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Old 08-03-2003, 03:18 PM   #1
dave_the_driver
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Member#: 13588
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Vehicle:
2002 WRX sedan
Aspen White

Default electrical output specs for UTEC spare solenoid?

I'm trying to hook up an intercooler spray but there's not enough power coming out of the spare solenoid signal to light up a 14 volt indicator light that draws 0.08 amps and 1.12 watts. Is this normal? The turboxs RTFM says it gives 100 milliamps, but does anyone know where it says how many volts that is? It's the watts that matter. I assumed it was a 12-volt (positive--hot)signal.

I got the December 2002 production run of the UTEC and it was just when they started labeling it "2003" on the box. The firmware is still circa-December-2002 v. 2.5b because i didn't want to change the firmware as long as everything was working and i'm not gonna use the launch control feature of the newest version.

(But i see that they added a "delay" feature to the solenoid signal that does not seem to be available with firmware 2.5b. Oh well.)

That 0.8 watt light is the only thing hooked up and it draws too much power for the UTEC. And it's hooked up with 20 gauge wire just long enough to run into the engine bay ... once i can get the signal to move a relay. With just that 0.8 watt indicator light connected, and i lower the UTEC trigger settings to 0 TPS to easly trigger it sitting with the car running and parked, i get a spike signal of SOLENOID ON from the UTEC Dashboard but then it immediately flashes off (like from an overload).

And after i removed the indicator light and hooked up the relay i bought yesterday, the relay won't budge with the signal from the UTEC. Without that indicator light -- and just the nonresponsive relay hooked up right on the center console so i can see if it budges ... the relay contact plate does not move at all when the UTEC sends its signal.

What kind of relay have people used to control their intercooler pump? Mine is an NTE 12 V DC relay that should only require 1.2 watts to close the contact. It's the R10-11D10-12 at
http://www.nteinc.com/relay_web/R10.html

DC OPERATED
R10-11D10-12 12VDC DPDT 120 1.2W 10A D7A

It's obvious now that i got way too big of a relay for the weak signal coming out of the UTEC. The relay's specs say it can start a 0.5 HP motor. But the specs say it can be triggered with just 1.2 watts at 12 volts DC. Is the UTEC putting out 12 (or 14) volts on the spare solenoid signal .. because that should do it, right? (Volts times amps = watts.)

What are you guys using for intercooler-spray relays and where do you get them? ... a part number would be very helpful!!! Thanks!

David
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Last edited by dave_the_driver; 08-03-2003 at 07:26 PM.
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Old 08-03-2003, 05:55 PM   #2
TurboXS (Pete)
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To use the spare solenoid output you need to connect a +12V supply to one side of your relay coil and then connect the other side of the coil to the red wire. The UTEC spare solenoid output is connected to ground when it is activated.

The UTEC requires all conditions to be met for the spare solenoid to be activated. You will need to set the other conditions as well as TPS and RPM.

regards
Pete
(TurboXS)
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Old 08-03-2003, 06:22 PM   #3
kenchan
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pete- even when i set the TPS to 0, the spare solenoid will not activate until i blip the throttle. all other conditions are met.

why is this? thanks.
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Old 08-03-2003, 07:21 PM   #4
dave_the_driver
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Quote:
Originally posted by TurboXS (Pete)
To use the spare solenoid output you need to connect a +12V supply to one side of your relay coil and then connect the other side of the coil to the red wire.
So what you're saying is that i don't need the black wire? What's it for, then? I thought that the red wire would be "hot" (positive 12 volts), and the black wire would be ground (negative) for this signal. I thought it would be less "noisy" a signal connection if i didn't use the car's body for the ground site and used the black wire instead for the ground (negative) side.

Quote:
The UTEC spare solenoid output is connected to ground when it is activated.
?Connected to ground? No comprende. I thought that the red wire should be connected to the load (on the relay coil) and that the black wire is ground. Is that not so? Should i connect the black wire to ground right at the UTEC and only run the red wire through the console switch and then the relay under the hood?

Quote:
The UTEC requires all conditions to be met for the spare solenoid to be activated. You will need to set the other conditions as well as TPS and RPM.[/QUOTE}
regards Pete
(TurboXS)
Yes. I was hoping that the solenoid signal would trip the relay by just tapping on the gas to move TPS greater than zero. This was so i could see if the relay would work while parked in the safety of my driveway.

Also, there's now a reason to install the new firmware because they added a "delay" feature where the signal flows for a given number of seconds continuously once the "AND" conditions are met.

I have an on-off flip switch in the console that the "red wire" goes through (before the relay) so i can block the signal and set the UTEC's triggering conditions so that the spray will start earlier rather than later. If it sprays too long i can just turn it off.

Thanks for the reply but i'm still confused. I thought that the red wire coming from the UTEC would be "hot" and the black would be ground. If i hook up the UTEC's red wire to one side of the relay coil and another (i guess, as you say) positive (?) 12-volt source to the other, then .... wouldn't that be trying to set up a current flow between two positive poles?
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Old 08-04-2003, 12:27 AM   #5
kenchan
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dave- you need to put the utec in series. spare solenoid is only a switch.


12v switched => load => red wire of utec black wire => Ground.

i wired the black wire to the ECU cover plate.
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Old 08-04-2003, 12:34 AM   #6
kenchan
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dave- thanks for your PM, but the spare solenoid imo should work as an equal to or greater than value, not just greater than.

for instance, if other conditions are met and coolant temp set at 90C, the spare solenoid will turn on at 90C, not 91C.

no? pete, is there something different about TPS?
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Old 08-04-2003, 12:58 AM   #7
dave_the_driver
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Kenchan,

For TPS value, it says "greater than" in the user parameter file and also in the manual. It doesn't say "greater than or equal to." I know that's how it works because i was blipping the throttle in my driveway today to control the solenoid signal. TPS needs to be greater than zero to get that signal because zero is the lowest allowable value for that parameter.

For my wiring/load problem, i'll ground the black wire and see if it solves the problem. If that's the fix, then all the wires can stay in place and i just need to add a jumper from the black wire to ground.

Dave

Last edited by dave_the_driver; 08-04-2003 at 01:07 AM.
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Old 08-04-2003, 08:43 AM   #8
dwx
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They do have a diagram in the manual that describes the operation of the switch. The UTEC spare solenoid is just a switched ground in the UTEC so you hook the red wire from the UTEC to the ground wire on the device you are controlling. Hook the black wire to some ground in the area. I think alot of people see the red wire and immediately think it's going to output the 12v signal.
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Old 08-04-2003, 09:08 AM   #9
kenchan
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yah, i guess you're right. its a no big deal for me, but was just wondering why it didnt work. i guess when the coolant temp reaches 90C, there may be hidden decimal points so it could be 90.1C that the utec is reading but only showing 90C on the dashboard.

for your wiring, if you have a 12v power coming into your
load and the ground of the load going to the red wire on
the utec and utec's black wire going to ground, it'll work.



Quote:
Originally posted by dave_the_driver
Kenchan,

For TPS value, it says "greater than" in the user parameter file and also in the manual. It doesn't say "greater than or equal to." I know that's how it works because i was blipping the throttle in my driveway today to control the solenoid signal. TPS needs to be greater than zero to get that signal because zero is the lowest allowable value for that parameter.

For my wiring/load problem, i'll ground the black wire and see if it solves the problem. If that's the fix, then all the wires can stay in place and i just need to add a jumper from the black wire to ground.

Dave
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Old 08-04-2003, 09:51 AM   #10
dave_the_driver
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Quote:
Originally posted by kenchan
[For your wiring, if you have a 12v power coming into your
load and the ground of the load going to the red wire on
the utec and utec's black wire going to ground, it'll work.
[/b]
Aha. Red wire is a switched ground. People get confused because red for output wire (opposite black) means hot (positive) in every device i've ever wired.

Anyway, thanks for the info. It's explained in the User Manual they have for download, but i missed it. Sorry.

Dave
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Old 08-04-2003, 05:24 PM   #11
TurboXS (Pete)
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Can I assume that your spare solenoid is working okay?

regards
Pete
(TurboXS)
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