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Old 07-20-2003, 05:49 PM   #1
Titanium Samurai
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Default Normal engine noise: how do I make it quieter?

The noise to which I'm referring is not loud, nor is it abnormal. It's not the soft clacking or clicking of the injectors; it's a sound that every car has to some extent or another. You can't hear the sound from inside the cabin unless you have the window open and are beside something off of which the sound can reflect. The sound occurs at idle through to WOT. Unless I'm mistaken, though, it becomes more pronounced as the car ages, and my 4-year old 2.2 has 100 000+ miles (175 000 km). The following are the things that have been done to improve the sound of the car since I bought it in November (2002).

Scoobysport muffler
snorkusectomy
new plugs
injector cleaner run through
full engine flush
K&N filter
grounding mod

Despite this, the engine sound -- not the distinctive boxer beat but the sound of moving parts -- competes with the booming of the exhaust and the growl of the intake. I don't want to make the car quieter overall, but just kill that 'old car' sound.

Someone said that different oil reduces the sound; the engine has had Castrol synthetic for the past two or three changes. Does anyone have testimonial to back up a switch to one of the better brands?

Also, I will soon check the headers for leaks.
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Old 07-21-2003, 01:15 AM   #2
JC
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Insulate the engine bay.
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Old 07-21-2003, 07:44 AM   #3
kickin_81
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Have you considered getting your valves relashed?
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Old 07-21-2003, 09:24 PM   #4
Titanium Samurai
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Insulation: Dynamat? To what extent would I need to insulate?

Relashing: heard about it; how many millions of dollars would that cost? What type of shop would do it?
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Old 07-22-2003, 01:07 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by TiTaNiuM sAMuRai
Insulation: Dynamat? To what extent would I need to insulate?
I dunno, never heard of anyone with a Scooby actually doing it. My car is loud as crap and creaks and moans anyway so I don't bother. Probably a layer on the firewall would do it. If not throw some on the hood too. I'm not certain it will work, but I see no reason why it wouldn't.

JC
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Old 07-22-2003, 05:18 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by TiTaNiuM sAMuRai
Insulation: Dynamat? To what extent would I need to insulate?

Relashing: heard about it; how many millions of dollars would that cost? What type of shop would do it?
Its actually DIY-able in your driveway. All you need is a 10mm, 12mm, 5/8" spark plug sockets and a set of feeler gauges. If you take it to a dealer it will be rather pricey (its at least a 3 hr job in the book).
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Old 07-22-2003, 05:25 PM   #7
ciper
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You sure some of the noise isnt coming from the tires?
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Old 07-22-2003, 09:23 PM   #8
Titanium Samurai
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positive; the noise is loudest from the exhaust manifold, and it occurs even at idle.

BOY: Exactly what is relashing, though? Searches here showed a few threads that mentioned it, and more than a few instances of people mistaking relash for reflash (as in reflashing the ECU).

Last edited by TiTaNiuM sAMuRai; 07-22-2003 at 09:38 PM.
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Old 07-23-2003, 09:26 AM   #9
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Quote:
positive; the noise is loudest from the exhaust manifold, and it occurs even at idle.
Are you sure you don't have a crack in your manifold or that it might not be fully seated?

Chad
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Old 07-23-2003, 09:35 AM   #10
BOY
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relash as in adjusting the valve lash... just setting your valves back into tolerance. IIRC for a stock motor its .006" intake and .008" exhaust. The process is fairly simple, I believe Stimpy has instructions but I'll try to sumarize:

Tools (I forgot a couple in my prev post): 10mm, 12mm, 22mm sockets (shallow and deep), 5/8" spark plug socket and 4" extension, feeler gauges (available from ANY autoparts store),10mm box end wrench, SMALL flat head screw driver (feeler gauges can be used as a screw driver in a pinch), beer or Advil to sooth your back

1. With the car in neutral! remove battery, windshield washer fluid tank, radiator fans and overflow, intake (optional but makes life much easier)
2. Remove spark plugs, now is as good a time as any to replace them
3. Remove drivers side timing cover
4. Remove breather lines and remove valve covers
5. Rotate engine (22mm socket on long ratchet or breaker bar) so cyl 1 is at TDC (arrow on cam pulley at 12:00)
6. Adjust valves w/ 10mm box end wrench and a small screwdriver, check clearance w/ feeler gauge
7. Rotate engine till cyl 2 is at TCD (arrow on cam pulley at 6:00)
8. repeat step 6
9. Rotate engine till cyl 3 is at TCD (arrow on cam pulley at 3:00)
10. repeat step 6
11. Rotate engine till cyl 4 is at TCD (arrow on cam pulley at 3:00)
12. repeat step 6
13. Put everything back together (this is the fun part cause your back will be killing you if you don't take breaks). Remember the sparkplugs, the breather lines, and make sure the intake is sealed up tight

You will spill oil when you remove the valve covers, don't worry about it, its only a small amount (even though it looks much worse on your driveway).
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Old 07-23-2003, 11:40 PM   #11
Titanium Samurai
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Thanks a zillion! I'll try to find some Stimpy-structions, too.

Is there any other term under which I could find 'relashing' the valves? Is it adjusting the lash the same thing as just 'adjusting the valves'? I like to read a lot of posts about the same task so that I get a good handle on the details and on the degree of difficulty.
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Old 07-24-2003, 09:24 AM   #12
BOY
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Quote:
Originally posted by TiTaNiuM sAMuRai
Is there any other term under which I could find 'relashing' the valves? Is it adjusting the lash the same thing as just 'adjusting the valves'?
A rose is a rose Like I said, its not hard... it is time consuming and expect to not get it right the first time.
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Old 07-24-2003, 02:40 PM   #13
rilles
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Put some sound absorbing material under the bottom of the hood. Or go to a junkyard and find a car with that material oem under its hood and transplant it.
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Old 07-24-2003, 07:55 PM   #14
sovereignmk1
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Quote:
Originally posted by BOY
relash as in adjusting the valve lash... just setting your valves back into tolerance. IIRC for a stock motor its .006" intake and .008" exhaust. The process is fairly simple, I believe Stimpy has instructions but I'll try to sumarize:

Tools (I forgot a couple in my prev post): 10mm, 12mm, 22mm sockets (shallow and deep), 5/8" spark plug socket and 4" extension, feeler gauges (available from ANY autoparts store),10mm box end wrench, SMALL flat head screw driver (feeler gauges can be used as a screw driver in a pinch), beer or Advil to sooth your back

1. With the car in neutral! remove battery, windshield washer fluid tank, radiator fans and overflow, intake (optional but makes life much easier)
2. Remove spark plugs, now is as good a time as any to replace them
3. Remove drivers side timing cover
4. Remove breather lines and remove valve covers
5. Rotate engine (22mm socket on long ratchet or breaker bar) so cyl 1 is at TDC (arrow on cam pulley at 12:00)
6. Adjust valves w/ 10mm box end wrench and a small screwdriver, check clearance w/ feeler gauge
7. Rotate engine till cyl 2 is at TCD (arrow on cam pulley at 6:00)
8. repeat step 6
9. Rotate engine till cyl 3 is at TCD (arrow on cam pulley at 3:00)
10. repeat step 6
11. Rotate engine till cyl 4 is at TCD (arrow on cam pulley at 3:00)
12. repeat step 6
13. Put everything back together (this is the fun part cause your back will be killing you if you don't take breaks). Remember the sparkplugs, the breather lines, and make sure the intake is sealed up tight

You will spill oil when you remove the valve covers, don't worry about it, its only a small amount (even though it looks much worse on your driveway).
Is this interchangable for 2.5 and 2.2 Cars?

//M
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Old 07-24-2003, 10:53 PM   #15
Titanium Samurai
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I found endwrench.com instructions for HLA adjustment, and some specifics on adjusting the valves on the 2.5 DOHC. I found an overview of the 2.2 SOHC overhaul, but it only touched on valve adjustment.

Radiator fans, overflow, intake: I'm not sure exactly what parts you mean, so I'll have to go look. Why do I need to take out the rad fan? Is it absolutely necessary to remove the intake manifold?

Can I not leave the plugs in? I just changed them a couple of weeks ago.

Breather lines: these are the same as the crankcase oil breathers, right?

Is it possible, if I'm really careful, to avoid oil spillage?

Man, I really need to take a close look...


thanks for the info.
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Old 07-28-2003, 09:19 AM   #16
BOY
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OK, to clear some things up:

HLA adjustment (Hydraulic Lash Adjuster) is different than standard solid (mechanical) adjusters that the phase II SOHCs have. HLA adjustment requires shims, mech doesn't. Reasons to remove the folling:

Intake: Pre-throttle body, not the manifold. Makes access to passenger side MUCH easier
Rad Fans: Makes getting at the crank pulley possible unless you have a special low profile socket/wrench
Rad Overflow: Required to remove fans above and to get access to the drivers side cam belt (timing belt) cover.
Spark Plugs: You can keep them in but you will be compressing the cylinders if you do which makes manually turning the engine VERY difficult. With the plugs removed the compression can't happen due to the big open hole in the top of the combustion chamber... plus it helps you find TDC (feel for a rush of air)
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Old 07-28-2003, 08:25 PM   #17
Titanium Samurai
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Thanks, man.

From what I've read, the MLA's screw-type adjustment should make things a tad easier.

pre-throttle body: very glad to hear that. I wasn't looking forward to popping off the manifold.

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Old 07-29-2003, 09:09 AM   #18
BOY
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Quote:
Originally posted by TiTaNiuM sAMuRai
From what I've read, the MLA's screw-type adjustment should make things a tad easier.
Let me put it this way, when my car gets too rickity, rackity I devote an afternoon to do the valves in my driveway.... If I had HLAs I wouldn't even try it (then again HLAs are supposed to be less likely to loosen over time ).
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