearly the same set up only with a Ludespeed and no Ver 4 tranny. At least no Ver 4 tranny yet. If my car doesn't sell, I am going to finish her out and keep her. Thanks in advance.

Paul...
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Old 06-18-2003, 01:45 AM   #22
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Kastle - I never did get those log files... did I type my email address wrong? itookmyprozac.com
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Old 06-18-2003, 02:52 AM   #23
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I'll resend them... never got a error message...
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