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Old 06-25-2003, 12:25 AM   #1
legacy2003
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Default sunroof trouble...

hey guys perhaps you can help me out with this. so i have a 95 legacy sedan and it has a power sunroof. the other day it started leaking, which definately wasn't good. i was getting pretty wet. the water was coming in from the map light/sunroof control thing through the little square that i think pops out and i think there's a screw behind it. it must have been leaking in a few other spots too since i had water on the back oh****handle passenger side rear and water on the sliding piece that shuts out the sunroof. i couldn't get it off and i wasn't just going to break it off. anywho, so today the sunroof just stopped working all together. luckily i was able to close it before it f'ed up. at least i think so. it may still be open a little bit. is there any way to close the sunroof manually? and has anyone had the same trouble with theirs? and how much would this be to fix (both the sunroof and the leak), and is this something i could do myself? it sounds like the motor is trying to work when i press buttons since it hums a little bit but it doesn't sound like the motor since the motor is a lot louder than that...
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Old 06-25-2003, 04:35 AM   #2
fastenova
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I've got a 97 sedan. There is a simple way to close the sunroof:

Remove the center overhead console (Pop the clear part of it off using a slotted screwdriver, then remove the single phillips screw and it should slide right out).

You should see an allen-head adjustment bolt. Turn this clockwise if you need to lower the sunroof (if you had it 'up')
Turn the bolt counter-clockwise if you need to slide it closed (if you had it 'open').

Good luck!
-fastenova
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Old 06-25-2003, 10:45 AM   #3
Speedwagon
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I don't know the '95 headliner, but I would imagine there is just a small oval cap(like in my '98) that you should be able to pop off near the rearview mirror. That is designed to stick the allen wrench(came with the car new, for manually operating the sunroof) in there and turn the motor.

I'm not sure I follow what fastenova said, but I'm not saying he is wrong, either.

And, if you get a chance, drop your headliner, and check the sunroof drains. There is one at each corner, and they are clear plastic tubes that run down the pillars. There is a good chance one or more of them is clogged, if you have water buildup. Sunroofs are designed to catch water, and get rid of it to keep it out of the car. Also, check underneath the pillars for any dirt/debris that might clog them up down there too.
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Old 06-25-2003, 12:53 PM   #4
silverSurfer
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the sunroof drains should be in the front two corners by the tracks. to clear them out all you need is a compressed hose line. A air choc tip would work best- jam it into the hole and blow the crap out of it. Usually it's little leaves and crap that gum it up that's why water leaks thru the controller/map light first. If still leakage, definately take a look at the seals. If it's just a slight gap, buddy of mine suggest using some vasoline jelly on the seal: the vaseline would cause the rubber to expand and therefore fill the gap. Otherwise if it's too large of a gap...eh you might be SOL. (BTW, if that vaseline sounded wierd, my buddy used to run a Safelite store. So it must work! )

Oh yeah, one other thing. Make sure your tracks are clear of leaves and other junk. If so, clean the whole thing out as best as you can then repack with grease. A '95 might just have a lot of build up in there and giving the motor a real workout.

-chrisC
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Old 06-25-2003, 02:25 PM   #5
gtwagon941
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speedwagon-

Dropping the headline? How is this done? Is it as labor intensive as I am imagining? Pulling all of the plastic trim off all the way around, which seems as though it could be QUITE the project, and then pulling the headliner? My sunroof doesn't seal properly when I put it to the position that is shoudl be "closed" so I have to jockey it around until I can't see daylight under the back edge (I have no sunroof cover, bought it that way). Any help on how this might be fixed would be great. Is there an adjustment for how far forward the motor pushes the glass?

Thanks


Jared
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Old 06-25-2003, 04:22 PM   #6
richeich
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I replaced my sunroof about a year ago. I took pictures during the process, mainly for my own reference. There's no notes or anything, and I can't really give you specific instructions, but the pictures may help you out some. It was labor intensive, and I hope I don't ever have to do it again. You can see the drain tubes in some of the pictures. I believe there's one at each corner. Here's the link... here

Good Luck-
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Old 06-25-2003, 09:57 PM   #7
Speedwagon
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Yes, there is one at each corner. And yes, you have to pull down the upper trim. I've done it a more than a few times already, so I'm kinda used to it, and doesn't seem like a big deal to me. Although, every car I've done it in was a wagon/suv, not a sedan. More panels to pull, but easier to drop the whole thing out.

A sunroof moves by the motor(center, up front) turning two 'screws' that extend out to the sides, then back. I don't believe there are any adjustments to be made, it just goes until it can't go anymore, then you release the button. But I suppose it is possible for it to have skipped a tooth or something, and made it out of alignment. But that would probably require you pulling the whole thing out of the car, and it doesn't sound like you want to do that.
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Old 01-02-2004, 11:27 PM   #8
BJamerican
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My moonroof recently did the same thing. All of the sudden it stopped working. It would tilt up and down, but would not retract. When I hit the retract switch, nothing happened (no motor sound). Logic told me that the switch itself was broken and not the motor. So yesterday I decided to take the switch apart and make sure it was functioning properly. Upon doing that, I found a lot of corrosion on the switch contacts. I used jewelery cleaner and a pencil eraser to clean them, and when I reinstalled the switch, the moonroof worked again.

Unfortunately, the moonroof broke again (the next day). Last night we had torrential rains and high winds. When I was driving this afternoon, I noticed a few drops of water fall from my moonroof but didn't think anything of it. A few hours later, I was driving on the parkway and all the sudden the moonroof began opening all by itself! I had to pull over and actually remove the switch to make it stop (the motor kept running). When I removed the switch/maplight console, water began dripping into the car from the headliner. Apparently the moonroof has been leaking and caused the switch to short out and make the moonroof open on its own.

When I got home, I also noticed a little bit of rust on the moonroof frame (around the glass pane). This is an indication that the roof has been leaking for a long time, and perhaps caused the switch corrosion in the first place.

I'm really hoping that these "gutters" are clogged, and that nothing needs replaced.
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Old 01-02-2004, 11:38 PM   #9
legacy2003
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mine is getting fixed this wednesday *finally*... new motor.

-mike
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Old 01-03-2004, 12:07 AM   #10
BJamerican
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well, I know my motor still works (unless water starts getting into it). I am going to try finding these drain tubes tomorrow and blowing compressed air down them. I'll let you know what I find.

Also, is the labor for having your motor replaced as steep as everyone claims? Just curious.
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Old 01-03-2004, 06:25 AM   #11
subiekid
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wow, didnt know you could close it with an allen head.
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Old 01-03-2004, 09:30 AM   #12
richeich
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Well, Yahoo has changed their setup for photos, so my old link no longer works. My sunroof pics can be found here in case you need to take a look at them.

Good Luck-
Rich
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Old 01-03-2004, 02:02 PM   #13
BJamerican
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Does anybody know where these drainage tubes drain to? I remember reading somewhere that they go from the moonroof down the A-pillars and end near the front jacking points behind the front wheels. Is this correct?

I did not see any tube blockages around the moonroof frame. I did notice that there was a lot of mud, leaves, and twigs stuck in the little seams near the front jack points near the bottom of the car (under the door hinges and behind the front wheels). It is hard to describe and I don't have my digital camera handy. Anyway, I blasted all the mud and debris from these areas with the garden hose, hoping that this is where the moonroof drains into. There was actually a pile of dirt that came out onto the driveway. If this is in fact where the drains are, it was DEFINITELY clogged.
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Old 01-03-2004, 05:44 PM   #14
legacy2003
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the place thats doing mine is charging me 200$ for replacing the motor, that price includes the motor. i'm starting to think i lucked out.

-mike
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Old 01-03-2004, 07:49 PM   #15
nuburu2
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BJamerican, You may have fixed the eventual cause of the plugged drains, but it seems to be sure you'd still want to blow the tubes out from the top now that the bottoms are free of all that debris buildup. Always a good idea to blow that area out thoroughly when washing the car, especially if you're where they sand the roads in the winter. My 91 would constantly fill the area behind the fenderliners, but the 98 isn't quite as bad.

Glenn O
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Old 01-04-2004, 01:01 AM   #16
BJamerican
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Well we have received 1.5 inches of rain since I cleaned out the "gutters" this morning and everything appears to be dry inside the car. I'm hoping this solved the problem.

I'm considering trading my car for a boat... it's raining like it will never rain again!
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Old 01-04-2004, 01:17 PM   #17
Charlie-III
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Also, go through the hinge line (open the front doors and look forward into the fender) and clean out leaves/sticks etc from that area.

When I wash my car, I soak the bottom corners of the windshield to wash that whole area out and allow it to drain out the bottom rears of the front fenders.

Twice a year, I open the front doors, pull out big stuff (leaves, etc) and then wash out with a hose.

I have never had a roof leakage problem, and I think my "cleaning" is a good part of it.

Besides, if the fender bottoms are packed with stuff, you WILL rot out the fenders because of constant water contact there.
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Old 01-07-2004, 09:58 PM   #18
BJamerican
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Quote:
Originally posted by nuburu2
BJamerican, You may have fixed the eventual cause of the plugged drains, but it seems to be sure you'd still want to blow the tubes out from the top now that the bottoms are free of all that debris buildup. Always a good idea to blow that area out thoroughly when washing the car, especially if you're where they sand the roads in the winter. My 91 would constantly fill the area behind the fenderliners, but the 98 isn't quite as bad.

Glenn O

Ugh, it's still leaking.

How delicate are these drainage tubes? Due to their location, I don't think compressed air would be very effective. Somebody recommended that I use coaxial cable to clean out the tubes... It's thick enough and stiff enough to clear out debris. I will also be making sure the tubes are still attached to the moonroof frame.
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Old 01-08-2004, 08:34 AM   #19
nuburu2
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BJamerican, Sounds like you're on the right track. A previous post also mentioned using a light coat of vaseline petroleum jelly on the rubber perimeter seal to cause some swelling and improve fit. My personal experience with my 91 BF was that once that seal was clean the leak stopped, but I never experienced a blockage of the tubes from debris buildup. You should be able to test for drain blockage by using a garden hose to slowly add water to the "well" inside the opening with the roof open and observe what happens. Just my $.02.

Glenn O
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Old 01-08-2004, 12:59 PM   #20
BJamerican
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Well, sometime this weekend I'll be heading to my parents' house to look at this problem again (I live in an apartment and park in the city). First I plan to open the moonroof and pour some water over the front lip of the frame and see where the water goes.

I think either the gutters aren't draining, or the water is slowly leaking out of the gutters somehow before it falls into the drain. If I see that the water is sitting in the frame, I'll move on to removing the headliner (yikes) and inspecting the drains. If water does not appear to collect, I'm not sure what I'll do. Maybe there is a seal between the gutter and the car's frame that is leaking?

I would think that if the drains were clogged, water would be coming in from the corners of the moonroof. But it appears that water is only coming in the front center of the roof (dripping into the switches and map light).

What a mess. Thank God it's too cold outside to rain anymore!
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Old 01-08-2004, 04:47 PM   #21
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I just fixed a leak. The drainhose on the driver's side came off by itself. Put it back on and all is good except for the discoloured and warped headliner.
If you stick some wire in the tube or blow it out, make sure it is still seated onto the sunroof pan afterward.

The headliner comes down easily. Just take off the a-piller trim and part of the trim over the door. Removed the visor and the grab handle. Remove the trim around the sun roof. That is enough to have access to the corner where the tube attaches. Take down the map lights if you need to see further.
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