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Old 08-26-2003, 03:45 PM   #1
Porkchop-WRX
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Talking Water Injection...tell me what I need to know

Was looking into a water injection setup. I have read various posts and was wondering what people had to say about theres. My plans are to run the FP20G with the Ultimate racing 750 injectors. DO you think I can run that setup and get good results on the stock intercooler? Right now I'm at Turbo xs stage 2.5 and I have heard some people freeing up as much as 10-15 hp from switching over to WI.

Next, how is the install? I know you have to drill a hole in the stock intercooler but besides that what else is involved? Maybe someone has documented a install already? Also maybe someone can recommend a reputable kit that is easy to install and works well. Preferably one that comes with a tank already.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 08-26-2003, 04:30 PM   #2
NavyBlueSubaru
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pm'd ya


Jeff
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Old 08-26-2003, 05:18 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by NavyBlueSubaru
pm'd ya


Jeff
Jeff, you willing to shoot some info my way as well? I am curious as well.
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Old 08-26-2003, 05:38 PM   #4
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Wouldn't mind a PM also jeff...

~Evan
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Old 08-26-2003, 05:45 PM   #5
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Jeff from orlando why dont you just come out with your amazing info like you did in the bragging forum..

Lemme guess, this week youre pushing 400whp on 440cc injectors and you put koolaid mix in your water tank?
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Old 08-26-2003, 05:53 PM   #6
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The best kits seem to be from Aquamist.

Don't go in expecting more HP without changing boost levels or tune. What WI will do for you is allow you to run a hotter tune, and more boost, safely, as it effectively raises the octane level of your fuel and reduces the intake air charge. Since you have an intercooler, you'll want to place the nozzle AFTER the intercooler, or else you'll risk getting puddles as the fins inside the intercooler will kill the atomization of the water mist.

The water actually takes up space that otherwise air and fuel would occupy, so in some cases people will lose a tiny amount of power, but for turbo cars it's a win - win. You can also mix in alcohol with the water which will act as a fuel. (I was informed Alcohol is not compatable with the seals in the Aquamist pump) but is used on other systems.

Matt

Last edited by I am mattjk; 08-27-2003 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 08-26-2003, 06:25 PM   #7
AndyWRXWG
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can someone point me to some sort of diagram/better explination of exactly what WI is? from what I've been reading it sounds kind of like you uses it in a similar fashion as NOS, but I must admit i know nothing about it, but want to learn. Thanks.
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Old 08-26-2003, 06:28 PM   #8
subarud
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Go to the resources/faq on http://www.aquamist.co.uk/

Plenty of info there, also pics of a wrx with w.i.

~Evan
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Old 08-26-2003, 10:24 PM   #9
WRX-Hellfire
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Default Re: Water Injection...tell me what I need to know

Quote:
Originally posted by Porkchop-WRX
Was looking into a water injection setup. I have read various posts and was wondering what people had to say about theres. My plans are to run the FP20G with the Ultimate racing 750 injectors. DO you think I can run that setup and get good results on the stock intercooler? Right now I'm at Turbo xs stage 2.5 and I have heard some people freeing up as much as 10-15 hp from switching over to WI.

Next, how is the install? I know you have to drill a hole in the stock intercooler but besides that what else is involved? Maybe someone has documented a install already? Also maybe someone can recommend a reputable kit that is easy to install and works well. Preferably one that comes with a tank already.

Thanks in advance.
Here is some good install info from aussieinstlouis, I just went through this install a few weeks ago and he helped out alot.

Link
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Old 08-26-2003, 10:33 PM   #10
MAD REX
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I'm going to buy a water injection kit if I do good in Vegas in a couple weeks
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Old 08-27-2003, 08:02 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by I am mattjk
The best kits seem to be from Aquamist.

You can also mix in alcohol with the water which will act as a fuel.

Matt
DO NOT USE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL W/ AQUAMIST The pump seals will be degraded by use of iso. Use Methanol at a mixture no more than 50/50 with water.

By the way, water injection is good. I get to run 87 octane gas while commuting to work and still have the TXS 4 knockless. Saves so much money in gas and my milage has increased 20-30%, depending on conditions. In a year with gas savings, I'll have paid for the Aquamist kit.
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Old 08-27-2003, 08:31 AM   #12
Austin
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Quote:
Originally posted by mlambert
Jeff from orlando why dont you just come out with your amazing info like you did in the bragging forum..

Lemme guess, this week youre pushing 400whp on 440cc injectors and you put koolaid mix in your water tank?
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Old 08-27-2003, 09:48 AM   #13
hotsam
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I run an Aquamist 1s kit and I love it. My install is featured on the Aquamist site here:

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/rescr/gall...aru-tm/tm.html
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Old 08-27-2003, 11:01 AM   #14
I am mattjk
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Quote:
Originally posted by zaxrex


DO NOT USE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL W/ AQUAMIST The pump seals will be degraded by use of iso. Use Methanol at a mixture no more than 50/50 with water.

By the way, water injection is good. I get to run 87 octane gas while commuting to work and still have the TXS 4 knockless. Saves so much money in gas and my milage has increased 20-30%, depending on conditions. In a year with gas savings, I'll have paid for the Aquamist kit.
That's good to know about the seals! I wasn't aware...

That is so awesome you get no knock with 87! Impressive!

Last edited by I am mattjk; 08-27-2003 at 11:45 AM.
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Old 08-27-2003, 11:03 AM   #15
I am mattjk
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Quote:
Originally posted by hotsam
I run an Aquamist 1s kit and I love it. My install is featured on the Aquamist site here:

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/rescr/gall...aru-tm/tm.html
Where did you purchase your kit from?

Matt
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Old 08-27-2003, 11:33 AM   #16
zaxrex
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Suppliers listed here

Shane Lowrance promises to have the lowest prices on non group buys.

Alternative Performance Products
111 South Ridge Dr.
Cedar Creek, TX 78612
TEL: 512-296-5735
Email: [email protected]

If you want to talk to a really cool guy and get application and theory from a guy who does it for a living, call Brad Schaffner

Georges Imports Ltd
(SAAB main dealer + technical) Specialist on high flow water
injection systems on large engines
8011 State Line Road
Kansas City
MO 64114
USA
TEL: +1 816 333 6582
FAX: +1 816 361 2096
Email: [email protected]
Website: www.kcsaab.com
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Old 08-27-2003, 11:46 AM   #17
turboICE
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Matt - empty your pms

Send me an e-mail from my profile for more info.
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Old 08-27-2003, 11:49 AM   #18
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Thanks for the info, Zaxrex!

Pm's emptied...
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Old 08-27-2003, 11:51 AM   #19
hotsam
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Quote:
Originally posted by I am mattjk


Where did you purchase your kit from?

Matt
I purchased it from me. I'm not a nasioc vendor but you can find me on i-club.
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Old 08-27-2003, 05:10 PM   #20
Need4Boost
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Quote:
Originally posted by zaxrex


DO NOT USE ISOPROPYL ALCOHOL W/ AQUAMIST The pump seals will be degraded by use of iso. Use Methanol at a mixture no more than 50/50 with water.

By the way, water injection is good. I get to run 87 octane gas while commuting to work and still have the TXS 4 knockless. Saves so much money in gas and my milage has increased 20-30%, depending on conditions. In a year with gas savings, I'll have paid for the Aquamist kit.
Now that shows how well water injection works. The fact that you can run crappy 87 octane gas and still not get knock while running a TXS Stg4 (please correct me if im wrong by you saying TXS 4 knockless).
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Old 08-27-2003, 05:18 PM   #21
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I think I'll just bypass the middle-man and put water in my gas tank
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Old 08-27-2003, 05:22 PM   #22
turboICE
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Probably running too much water if tuned on 93 and still knockless on 87. Makes for good driveability and efficiency - but not getting the full performance benefit. Not a knock on the decision just a comment. Water does slow down the flame front and ideally you want as little water as you can without knock. You can use less water on higher octane than would be required for 87. That said water saved me at a fuel stop in KS that only sold 87.

I run 94 octane on a 2d with a .6 or .7 jet depending on the environment. I have it set at a low water to fuel ratio since I use a high octane fuel and don't need a lot of water to get knock suppression. On my way out to CO for Pikes Peak - I of course entere the part of the country that thinks corn is fuel. The step down to 91 brought about some knock - I switched to a .8 jet turned up the water pressure - knock was gone - 3 minutes and didn't change any fuel or timing. When I was at the stop that had only 87 went to the .9 jet again no map changes no knock - so it is a good thing to be able to do. I guess my point also is if you want to run 87 - tune WI on your highest octane at a water jet size that just prevents knock - then as you lower octane increase water - this will leave you with the ability to go back to the most power when you want it.

Note on my jet sizes I am using 2d which mirrors the IDC of the FI which provides a fixed water to fuel ratio - rather than 1s which provides a fixed water flow (fixed water flow will be too much water all the time or too little water all the time or too much water on low boost and too little water on high boost). Since with WI my FI never exceeds 75% IDC the jets never are static and flowing their full potential - i.e. .7 flows less water on a 2d than a 1s.
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Old 08-28-2003, 04:37 PM   #23
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Old 08-28-2003, 04:57 PM   #24
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so...i am catless and stock ECU management,

can i use this on my car without feeling a loss in power?

i just want to lower EGTs while on long trips. do i have to run the water with boost, or can it just sit there and mist while crusing down the highway...on off switch.

will i feel it when the water kicks in, as in a lag, lull in power delivery, A/C turning on kind of feeling?

how do you determine how much water to inject is a good amount(nozzle size)

thanks
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Old 08-28-2003, 05:06 PM   #25
Wheeler Bement
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Quote:
Originally posted by jehcpa
Note on my jet sizes I am using 2d which mirrors the IDC of the FI which provides a fixed water to fuel ratio - rather than 1s which provides a fixed water flow (fixed water flow will be too much water all the time or too little water all the time or too much water on low boost and too little water on high boost). Since with WI my FI never exceeds 75% IDC the jets never are static and flowing their full potential - i.e. .7 flows less water on a 2d than a 1s.
with the 2d system, is the only control over the amount of water delivered determined by the number and size of nozzels you are running, say 1 nozzle(say .4) and then the second one turns on(another .4). so the only control you have is either 0, .4, or .8? you mentioned turning up the pressure in pikes peak, how did you do that? how do you determine the size of the nozzle, pump psi and boost pressure to activate the nozzles...do you just need time ona dyno or some kind of loggin to see what happens and then go from their? i want one of these kits, but do you think i should wait till i can get the utec so i can log and tune instead of blindly throwing ever increasing amounts of water in?
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