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Old 06-30-2003, 12:47 AM   #1
Kostaman
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Default Violent shaking in 1st and 2nd

Hi all, Im quite the noob and Im in need of help.

Whenever I lift my foot of the accelerator in order to "coast" in 1st and 2nd, the car will shake pretty violently. The problem becomes less noticable as the revs increase, Id say at about 3500 rpms, letting off on the gas isnt such a problem. Now, whenever I need to let off the gas for whatever reason in 1st and 2nd, I need to engage in some "clutch play" to ensure a smooth ride. Its quite annoying.

I have taken my car to my dealer's service department, and was told that this shaking is to be expected in all AWD MT cars. I was baffled!? I sure dont remember that problem when I test drove the 2002 WRX at their lot a couple months before the purchase, but in the end they could do nothing for me.

So has anybody else experienced this problem. If so, is there anything that can be done to fix this problem, a diagnosis of whats wrong would be great!


Thanks!
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Old 06-30-2003, 08:31 AM   #2
tmat3
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I would take your car to a different dealer and see what they would say. When you took your car to your dealer, did they actually drive the car? The car shouldn't shake just because you let go the gas.
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Old 06-30-2003, 11:20 AM   #3
TheMirror
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That dealer is absolutely, positively, full of s**t. There is a problem in there. Take it elsewhere, no doubt.
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Old 06-30-2003, 06:20 PM   #4
gjhsu
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Sounds like a case of the dealer is too lazy to take a look

I would say any violent shaking that is not Subaru clutch shudder is NOT normal for an AWD MT, seeing how I and countless others have one and most of us have not had this problem.
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Old 06-30-2003, 07:43 PM   #5
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Shaking as in "Bronco busting" back and forth shaking? Does it happen alot at anything under 1500rpms?
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Old 07-01-2003, 01:32 PM   #6
Kostaman
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They took the car out to test for clutch shudder, but I'm not sure if they were aware of the shaking that I was complaining about. They probably thought that my complaint of shaking in 1st and 2nd was probably related to my complaint of clutch shudder. Anyways I have another appointment on the 10th and hopefully something will get done this time.
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Old 07-02-2003, 10:33 PM   #7
nukeyfish
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My car does pretty much same thing. Yes, it IS very annoying. Please post when you come back from dealer again. I would like to know what the problem is.
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Old 07-03-2003, 12:16 AM   #8
ImportVenom
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I think might car might do that too. COuld it just be due to the gear ratios in first and second gear that make it unsmooth when you let off the gas and coast?
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Old 07-10-2003, 10:49 PM   #9
Kostaman
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I've taken the car back to the dealer today, and lo and behold, they determine that there is a problem this time unfortunately they could not diagnose the problem and concluded that it was just not normal. However, they suspect the shaking is caused by "aftermarket modifications" which in my case includes a turbo XS axleback exhaust, blitz sus intake, and H&R lowering springs. They are making me return my car back to stock in order to be covered under warranty, which I will gladly do.

As soon as the stripping is done, I will return the car back to the service department and let them get to work. Hopefully they can fix the problem.
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Old 07-11-2003, 10:49 AM   #10
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How would the axleback or springs have ANYTHING to do with the car bucking like that? I could see if the intake was changed and possibly the MAF sensor was messed up caused by the different intake...but the axleback and springs?
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Old 07-11-2003, 11:54 AM   #11
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Have you driven a MT car before? In 1st and 2nd on any car if you lef off the throttle it will jerk you. You either have to clutch in or very slowly let off the throttle. Some say the sti motor mounts help get rid of this a little.
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Old 07-11-2003, 11:56 AM   #12
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k just read your above post, which dealor is this? Thats the biggest bull**** ever. Saying that an axleback, springs, and a filter caused this. I would say go to another dealor but you have already.
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Old 07-11-2003, 10:41 PM   #13
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Bump for this thread. Think i'm having this problem as well.

I usually take off around 2k. When the car is not warmed up before driving, the whole car would shake very bad. But the problem could be elimated if I properly warm up the car (until it idles normally around 500rpm). I've heard that this is clutch shudder problem and it's common on WRX's. Is this true? Should I take it to a dealer?

thanks,
jonathan

*Also, could the problem that my car is suffering cause any damage to the clutch or transmission?
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Old 07-11-2003, 11:02 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by Subies
Bump for this thread. Think i'm having this problem as well.

I usually take off around 2k. When the car is not warmed up before driving, the whole car would shake very bad. But the problem could be elimated if I properly warm up the car (until it idles normally around 500rpm). I've heard that this is clutch shudder problem and it's common on WRX's. Is this true? Should I take it to a dealer?

thanks,
jonathan

*Also, could the problem that my car is suffering cause any damage to the clutch or transmission?
Congratulations. You have been experiencing the infamous cold clutch shudder(judder). Please take your car in for repair under warranty per TSB.
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Old 07-12-2003, 04:08 AM   #15
Kostaman
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The problem that I am experiencing with my 1st and 2nd gears is not related to the infamous subaru clutch shudder, as the shaking is apparent no matter how warm the car is.

As for the modifications having anything to do with the problem, I agree, the exhaust, intake and springs shouldnt be held accountable for the shaking that im experiencing. However, giving me the option to take off the parts and then repairing the problem under warranty, is better than them flat out voiding my warranty altogether.

I would love to bring the car to another subaru dealer, however the other options of dealers that I have are limited, and the one that is closest to my house has a reputation (that i have experienced first hand) of poor customer care and shotty workmanship.
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Old 07-12-2003, 11:48 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by GOT_WRX


Congratulations. You have been experiencing the infamous cold clutch shudder(judder). Please take your car in for repair under warranty per TSB.
But be warned with the factory fix, which includes a heavier flywheel which may cause slower responses to throttle changes. But, you should be shudder free.

I've found that when you start the car up, let it warm up a bit (let RPMs settle) then the first time you want to go straight (assuming you are backing out of a parking spot) slip the clutch a little bit more, and that should relieve the shudder temporarily. I usually rev to ~2000, then slip it a bit more than usual to get around the shudder. Good luck.
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Old 07-12-2003, 01:04 PM   #17
JJL330
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I'm a noob when it comes to stick (only been 4 days), but 1-2 shift is almost always a little shaky... thats just because i suck though. As for what Kostaman is saying about coasting and letting off the throttle.. i totally hear him. The car jerks and makes me look even more bad at stickshift. LOL wutever..... practice, practice, practice.. i'm so glad i got stick shift though.. FUN.
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Old 07-12-2003, 01:34 PM   #18
jlw
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I've had my WRX for 1 1/2 yr & have experienced both cluth shudder & the jerking. The shudder is what it is ... I just shift differently when the car is cold. Can't describe it & it doesn't make go away completely, but it is less.

The jerking I have experienced in other MT cars. Not necessarily all, but maybe ... I don't remember exactly. Again, it is how I use the clutch, because I can avoid the jerking and/or "head it off" if I feel it start. Clutch technique ... just my opinion.
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Old 07-12-2003, 02:20 PM   #19
dan avoN7
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the only time i get clutch shudder is when the car is cold and i give it some gas. So the solution is, don't floor it till the car is warmed up. This will make it so you don't get clutch shudder and its better for the car to warm up before u start mashing on it.
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Old 07-12-2003, 02:45 PM   #20
Subies
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Quote:
Originally posted by gjhsu


But be warned with the factory fix, which includes a heavier flywheel which may cause slower responses to throttle changes. But, you should be shudder free.

I've found that when you start the car up, let it warm up a bit (let RPMs settle) then the first time you want to go straight (assuming you are backing out of a parking spot) slip the clutch a little bit more, and that should relieve the shudder temporarily. I usually rev to ~2000, then slip it a bit more than usual to get around the shudder. Good luck.
Wait.....the dealer would replace the stock flywheel with a heavier flywheel just to avoid the clutch shudder? If that's so, should i get it replace just to avoid the clutch shudder? Because i really dont want a heavier flywhell. Maybe i should just warm up the car a bit before i drive?

Also, any damage to the car with clutch shudder?

thanks,
jonathan
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Old 07-12-2003, 04:46 PM   #21
obyone
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Clutch shudder is defiantly a known issue. I know a guy, who's a Subaru tech, and he tells me that it has to do with the dampened flywheel Subaru uses. The flywheel begins to warp causing an uneven contact area.
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Old 07-12-2003, 05:53 PM   #22
gjhsu
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Quote:
Originally posted by Subies


Wait.....the dealer would replace the stock flywheel with a heavier flywheel just to avoid the clutch shudder? If that's so, should i get it replace just to avoid the clutch shudder? Because i really dont want a heavier flywhell. Maybe i should just warm up the car a bit before i drive?

Also, any damage to the car with clutch shudder?

thanks,
jonathan
They don't just replace the flywheel, they replace a few other clutch parts to get rid of the shudder, and the heavier flywheel happens to be one of the parts.

I don't believe there is any damage to the car from shudder, seeing how it's been going on for years, but what do I know...
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Old 07-13-2003, 12:14 AM   #23
GOT_WRX
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Quote:
Originally posted by Subies


Wait.....the dealer would replace the stock flywheel with a heavier flywheel just to avoid the clutch shudder? If that's so, should i get it replace just to avoid the clutch shudder? Because i really dont want a heavier flywhell. Maybe i should just warm up the car a bit before i drive?

Also, any damage to the car with clutch shudder?

thanks,
jonathan
If you violently shake the entire engine / transmission due to this clutch problem, you can break the motor/trans mount. TSB explicitly says to check the mounts before replacing the clutch assembly.

Even though it's said to be heavier, it gives you smoother engagement all times. It's worth it.
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Old 07-13-2003, 03:30 PM   #24
WRXcellerate
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to answer the origional question i dont believe this is clutch shudder this is just a charicteristic of a "hubcentric" clutch. If you look at a picture of it it has springs mounted inbetween the clutch disk and where the clutch attatches to the rest of the driveline, to help reduce the shock placed on our tranny's due to AWD, just be smoother with inputs, like if you have to come off the accelerator hard then disengage the clutch otherwise its gonna shake.


to sum it all up ITS NORMAL (to a point)
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Old 07-18-2003, 10:16 AM   #25
latinskllz
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kostaman
I've taken the car back to the dealer today, and lo and behold, they determine that there is a problem this time unfortunately they could not diagnose the problem and concluded that it was just not normal. However, they suspect the shaking is caused by "aftermarket modifications" which in my case includes a turbo XS axleback exhaust, blitz sus intake, and H&R lowering springs. They are making me return my car back to stock in order to be covered under warranty, which I will gladly do.

As soon as the stripping is done, I will return the car back to the service department and let them get to work. Hopefully they can fix the problem.
THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR AFTERMARKET MODIFICATIONS.

Giving you the option to have it fixed under warranty providing that you put your car back to stop is absolutely ridiculous. I would call SOA and file a complaint against this dealership's knowledge.

Anyhow, make sure your tranny/engine mounts and all the bolts are properly tightened as my friends RS did this and it was motor mount loose.

Kevin
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