2.2 legacy or 2.5 sti short block

garret · 10-11-2003, 03:04 PM

hey i was just wondering your imput on what short block i should use to run for high boost in my 99 25 rs instead of rods and pistons on my stock block. im just wondering what block i should run and what kind of prices any of you have receive.

thanx\
garrett

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8Complex · 10-11-2003, 03:42 PM

How high of boost? And with what turbo? More then likely, the EJ257, depending on your turbo size.

jeff22 · 10-11-2003, 04:29 PM

STI short block their shouldn't even be a question! unlimited power potential.

seven881 · 10-12-2003, 08:13 PM

I'll take a EJ22T over a EJ257 anyday.

subiekid · 10-12-2003, 08:37 PM

2.2T. then make it into a 2.4 stroker.

Andursun0013 · 10-12-2003, 10:26 PM

my question is why would you guys take a EJ257 over the EJ22T?? I'm undecided at this point - the extra .3 liters of displacement would be very nice but I like the looks of the 2.2 block a little more (seems more stable for boost).

on a bit of a side note...is the EJ22T block aluminum??? I'm pretty sure the EJ257 is

Kyle

seven881 · 10-12-2003, 11:00 PM

EJ22T Info:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=325790
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=352136

Search for EJ257 and you should find the I-speed threads and others threads about it.

8Complex · 10-13-2003, 04:47 AM

In the end, it depends on what you want to do, not which motor is better. Keep in mind that even if money isn't an object, the EJ22T is still low-pressure cast and has the smaller crank journals, thrust bearing in the middle of the crank, and it has different (possibly worse) laid out oil passages internally. It does have the piston oil squirters and a near-closed deck, though.

totoherbs · 10-13-2003, 08:14 PM

I like the ej22 and i-speeds blocks are useing a phase 2 crank...

I like that idea... I wonder if they have a 2.2L that would have it.

MY99 2.5GT · 10-14-2003, 08:50 AM

8 - You act like medium and low pressure casting is a bad thing? Medium pressure casting is worlds better then the high pressure casting methods that the STI and all other current subaru blocks are manufactured by. Medium pressure casting allows the metal molecules to cool slower and stay much more dense because of the decreased pressure and heat used during casting. High pressure casting causes the metal to greatly expand alllowing air bubbles into the casting. With medium pressure you have much densor stronger metal.

Two Words: Piston Squirters

jeff22 · 10-14-2003, 09:04 AM

Yea the ej257 block is junk that is why they are using it in all the new reliable high hp sti cars? I would rather take a 15 year old design than buy a 1 year old design and start with that?
Plus the ej22t with less displacement(?) will make more top end power rather than using the ej257 and gaining a butt load more torque and power. I have already decided!

Wedge · 10-14-2003, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jeff22
Yea the ej257 block is junk that is why they are using it in all the new reliable high hp sti cars? I would rather take a 15 year old design than buy a 1 year old design and start with that?
Plus the ej22t with less displacement(?) will make more top end power rather than using the ej257 and gaining a butt load more torque and power. I have already decided!

Will Tony Rigoli use an EJ257 on future cars?? STAY TUNED TO FIND OUT!

I'd rather go with something that has been PROVEN to work, than with something new. Oh, wait.......I did already!

Graham · 10-14-2003, 10:45 AM

Vic, I just recieved my 2.5Lsets STi block.

You know what this means; you and I are now in a race to see who can make the most power!

Graham

Wedge · 10-14-2003, 11:34 AM

Awesome Graham!
Gonna send you a PM now!

jeff22 · 10-14-2003, 02:29 PM

Graham what about me I want a race to see who has more power!! Check this out www.ffteng.com

Graham · 10-14-2003, 06:02 PM

Jeff, you are cordially invited friend! Although, you have already posted some great numbers. I won't know mine until early November. I can tell you my setup though, so you can wait in anticipation

:

Stock USDM STi block
Stock heads/stiffer valve springs
MRT FMIC
T3/T04S turbo
Link Plus
Big Injectors (don't know what sizw yet)

I know right off the bat my biggest restriction is going to be the tranny. Once we start tuning on the dyno and *if* I get 300 WHP, I might just call it quits until I can get new gears. But, then again, I might be anxious and say 'keep on going'!

Your car is fast man! 12.4, thats damn good. I can't remember but you are on the stock tranny right?

Also, what clutch are you using? I am on an ACT street setup right now, and I don't think it is going to hold, but I'm not sure. It says its good for 302 HP (not wheel), and I plan on going beyond that. Think it will hold?

What size injectors do you have? Turbo?

Graham

AntonioS · 10-14-2003, 08:12 PM

It is very cheaper to buy JE pistons 8.5:1 and rings for 490$$ and with all stock internals besides pistons you can run up to 25 or more psi of boost. Thats what I did in my engine and I have 155psi of compression in each cilinder and JE holds lots of power much more that stock ej257 and ej22t

Graham · 10-14-2003, 08:14 PM

You won't be running that much boost with the stock rods man, I can guarantee you that. Yah, $490, then factor in close to another $1500 to have them installed, and your motor still isn't bullet proof.

Graham

AntonioS · 10-14-2003, 11:06 PM

Rods are very similar in durability to the wrx ej20 and I'm running now 25psi and they hold pretty well. I did all my engine work so I saved the labor cost but If he buys a ej257 or ej22t he will have to pay the labor cost for installation.

Graham · 10-14-2003, 11:32 PM

What kind of turbo are you running to sustain 25 psi? It better be big, thats for sure.

I will be interested to see how well your engine holds up with this much boost. However, I disagree with you in the fact that the stock EJ25 rods are comprable to EJ20 (USDM) rods. Most speculated that the stock EJ25 rods would begin to break around 320 or so crank HP, as they are cast units, and not very strong. I have seen stock WRX rods take up to 400 crank HP and beyond. So when you hit numbers around there, and your stock rods are still intact, let us know.

Graham

AntonioS · 10-15-2003, 12:56 AM

I'm probably more than 400 hp at the crank but can't say with security cause in Puerto Rico we don't have awd dyno. The ej257 isn't that great it will hold the same boost that the ej20 cause it uses the same materials to construct the internals. Also the difference in the rods its the stroke. EJ25 engines have a crappy pistons but with son forged low compression pistons you are done

Graham · 10-15-2003, 02:04 AM

Alright then, have fun with it, while it lasts....

Graham

8Complex · 10-15-2003, 04:34 AM

I'll tell you right now... at 25psi and a fully open deck, you're going to run into cylinder wall stretching pretty fast.

But, if you're only putting 400hp to the crank on a 2.5 while running 25psi, you're running pretty conservatively anyway, so you may be a little safer. You should get a Road Dyno and see what type of power you're actually producing. You can do it on the normal roads and all you need to know can come from weather.com and finding out your current altitude.

jeff22 · 10-15-2003, 07:50 AM

Graham: Stock trans with the act street strip clutch. w/ only 13 psi of boost! I am hoping the clutch will go befor the trans.

leondal · 10-15-2003, 10:06 AM

Where does one get an STi short block?

Also, where can one get some more sturdy head gaskets. These stock ones are *****.

10-11-2003, 03:04 PM	#1
garret Scooby Newbie Member#: 43387 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: oswego il	2.2 legacy or 2.5 sti short block hey i was just wondering your imput on what short block i should use to run for high boost in my 99 25 rs instead of rods and pistons on my stock block. im just wondering what block i should run and what kind of prices any of you have receive. thanx\ garrett * Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

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10-11-2003, 03:42 PM	#2
8Complex Moderator Member#: 922 Join Date: Feb 2000 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Schaumburg, IL Vehicle: 04 FXT Red	How high of boost? And with what turbo? More then likely, the EJ257, depending on your turbo size.

10-11-2003, 04:29 PM	#3
jeff22 Scooby Newbie Member#: 7534 Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: manchester, NH Vehicle: 99 impreza rs-t rally blue pearl	STI short block their shouldn't even be a question! unlimited power potential.

10-12-2003, 08:13 PM	#4
seven881 Scooby Specialist Member#: 8828 Join Date: Jul 2001 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: K-Town Vehicle: 01 BRP 2.2T Hybrid 10 VW Grocery Getter	I'll take a EJ22T over a EJ257 anyday.

10-12-2003, 08:37 PM	#5
subiekid Scooby Guru Member#: 25516 Join Date: Oct 2002 Chapter/Region: NWIC Location: Send help, stuck in internet! Vehicle: 1995 Legacy TURBO!!! EJ22T/TEC3 & 06 MCS	2.2T. then make it into a 2.4 stroker.

10-12-2003, 10:26 PM	#6
Andursun0013 Scooby Specialist Member#: 11616 Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Coweta, OK Vehicle: 1998 2.35RS-T 2006 Baja 2007 Leg. Wagon	my question is why would you guys take a EJ257 over the EJ22T?? I'm undecided at this point - the extra .3 liters of displacement would be very nice but I like the looks of the 2.2 block a little more (seems more stable for boost). on a bit of a side note...is the EJ22T block aluminum??? I'm pretty sure the EJ257 is Kyle

10-12-2003, 11:00 PM	#7
seven881 Scooby Specialist Member#: 8828 Join Date: Jul 2001 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: K-Town Vehicle: 01 BRP 2.2T Hybrid 10 VW Grocery Getter	EJ22T Info: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=325790 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=352136 Search for EJ257 and you should find the I-speed threads and others threads about it.

10-13-2003, 04:47 AM	#8
8Complex Moderator Member#: 922 Join Date: Feb 2000 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Schaumburg, IL Vehicle: 04 FXT Red	In the end, it depends on what you want to do, not which motor is better. Keep in mind that even if money isn't an object, the EJ22T is still low-pressure cast and has the smaller crank journals, thrust bearing in the middle of the crank, and it has different (possibly worse) laid out oil passages internally. It does have the piston oil squirters and a near-closed deck, though.

10-13-2003, 08:14 PM	#9
totoherbs Scooby Guru Member#: 7321 Join Date: Jun 2001 Chapter/Region: NESIC Location: waltham, ma Vehicle: .... 122 IggPoints Work... ahhh... so tired.	I like the ej22 and i-speeds blocks are useing a phase 2 crank... I like that idea... I wonder if they have a 2.2L that would have it.

10-14-2003, 08:50 AM	#10
MY99 2.5GT Scooby Specialist Member#: 5030 Join Date: Mar 2001 Chapter/Region: MAIC Location: Martinsburg, WV, USA Vehicle: 1999 Legacy 2.5GT 05 Legacy GT 06 Armada	8 - You act like medium and low pressure casting is a bad thing? Medium pressure casting is worlds better then the high pressure casting methods that the STI and all other current subaru blocks are manufactured by. Medium pressure casting allows the metal molecules to cool slower and stay much more dense because of the decreased pressure and heat used during casting. High pressure casting causes the metal to greatly expand alllowing air bubbles into the casting. With medium pressure you have much densor stronger metal. Two Words: Piston Squirters

10-14-2003, 09:04 AM	#11
jeff22 Scooby Newbie Member#: 7534 Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: manchester, NH Vehicle: 99 impreza rs-t rally blue pearl	Yea the ej257 block is junk that is why they are using it in all the new reliable high hp sti cars? I would rather take a 15 year old design than buy a 1 year old design and start with that? Plus the ej22t with less displacement(?) will make more top end power rather than using the ej257 and gaining a butt load more torque and power. I have already decided!

10-14-2003, 10:45 AM	#13
Graham Scooby Specialist Member#: 11931 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL/ SMU @ Dallas, Vehicle: 2001 2.5 RS Turbo 257/FMIC/T3-T04S	Vic, I just recieved my 2.5Lsets STi block. You know what this means; you and I are now in a race to see who can make the most power! Graham

10-14-2003, 11:34 AM	#14
Wedge Scooby Specialist Member#: 2279 Join Date: Sep 2000 Chapter/Region: South East Location: The MIA Vehicle: 2000 Slingshot/99RS Pastelito Racing / SFSOC	Awesome Graham! Gonna send you a PM now!

10-14-2003, 02:29 PM	#15
jeff22 Scooby Newbie Member#: 7534 Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: manchester, NH Vehicle: 99 impreza rs-t rally blue pearl	Graham what about me I want a race to see who has more power!! Check this out www.ffteng.com

10-14-2003, 06:02 PM	#16
Graham Scooby Specialist Member#: 11931 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL/ SMU @ Dallas, Vehicle: 2001 2.5 RS Turbo 257/FMIC/T3-T04S	Jeff, you are cordially invited friend! Although, you have already posted some great numbers. I won't know mine until early November. I can tell you my setup though, so you can wait in anticipation : Stock USDM STi block Stock heads/stiffer valve springs MRT FMIC T3/T04S turbo Link Plus Big Injectors (don't know what sizw yet) I know right off the bat my biggest restriction is going to be the tranny. Once we start tuning on the dyno and if I get 300 WHP, I might just call it quits until I can get new gears. But, then again, I might be anxious and say 'keep on going'! Your car is fast man! 12.4, thats damn good. I can't remember but you are on the stock tranny right? Also, what clutch are you using? I am on an ACT street setup right now, and I don't think it is going to hold, but I'm not sure. It says its good for 302 HP (not wheel), and I plan on going beyond that. Think it will hold? What size injectors do you have? Turbo? Graham

10-14-2003, 08:12 PM	#17
AntonioS Scooby Newbie Member#: 23233 Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Puerto Rico Vehicle: 2000 2.5RS-T white	It is very cheaper to buy JE pistons 8.5:1 and rings for 490$$ and with all stock internals besides pistons you can run up to 25 or more psi of boost. Thats what I did in my engine and I have 155psi of compression in each cilinder and JE holds lots of power much more that stock ej257 and ej22t

10-14-2003, 08:14 PM	#18
Graham Scooby Specialist Member#: 11931 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL/ SMU @ Dallas, Vehicle: 2001 2.5 RS Turbo 257/FMIC/T3-T04S	You won't be running that much boost with the stock rods man, I can guarantee you that. Yah, $490, then factor in close to another $1500 to have them installed, and your motor still isn't bullet proof. Graham

10-14-2003, 11:06 PM	#19
AntonioS Scooby Newbie Member#: 23233 Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Puerto Rico Vehicle: 2000 2.5RS-T white	Rods are very similar in durability to the wrx ej20 and I'm running now 25psi and they hold pretty well. I did all my engine work so I saved the labor cost but If he buys a ej257 or ej22t he will have to pay the labor cost for installation.

10-14-2003, 11:32 PM	#20
Graham Scooby Specialist Member#: 11931 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL/ SMU @ Dallas, Vehicle: 2001 2.5 RS Turbo 257/FMIC/T3-T04S	What kind of turbo are you running to sustain 25 psi? It better be big, thats for sure. I will be interested to see how well your engine holds up with this much boost. However, I disagree with you in the fact that the stock EJ25 rods are comprable to EJ20 (USDM) rods. Most speculated that the stock EJ25 rods would begin to break around 320 or so crank HP, as they are cast units, and not very strong. I have seen stock WRX rods take up to 400 crank HP and beyond. So when you hit numbers around there, and your stock rods are still intact, let us know. Graham

10-15-2003, 12:56 AM	#21
AntonioS Scooby Newbie Member#: 23233 Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Puerto Rico Vehicle: 2000 2.5RS-T white	I'm probably more than 400 hp at the crank but can't say with security cause in Puerto Rico we don't have awd dyno. The ej257 isn't that great it will hold the same boost that the ej20 cause it uses the same materials to construct the internals. Also the difference in the rods its the stroke. EJ25 engines have a crappy pistons but with son forged low compression pistons you are done

10-15-2003, 02:04 AM	#22
Graham Scooby Specialist Member#: 11931 Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Winter Park, FL/ SMU @ Dallas, Vehicle: 2001 2.5 RS Turbo 257/FMIC/T3-T04S	Alright then, have fun with it, while it lasts.... Graham

10-15-2003, 04:34 AM	#23
8Complex Moderator Member#: 922 Join Date: Feb 2000 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Schaumburg, IL Vehicle: 04 FXT Red	I'll tell you right now... at 25psi and a fully open deck, you're going to run into cylinder wall stretching pretty fast. But, if you're only putting 400hp to the crank on a 2.5 while running 25psi, you're running pretty conservatively anyway, so you may be a little safer. You should get a Road Dyno and see what type of power you're actually producing. You can do it on the normal roads and all you need to know can come from weather.com and finding out your current altitude.

10-15-2003, 07:50 AM	#24
jeff22 Scooby Newbie Member#: 7534 Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: manchester, NH Vehicle: 99 impreza rs-t rally blue pearl	Graham: Stock trans with the act street strip clutch. w/ only 13 psi of boost! I am hoping the clutch will go befor the trans.

10-15-2003, 10:06 AM	#25
leondal Scooby Newbie Member#: 43114 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Pownal, VT Vehicle: 1998 Legacy GT Turbo Green	Where does one get an STi short block? Also, where can one get some more sturdy head gaskets. These stock ones are *****.